Jordan RC grade - don't understand surface sub
fsh403
Posts: 13 ✭
I don't understand why my 86 Fleer Jordan #57 shown in the attached scan received a 8.5 sub for surface. Does anyone know why this could be? Note that the white dot on the blue border on the left side of the card isn't on the card -- it's a speck of dust or something that's on the plastic sleeve inside the holder. I also think the card should have received a 10 for corners and centering, and probably a 9.5 for edges. The card just looks grossly undergraded to me as it looks pristine. I was also wondering if anyone has experience sending in 86 Fleer Jordan #57s for review/regrading with any success; I don't really feel like cracking it to resubmit, but I will if the consensus is that it makes a difference. Any ideas would be much appreciated. Thanks.
Comments
It's hard to analyze some surface issues with only scans, many potential issues are only observable from certain angles and/or lighting conditions.
Here's some photos. There as a couple of small redish specs on the back border, and upon zooming in, I guess there is also some microscopic blackish grime of some sort on the back that you can't see with the naked eye (which might come off if I wipe it with a microfiber cloth I suppose); but is this the kind of thing that brings the card down to an 8.5 surface sub? I've seen cards with far worse surface issues on the back receive 10s from psa and 9.5 surface subs from BGS.....
assuming it is the "snow" extending from his armpit/jersey all the way under net of the basket...
Interesting. Some of that was dust on the holder that I just wiped off. See attached photo I just took without the dust. But yes you're right there is a little bit of that on the left side. Seems harshly graded for those few dashes of snow to result in a 1.5pt drop on surface sub. Oh well
card is a blazer regardless....
It looks like the black ink surrounding the yellow inner border on the front has bleed into the yellow in places (look to the left below his name). My PSA 9 Jordan RCs don't have that bleed, so I would guess that contributed to why you got an 8.5 surface grade.
Thanks,
Robb
Actually I just knocked the card down a bit in the holder, and the "snow" moved up on the card, so those marks (like the white mark on the blue border) aren't on the card either - they're on the sleeve inside of the holder. The bleeding into into the yellow border might be it; I hadn't seen that.
9 is a solid grade on a tough card. Are you new to grading cards or are you an experienced submitter? I know you were probably gearing up for a mid six figure windfall when you sent this off if you’ve been watching the PSA 10 sales, that being said there is a reason they are so high that’s because it is a difficult card to Gem.
I think a crack and re-sub is your only chance at a 9.5 or 10, but I would not Bank on it. You can never bank on 9.5-10 being the outcome of submitting any card.
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
What a beautiful card. As Ahmanfan said directly above, any attempt to cross or resub is a massive gamble. BGS 9 is excellent. If you are sure it is a 9.5, go for it, but so many things can go wrong.
Congrats on owning that Jordan!
white dots between ball and Fleer on the front. and white line after fleer on right edge.. My guess. Also more white dots past his belly going in the middle of the card. White dots.
Thanks guys. The reason I'm disappointed with this grade is because I also own a BGS 9.5 of the same card and this example is head and shoulders nicer. The corners and centering are pristine. I might crack it and send it to PSA to see what happens because they might not be as finicky about the surface. It doesn't matter to me if they give it a 3 because I love the card; I just think this one has a shot at a 10 and I'd love to own a 10.
The white dots aren't on the card. They're on the sleeve. BGS apparently decided to use the dirtiest sleeve they could find to put this card into
I don't think you will get a 10 from PSA. Your edges show wear (especially the blue part) and that is one of the biggest difference I found over the years between PSA giving a 9 vs a 10 on 86 Fleer cards. All the 10s I have gotten had perfectly clean blue edges. Who knows though, I am sure if you look you will find PSA 10 Jordan RCs with a little edge wear but if I were subbing your card I would expect a 9 every time.
Robb
You're probably right. I might still give it a shot though, which at the very least will allow me to get it out of this dirty sleeve
If you think there may be any possible surface issues that might be improvable (like fingerprints), you can wipe down with a microfiber cloth. But that can be kind of nerve wracking on a really nice card, don't want to catch a corner or edge with the cloth and cause any issues that don't already exist. But don't know how likely it is that your surface will go from 8.5 to a 10-caliber card on a straight crack and submit without having some issue that could be improved.
I just don't think the surface is an 8.5 as is; the white stuff isn't on the card, so it appears it's really just that bleeding issue (which obviously isn't improvable), which seems relatively minor. And in my experience PSA doesn't put 25% of its stock on the "surface" condition of a card in assigning a grade like BGS does
Fergie23, what do you think the chances are of this one crossing to a psa 10?
In that case I would thank my good fortune that my lesser copy is going to sell for an exorbitantly higher amount of money than my better copy and I would sell the 9.5 and keep the 9, and go out and celebrate over beers 🥳
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
Michaels face and arm looks more gray and less clear than the 9.5. I think the surface and image is off a little.
Look at Chicago letters in jersey
Compare the 2 cards you will see
In my experience low surface grades on Beckett graded cards "could" be due to the card being sheet cut. Your mileage may vary.