I whet my whistle on a bunch of different things because I don't know what is going to explode. So I did that with Bitcoin and I'm very happy I did! I'm not rich because of it but I didn't lose out either. If and when it ever starts it's downfall then I will cash out.
I more than whet my whistle with coins because to me it's my hobby. I don't invest in coins but I know I am not totally losing my money when I purchase a nice coin either. I treat my collection as an asset. I am quietly assembling one of the finest circulated US type coin collections in the world. Over time I expect it to increase in value as a whole but only by maybe 1-2% per year if I hold it for a long time.
I tried the stock market twice in the 1990's -got clobbered big time both times. At least with coins there is always face and bullion value if all collectors disappear. I never lost a cent on good coins. Yes, I could have made millions on the stock market, "IF" I had bought the right stocks. "IF", is mighty big word sometimes. Hindsight is always 20-20. Good rare coins in the long run always go up in value.
@Gazes said:
There are 100 threads that say dont buy coins as an investment because the s & p 500 always out performs coins (the 500 index is always used as opposed to individual stocks like sears, enron, athome, kodak or even indexes like the dow, etc---awww the joy of giving advice in hindsight). Yes they say that you can make money on your coins but would do far better with the index. Do we need a new thread that says never buy the s & p 500 (except as a hobby) because bitcoin always out performs the index? The new thread would say something like Yes you can make money on the index but you would have made far more on bitcoin.
This is tounge and cheek but shows the danger of using hindsight as proving a point. And it is a fact that someone buying bitcoin 5 years ago would crush the s & p 500.
Only if them sold their Bitcoins. Paper gains mean nothing. And Bitcoin only has a track history of 10+ years. Ya, right.
99% of the coins being sold in a dealer's cases will not gain any profits. Probably the same odds in the stock market if you take out the FANGS.
@rec78 said:
I tried the stock market twice in the 1990's -got clobbered big time both times. At least with coins there is always face and bullion value if all collectors disappear. I never lost a cent on good coins. Yes, I could have made millions on the stock market, "IF" I had bought the right stocks. "IF", is mighty big word sometimes. Hindsight is always 20-20. Good rare coins in the long run always go up in value.
You don't have to buy the right stocks. You just need index funds and time.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@skier07 said:
I have a lot of acquaintances that went broke trading cryptocurrencies. They bought when it was at a then record high 3-4 years ago and watched BTC lose 2/3 of its value. It’s easy to be a Monday morning quarterback.
@Gazes said:
There are 100 threads that say dont buy coins as an investment because the s & p 500 always out performs coins (the 500 index is always used as opposed to individual stocks like sears, enron, athome, kodak or even indexes like the dow, etc---awww the joy of giving advice in hindsight). Yes they say that you can make money on your coins but would do far better with the index. Do we need a new thread that says never buy the s & p 500 (except as a hobby) because bitcoin always out performs the index? The new thread would say something like Yes you can make money on the index but you would have made far more on bitcoin.
This is tounge and cheek but shows the danger of using hindsight as proving a point. And it is a fact that someone buying bitcoin 5 years ago would crush the s & p 500.
Only if them sold their Bitcoins. Paper gains mean nothing. And Bitcoin only has a track history of 10+ years. Ya, right.
99% of the coins being sold in a dealer's cases will not gain any profits. Probably the same odds in the stock market if you take out the FANGS.
Really? With bitcoin at $55,000 now and it was $3000 a year ago----you dont think alot of people have taken profits?
Coin collecting has been a long time hobby for me and I have stated before that I don't consider the coins I own as an
investment. I tend to have a 7-12 year holding period for the really rare coins I own..
I want to sell all coins while I am still alive. That will be fun to watch.
No legacy giving with special instructions to hold or sell later.
However, I do have alot of money spent on coins that I still own. Would I like to make a profit or break-even when the time to come to sell .......sure.
What I like about collecting foreign coins is there are opportunities to collect something the rest of the world might want to buy as well..
For example, I believe there are special coins that come to auction infrequently....that have been off the market for a decade or more . I am thinking of world silver crowns like the recent:
Also, I like to follow what the Chinese are buying. British trade dollars and cap & rays 8 reales which circulated heavily in China have been going up in value. I think the chinese collector are bidding those up.
So are there opportunities to buy coins and make money when resold ....I think the answer to that question is yes.
I manage money. I earn money. I save money . I give away money. I collect money. I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
@Cougar1978 said:
When looking at RCI trend I go by the PCGS 3000. I don’t believe it would match up well with the S&P 500.
A better question - why people have any substantial investment in coins period?
Of course there will be wealthy coin collectors like those who collect classic cars, sugar babies etc
I think its pretty obvious that someone looking to make money in coins should not buy the pcgs 3000. Coins are not really suited for an index. Looking for truely rare coins at a smart value with expert help to ensure quality would seem to be a better a route. Much harder than buying the pcgs 3000 blindly but most things worthwhile are more difficult.
@Gazes said:
There are 100 threads that say dont buy coins as an investment because the s & p 500 always out performs coins (the 500 index is always used as opposed to individual stocks like sears, enron, athome, kodak or even indexes like the dow, etc---awww the joy of giving advice in hindsight). Yes they say that you can make money on your coins but would do far better with the index. Do we need a new thread that says never buy the s & p 500 (except as a hobby) because bitcoin always out performs the index? The new thread would say something like Yes you can make money on the index but you would have made far more on bitcoin.
This is tounge and cheek but shows the danger of using hindsight as proving a point. And it is a fact that someone buying bitcoin 5 years ago would crush the s & p 500.
Only if them sold their Bitcoins. Paper gains mean nothing. And Bitcoin only has a track history of 10+ years. Ya, right.
99% of the coins being sold in a dealer's cases will not gain any profits. Probably the same odds in the stock market if you take out the FANGS.
Really? With bitcoin at $55,000 now and it was $3000 a year ago----you dont think alot of people have taken profits?
Some, but most are waiting for $100K. And it isn't as easy to sell/spend Bitcoins as it sounds.
It is obvious that anyone that purchases Bitcoins is not an athiest. They own something that they can't see, can't touch, can't feel, but supposedly exists.
@Gazes said:
There are 100 threads that say dont buy coins as an investment because the s & p 500 always out performs coins (the 500 index is always used as opposed to individual stocks like sears, enron, athome, kodak or even indexes like the dow, etc---awww the joy of giving advice in hindsight). Yes they say that you can make money on your coins but would do far better with the index. Do we need a new thread that says never buy the s & p 500 (except as a hobby) because bitcoin always out performs the index? The new thread would say something like Yes you can make money on the index but you would have made far more on bitcoin.
This is tounge and cheek but shows the danger of using hindsight as proving a point. And it is a fact that someone buying bitcoin 5 years ago would crush the s & p 500.
Only if them sold their Bitcoins. Paper gains mean nothing. And Bitcoin only has a track history of 10+ years. Ya, right.
99% of the coins being sold in a dealer's cases will not gain any profits. Probably the same odds in the stock market if you take out the FANGS.
Really? With bitcoin at $55,000 now and it was $3000 a year ago----you dont think alot of people have taken profits?
Some, but most are waiting for $100K. And it isn't as easy to sell/spend Bitcoins as it sounds.
It is obvious that anyone that purchases Bitcoins is not an athiest. They own something that they can't see, can't touch, can't feel, but supposedly exists.
Its pretty easy to buy and sell bitcoin. You can go on paypal right now and buy whatever you want and sell it on PayPal whenever you want
@Gazes said:
There are 100 threads that say dont buy coins as an investment because the s & p 500 always out performs coins (the 500 index is always used as opposed to individual stocks like sears, enron, athome, kodak or even indexes like the dow, etc---awww the joy of giving advice in hindsight). Yes they say that you can make money on your coins but would do far better with the index. Do we need a new thread that says never buy the s & p 500 (except as a hobby) because bitcoin always out performs the index? The new thread would say something like Yes you can make money on the index but you would have made far more on bitcoin.
This is tounge and cheek but shows the danger of using hindsight as proving a point. And it is a fact that someone buying bitcoin 5 years ago would crush the s & p 500.
Only if them sold their Bitcoins. Paper gains mean nothing. And Bitcoin only has a track history of 10+ years. Ya, right.
99% of the coins being sold in a dealer's cases will not gain any profits. Probably the same odds in the stock market if you take out the FANGS.
Really? With bitcoin at $55,000 now and it was $3000 a year ago----you dont think alot of people have taken profits?
Some, but most are waiting for $100K. And it isn't as easy to sell/spend Bitcoins as it sounds.
It is obvious that anyone that purchases Bitcoins is not an athiest. They own something that they can't see, can't touch, can't feel, but supposedly exists.
Its pretty easy to buy and sell bitcoin. You can go on paypal right now and buy whatever you want and sell it on PayPal whenever you want
I'd rather have something that didn't destroy natural resourses. Bitcoin now uses as much energy each year as Chile. Not an economically feasible state for something with no physical presence. It has already split 3X.
@Cougar1978 said:
When looking at RCI trend I go by the PCGS 3000. I don’t believe it would match up well with the S&P 500.
A better question - why people have any substantial investment in coins period?
Of course there will be wealthy coin collectors like those who collect classic cars, sugar babies etc
I think its pretty obvious that someone looking to make money in coins should not buy the pcgs 3000. Coins are not really suited for an index. Looking for truely rare coins at a smart value with expert help to ensure quality would seem to be a better a route. Much harder than buying the pcgs 3000 blindly but most things worthwhile are more difficult.
But this gets back to the "cherry-picking" aspect of things. Like stocks, are the winners good or lucky? What percentage of people actually "win" when picking coins? After all, 90% people fail at picking individual stocks.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@jmlanzaf said:
What percentage of people actually "win" when picking coins?
How many threads do you see posted here by people who say they made a mint when they sold their collection vs. those who say the auction house made more than they did? And a lot of the people who post here are not exactly newbies.
@jmlanzaf said:
What percentage of people actually "win" when picking coins?
How many threads do you see posted here by people who say they made a mint when they sold their collection vs. those who say the auction house made more than they did? And a lot of the people who post here are not exactly newbies.
I don't see a lot of threads with much in the way of accounting either way. But a lot of the people here seem to either fall into the "never sold a coin" camp or the "constant churn" camp. I don't think I've ever seen anyone sell a 40 or 50 year old collection and account for their annual return on investment.
But, as you imply, I suspect most people do not "win". The thing about "winning" is that you have to choose coins based on pure reason with no thought to personal preference. Who does that ?
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@jmlanzaf said:
I don't see a lot of threads with much in the way of accounting either way.
I probably didn't ask the right question. What I was getting at was all the posts I see here grousing about bidders fees and how bidding high enough to win leaves the bidder buried in the coin. If coins were a good investment, wouldn't there be some winners, too?
Picking one collector with a unique opportunity (Pittman) and generalizing from that about coins as an investment class is like picking one unique stock (e.g., Tesla) and generalizing about all stocks.
In principle stocks represent companies which produce goods and services, create value, and increase in price. So, on average over a long term they are solid investments. Coins are just objects that rise with inflation and fluctuate with supply and demand.
Comments
I whet my whistle on a bunch of different things because I don't know what is going to explode. So I did that with Bitcoin and I'm very happy I did! I'm not rich because of it but I didn't lose out either. If and when it ever starts it's downfall then I will cash out.
I more than whet my whistle with coins because to me it's my hobby. I don't invest in coins but I know I am not totally losing my money when I purchase a nice coin either. I treat my collection as an asset. I am quietly assembling one of the finest circulated US type coin collections in the world. Over time I expect it to increase in value as a whole but only by maybe 1-2% per year if I hold it for a long time.
I tried the stock market twice in the 1990's -got clobbered big time both times. At least with coins there is always face and bullion value if all collectors disappear. I never lost a cent on good coins. Yes, I could have made millions on the stock market, "IF" I had bought the right stocks. "IF", is mighty big word sometimes. Hindsight is always 20-20. Good rare coins in the long run always go up in value.
I ask you this:
would you like to make an easy 50,000?
just invest 100,000 in coins....and wait a few months...
When looking at RCI trend I go by the PCGS 3000. I don’t believe it would match up well with the S&P 500.
A better question - why people have any substantial investment in coins period?
Of course there will be wealthy coin collectors like those who collect classic cars, sugar babies etc.
Only if them sold their Bitcoins. Paper gains mean nothing. And Bitcoin only has a track history of 10+ years. Ya, right.
99% of the coins being sold in a dealer's cases will not gain any profits. Probably the same odds in the stock market if you take out the FANGS.
You don't have to buy the right stocks. You just need index funds and time.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
WOW, you need some new acquaintances!
Really? With bitcoin at $55,000 now and it was $3000 a year ago----you dont think alot of people have taken profits?
Coin collecting has been a long time hobby for me and I have stated before that I don't consider the coins I own as an
investment. I tend to have a 7-12 year holding period for the really rare coins I own..
I want to sell all coins while I am still alive. That will be fun to watch.
No legacy giving with special instructions to hold or sell later.
However, I do have alot of money spent on coins that I still own. Would I like to make a profit or break-even when the time to come to sell .......sure.
What I like about collecting foreign coins is there are opportunities to collect something the rest of the world might want to buy as well..
For example, I believe there are special coins that come to auction infrequently....that have been off the market for a decade or more . I am thinking of world silver crowns like the recent:
https://coinweek.com/auctions-news/extraordinary-selections-in-heritage-nyinc-world-and-ancient-coins-auction/
Also, I like to follow what the Chinese are buying. British trade dollars and cap & rays 8 reales which circulated heavily in China have been going up in value. I think the chinese collector are bidding those up.
So are there opportunities to buy coins and make money when resold ....I think the answer to that question is yes.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
I think its pretty obvious that someone looking to make money in coins should not buy the pcgs 3000. Coins are not really suited for an index. Looking for truely rare coins at a smart value with expert help to ensure quality would seem to be a better a route. Much harder than buying the pcgs 3000 blindly but most things worthwhile are more difficult.
Some, but most are waiting for $100K. And it isn't as easy to sell/spend Bitcoins as it sounds.
It is obvious that anyone that purchases Bitcoins is not an athiest. They own something that they can't see, can't touch, can't feel, but supposedly exists.
Its pretty easy to buy and sell bitcoin. You can go on paypal right now and buy whatever you want and sell it on PayPal whenever you want
I'd rather have something that didn't destroy natural resourses. Bitcoin now uses as much energy each year as Chile. Not an economically feasible state for something with no physical presence. It has already split 3X.
But this gets back to the "cherry-picking" aspect of things. Like stocks, are the winners good or lucky? What percentage of people actually "win" when picking coins? After all, 90% people fail at picking individual stocks.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
How many threads do you see posted here by people who say they made a mint when they sold their collection vs. those who say the auction house made more than they did? And a lot of the people who post here are not exactly newbies.
I don't see a lot of threads with much in the way of accounting either way. But a lot of the people here seem to either fall into the "never sold a coin" camp or the "constant churn" camp. I don't think I've ever seen anyone sell a 40 or 50 year old collection and account for their annual return on investment.
But, as you imply, I suspect most people do not "win". The thing about "winning" is that you have to choose coins based on pure reason with no thought to personal preference. Who does that ?
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
I probably didn't ask the right question. What I was getting at was all the posts I see here grousing about bidders fees and how bidding high enough to win leaves the bidder buried in the coin. If coins were a good investment, wouldn't there be some winners, too?
Picking one collector with a unique opportunity (Pittman) and generalizing from that about coins as an investment class is like picking one unique stock (e.g., Tesla) and generalizing about all stocks.
In principle stocks represent companies which produce goods and services, create value, and increase in price. So, on average over a long term they are solid investments. Coins are just objects that rise with inflation and fluctuate with supply and demand.
LIBERTY SEATED DIMES WITH MAJOR VARIETIES CIRCULATION STRIKES (1837-1891) digital album