If you submit a counterstamped coin for grading, what is the grade based on?
Mizzou
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The counterstamp itself ? The distorted planchet that it's stamped on? Or a combination of both?
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Good question. I don't really know.
Should be both, actually.
I'm guessing the coin would be graded as if the counterstamp wasn't there and then the proper adjustment for the counterstamp comes later.
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It depends on the grading service. I believe PCGS takes the average grade of countermark and coin overall, and NGC lists both grades on the slab.
Gobrecht's Engraved Mature Head Large Cent Model
https://www.instagram.com/rexrarities/?hl=en
I've never seen an NGC slab with two grades---one for the coin and one for the countermark. Can someone post pics of an example of this?
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I've never seen an NGC slab with two grades
unless NGC has radically changed what they do, I can assure you that they don't put two grades on the insert. I have submitted c'stamped coins in the past, about 13 years ago, and they gave a single grade.
to that end, while I certainly can't speak for PCGS I can speak "with" logic. when I had c'stamped coins I was submitting I looked at the coin, took into account that it was stamped and made an overall assessment of the grade. no "two grade" thinking and then an average, just what does the grade of the coin seem to be.
It really depends on the coin being graded. The majority of C/S coins in slabs only have 1 grade, sometimes, with larger planchete coins (think Peru Sols or Peru 8R) they will have a grade for the coin and a separate grade for the CS.
This was graded recently, one grade only VG-08
Same with this older NGC
These two Peru coins are similar large silver coins in similar NGC generation slabs. One slab has one grade and one has two grades (one for coin and another for CS). I collect these and still have no clue when/how/why it is sometimes assigned 1 or 2 grades... thoughts?
@keets @PerryHall See the Guatemalan peso in the comment above. The coin is graded G4, and the counterstamp VG Standard. I think this may have been introduced in the last couple of years, but I’m not sure.
Gobrecht's Engraved Mature Head Large Cent Model
https://www.instagram.com/rexrarities/?hl=en
I already saw it but thanks for alerting me. I never saw an NGC slab with dual grades before this example.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I would think it would be PMD.
Definitely post mint. Damage sure, but a lot of people appreciate the history and significance of such marks.
I've never seen counterstamped coin graded with two individual grades either, but I guess that would be the best way to do it.
ShadyDave, those are some nice examples -
Wisdom has been chasing you but, you've always been faster
The counterstamp should receive the grade, not the substrate (host coin). I once owned the 1824 Washington-Lafayette medalet below, which was counterstamped on a Matron Head large cent (Brunk L-46). The cent had been almost completely filed down (on both sides) before the counterstamping was done. NGC graded it VF-30.
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The counterstamped coins above are not damaged. Counterstamping another country's coinage is how the issuing country dealt with manufacturing difficulties making it impractical to strike coins of their own by normal means.