You will likely learn far more about who the 'good' dealers are when you attempt to sell them coins that you bought from them. If you are specializing, you need to work with specialty dealers to get the coins you desire. You also need to find at least one dealer who will tell you 'NO' (i.e., do not buy that coin, even if it is in his inventory, because it isn't going to fit well in your collection).
Member: EAC, NBS, C4, CWTS, ANA
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
Find a mentor. Easier said then done but there are a lot of knowledgeable people here who would be more then happy to help you if you reached out to them.
Hang out on the boards. There’s a ton of free info here.
Go to a big show whenever they start and talk to the above mentioned dealers and find some who you might be comfortable working with.
Even if you have no interest in buying anything view as many coins as possible at the big auctions. Get a feel for the differences between the various grading services and look at CAC coins. Look at genuine coins and try to figure out why the coin didn’t straight grade.
I think what skier07 says makes alot of sense for you. If you are having trouble with dealers insist on CAC coins. This way you are atleast getting JA's approval on the quality of the coin and they are easier to sell. You still need to be careful about price but there are a ton of cac price guides now and also auction data. I think CAC is perfect for someone like yourself.
@PQueue said:
Warren Mills (personally) of Rare Coins of New Hampshire. Superb grader, highest integrity, 40+ years experience, honest as coin dealers get, great industry connections when you decide to Auction. Be prepared to be patient. Only a few on this board have ever spoken with him.
Totally agree with this suggestion. If you want a real education, take a road trip and visit him with your coins. You'll get instant feedback and will know what you're doing right and wrong. Worth the price in itself and will help you avoid future mistakes. Only warning is to make sure you have some thick skin. He doesn't sugar coat anything.
@keyman64 said:
Some good dealers have been mentioned here BUT you have to be your own best advocate and that takes time to research each and every item of interest.
Yes. And I might add there are some dealers already mentioned you have to be very careful of......even though some come highly recommended from this forum. Which I think is what the OP was getting at initially. If you start out with many of our major retailers you probably have one foot in the grave already. It's a mine field out there. And what appears to look good from the outside, may be just the opposite once you pop the hood. In the end, you are your best advocate. Dig deep and often to get at the truth of the coin business. You need more of a mentor than just another coin dealer to sell you coins. What part of the country are you in? A trip to see Warren or even JA will give you a quick gut check.
Don't settle. Buy when you know it's right....pass otherwise. Take a dealer's opinion with a grain of salt....pass if it conflicts with yours. Don't fill holes. Don't buy problem coins, no matter how discounted....if it bugs you at all today....it will really bug you down the road. If in doubt, pass, and wait. Another better deal almost always comes along unless your are collecting Continental dollars by die variety....lol. Don't worry if you can't buy a coin for months, or even a year. You want to be flush with cash when the right coin, major collection/auction or deal pops up. It's hard to be good on a broad spectrum of the US Coin market unless you're a dealer buying and selling on a daily basis. You will make lots of mistakes with big series like Type Coins, Commems, etc. Consider focusing more on one subset of those so you can be an expert taking advantage of 90-95% of the dealers.
Oh yeah....and the Red Book won't help you avoid traps and problems. Ideally, follow the coat tails of a seasoned pro like our Colonel Jessup learning everything you can. One of his quotes always sticks with me...."that coin doesn't suck." His typical reply to a nice coin.
Thank you for all the great feedback. Point VERY well made and taken to do more work myself and that is something. I am going to do. So even if I am not buying for 6 months I’m going to stay on this (and other) message boards. I go way back to the World Wide Coin days in 1970s Atlanta. I also did not mean to come across as not blessed to have a significant size collection but much of my recent time has been spent on Heritage auctions and they can make even someone lucky financially feel damn poor. In any case thanks again and I look forward to shows coming back and walking the bourse floors, have not done this in way too long and always found the fast majority of dealers to be great people who love the hobby.
First don't take a dealers word that a coin is going to upgrade and then be upset about it. The dealer is not in the grading room even if he/she is sincere and believes it should upgrade. Buy the coin you want to begin with. Second, if you want the best chance to hold value, buy only CAC coins.
Regarding dealers telling you a coin may upgrade---i once asked one of the dealers mentioned on this thread if a coin he was selling had the potential to upgrade. His response was "im a coin dealer---its not my practice to leave money on the table." Bottom line in most cases any knowledgeable dealer will upgrade a coin if he is so certain it will.
I have dealt with Harry Laibstain for years, Dave Kahn same thing (actually he's a good freind), The ReededEdge boys, Gary Adkins. There are some good coins that come up in auctions from time to time, such as GC, and stacksbowers, etc, but you really have to have a go to guy/gal that you trust to view a coin if you cant on your own. You have to fish thru all the retreads, duds, problem issues (that may or may not be described accurately).
If I was serious enough to want to bid on a sizeable coin, even though there are some great folks eye's I trust, there's no better viewer than myself. over the years, I have made a point to get it looked at.
Years ago, I was searching for a 1901-s Quarter upgrade because I only had a VG-10 at the time, there was an XF 40 that was coming up for auction. I actually flew down to dallas that morning, and back just to view the coin in hand. Was actually back at home like a normal work day and nobody even knew I had left and came back. Glad I did, because it was not what I had hoped. I would have not been happy spending 34K and receiving that. Years, Later I was able to get a nicer AU from one of the dealers I mentioned above and had built up enough repoir over the years with them to get it on approval.
In this market, you need a dealer that has access to "hidden coins". I'm talking about the kind of material that essentially disappears before it even hits the internet. Virtually all the great coins are locked up in collections. You want "A" material. Therefore, you need a dealer that has loyal clients, has dealt in great coins for many years, and buys those coins back, and then offers them quietly to their best clients. It just takes the hard work to locate those dealers, and those relationships only come through trust and time and persistence. This is the formula that all great Collectors over the years have generally utilized. Good luck.
Some of those great coins placed by great dealers with contacts....end up in auctions where the bulk of the collection is posted. There you have the same shot as all the other dealers and top collectors of competing for them. That was my primary source for great coins in the past. I couldn't trust most other dealers to send me great coins and "fair" prices. Supposedly a gem I needed was in inventory of one of the nations largest coin dealer back in the mid-1980's. A coin on my want list. A raw "gem" BU 1858-0 seated quarter at $3000. The coin was rushed to me. It turned out to be a cleaned AU worth around $400. Fortunately, I found the world's finest example of this date in a Superior Auction for around $4200....graded choice/gem BU. And it was. The real deal, no rub. That pop top coin is PCGS MS65 today.
When I did get to that point where I was "offered" great coins by top dealers early on day 1 at shows, they were more than often just taking shots at me. The coins weren't great even if the grade said otherwise. I recall being offered an Eliasberg MS66 no drapery quarter for around $38K...ogh at the time. Off the market for 5-6 yrs since Eliasberg. Problem for me was that the luster was dead on 1/4 of the reverse where it didn't get through the nearly black toning. A big problem on a MS66 coin imo. I passed....making the dealer not so happy. And eventually I got tired of being given 1st shots on not so "all there coins." That might work if you were Dave Akers buying for Pogue, or Bill Nagle buying for Gene Gardner, doesn't always work that great for the rest of us. Who was Joe Thomas' insider?
Eldorado9 is 100% correct, some of my best quality pieces, have come from contacts from dealers that I have done business with over the years in private transactions where it was offered to me, before offered publicly.
I learned of this years ago, I used to try to get into shows early bird, etc to find the coins I was after before the general public got in, but later learned after helping a national dealer friend (now retired) that even then sometimes it was too late. Many dealers scoured the floor or were offered coins from past clients, contacts, and they were whisked off and tucked away for their better clients, and the show crowd incl early birds never got a chance to see them.
@Sonorandesertrat said:
You will likely learn far more about who the 'good' dealers are when you attempt to sell them coins that you bought from them. If you are specializing, you need to work with specialty dealers to get the coins you desire. You also need to find at least one dealer who will tell you 'NO' (i.e., do not buy that coin, even if it is in his inventory, because it isn't going to fit well in your collection).
Read this one over again as it is a gem.
I don't think I ever had a top retail dealer ever tell me NO- don't buy that from our inventory......unless I asked them specific questions about rub, luster, and marks. And then the "truth" might come out. I recall one time when I tried to sell my very first local coin dealer (1975) some of her coins back to her. She outright told me she had never sold any of those to me. OK.....that was a quick end to our relationship. Another time around 2004 I tried to sell some coins back to one of the nation's top dealers at the ANA show. They "laughed" when asking if I had bought some of them from them (ie I did). They recognized them and knew they sort of sucked. Needless to say they made no attempts at offers....essentially ending our relationship. I can probably point out half a dozen times for different dealers where this has occurred. That's when you realize those guys usually have no interest in buying back the mistakes they sold you. Who wants mistakes back?
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Yes use eBay a bit...lots of good ideas, but without naming names one of the dealers mentioned sold me an 1867 proof rays 65 for 70,000, today it is worth maybe 35,000...thoughts?
I have sold several coins at a 50% loss and not one even came close to 35K, come to think of it, not even close to being in the same ballpark!
I have lost a couple of hundred dollars on several coins (selling them to a dealer), and than turned around and spent that same money on a coin or two that knew that I paid to much for (same dealer).
Wish I had your problem BAYOUBENGAL.
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Ok, full disclosure, I’m a life long collector. On again off again but at times have been active in $5-15k coins. All US. I am NOT looking to make money in coins, just tired of getting ripped off.
If you're looking for coin dealers to provide investment advice, you're doing it all wrong. Far better to figure out what you want and then find the dealers who can help you get it.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Ok, full disclosure, I’m a life long collector. On again off again but at times have been active in $5-15k coins. All US. I am NOT looking to make money in coins, just tired of getting ripped off
You should never place a huge amount of faith in a dealer's representation, about how great a coin is, if that dealer is trying to sell it to you.
You need to develop the knowledge needed to make your own decision independently, and then factor in the opinions of others. There is no real point in buying a collectible if you don't truly understand what you are buying. You have to be willing to put in the time needed to acquire the knowledge needed to do this. He who has the lesser knowledge usually gets the short end of the stick in a coin transaction.
Don't look for angelic dealers, look for knowledge.
Member: EAC, NBS, C4, CWTS, ANA
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Ok, full disclosure, I’m a life long collector. On again off again but at times have been active in $5-15k coins. All US. I am NOT looking to make money in coins, just tired of getting ripped off.
If you're looking for coin dealers to provide investment advice, you're doing it all wrong. Far better to figure out what you want and then find the dealers who can help you get it.
So coin dealers are a bad source for advice for investment?
My guess is that we should buy high from dealers and sell low to dealers......right?
I don't really know the percentage of "suspect" coin dealers that are out there, but just on my years of collecting I would say that it's probably 50/50.
OTOH, I do know quite a few dealers that I will deal with again.
@PQueue said:
Warren Mills (personally) of Rare Coins of New Hampshire. Superb grader, highest integrity, 40+ years experience, honest as coin dealers get, great industry connections when you decide to Auction. Be prepared to be patient. Only a few on this board have ever spoken with him.
That certainly won't be me. RCNH sold me a Barber half with graffiti carved into the eagle's chest once. They thought it was a perfectly fine coin but gave me a refund.
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Ok, full disclosure, I’m a life long collector. On again off again but at times have been active in $5-15k coins. All US. I am NOT looking to make money in coins, just tired of getting ripped off.
If you're looking for coin dealers to provide investment advice, you're doing it all wrong. Far better to figure out what you want and then find the dealers who can help you get it.
So coin dealers are a bad source for advice for investment?
Actually, they can be a great source for advice. Just not so much when they’re trying to sell you something.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I have never and will never push coins as an investment. I get asked this all the time. My canned response pretty much goes like this. Collecting coins is a great hobby and one of the few hobbies where you can get a good bit of your money back. A prudent collector can make money but there are no guarantees. Just about every series out there cycles up and down and become popular and then less popular.
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Ok, full disclosure, I’m a life long collector. On again off again but at times have been active in $5-15k coins. All US. I am NOT looking to make money in coins, just tired of getting ripped off.
If you're looking for coin dealers to provide investment advice, you're doing it all wrong. Far better to figure out what you want and then find the dealers who can help you get it.
So coin dealers are a bad source for advice for investment?
My guess is that we should buy high from dealers and sell low to dealers......right?
To all people watching this thread this is my hobby, and as all hobbies go it's going to cost you and me $.
I'm not in this to make any money, I just enjoy it for some reason, maybe it's the history or nostalgia?
Now back to the dealers, maybe it's the dealers that are just dealers for no other purpose than for ripping people off are the ones that really P me off.
You know the dealers, you want to sell a coin and he/she says "The coin is over graded, I give you blah blah below grey sheet".
If you want to purchase a coin from the same dealer they do a 180 " this coin should be graded one point higher because i'm a dealer" "I do this for a living" "I have seen enough of them"
Like I have said, it's not all dealers but I have run into more than my share that I have wanted to choke (can I say that?).
“Confirmation bias is the tendency to search for, interpret, favor, and recall information that confirms or support one's prior personal beliefs or values. It is an important type of cognitive bias that has a significant effect on the proper functioning of society by distorting evidence-based decision-making.“
@BAYOUBENGAL I would highly recommend Pinnacle Rarities for these material. They certainly carry and specialize in most of the non modern items you speak of and very fair comes to mind.
Dempsey & Baxter JMS Coins, there are many good dealers with good material that want to put good coins in collectors hands, period. I would shoot for a PNG dealer.
99.99% of the world will screw you over in a heartbeat under the right circumstances and especially when there are large sums of money involved. This isn’t limited to coins. Trust no one. That doesn’t mean don’t form business relationships, but always verify things for yourself and always have a plan B assuming you’ll be duped.
@BAYOUBENGAL said:
Ok, full disclosure, I’m a life long collector. On again off again but at times have been active in $5-15k coins. All US. I am NOT looking to make money in coins, just tired of getting ripped off.
If you're looking for coin dealers to provide investment advice, you're doing it all wrong. Far better to figure out what you want and then find the dealers who can help you get it.
So coin dealers are a bad source for advice for investment?
They're a great source for investment advice if you're looking for someone to advise you to put your money in coins.
Comments
You will likely learn far more about who the 'good' dealers are when you attempt to sell them coins that you bought from them. If you are specializing, you need to work with specialty dealers to get the coins you desire. You also need to find at least one dealer who will tell you 'NO' (i.e., do not buy that coin, even if it is in his inventory, because it isn't going to fit well in your collection).
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
I think what skier07 says makes alot of sense for you. If you are having trouble with dealers insist on CAC coins. This way you are atleast getting JA's approval on the quality of the coin and they are easier to sell. You still need to be careful about price but there are a ton of cac price guides now and also auction data. I think CAC is perfect for someone like yourself.
Totally agree with this suggestion. If you want a real education, take a road trip and visit him with your coins. You'll get instant feedback and will know what you're doing right and wrong. Worth the price in itself and will help you avoid future mistakes. Only warning is to make sure you have some thick skin. He doesn't sugar coat anything.
Yes. And I might add there are some dealers already mentioned you have to be very careful of......even though some come highly recommended from this forum. Which I think is what the OP was getting at initially. If you start out with many of our major retailers you probably have one foot in the grave already. It's a mine field out there. And what appears to look good from the outside, may be just the opposite once you pop the hood. In the end, you are your best advocate. Dig deep and often to get at the truth of the coin business. You need more of a mentor than just another coin dealer to sell you coins. What part of the country are you in? A trip to see Warren or even JA will give you a quick gut check.
Don't settle. Buy when you know it's right....pass otherwise. Take a dealer's opinion with a grain of salt....pass if it conflicts with yours. Don't fill holes. Don't buy problem coins, no matter how discounted....if it bugs you at all today....it will really bug you down the road. If in doubt, pass, and wait. Another better deal almost always comes along unless your are collecting Continental dollars by die variety....lol. Don't worry if you can't buy a coin for months, or even a year. You want to be flush with cash when the right coin, major collection/auction or deal pops up. It's hard to be good on a broad spectrum of the US Coin market unless you're a dealer buying and selling on a daily basis. You will make lots of mistakes with big series like Type Coins, Commems, etc. Consider focusing more on one subset of those so you can be an expert taking advantage of 90-95% of the dealers.
Oh yeah....and the Red Book won't help you avoid traps and problems. Ideally, follow the coat tails of a seasoned pro like our Colonel Jessup learning everything you can. One of his quotes always sticks with me...."that coin doesn't suck." His typical reply to a nice coin.
Thank you for all the great feedback. Point VERY well made and taken to do more work myself and that is something. I am going to do. So even if I am not buying for 6 months I’m going to stay on this (and other) message boards. I go way back to the World Wide Coin days in 1970s Atlanta. I also did not mean to come across as not blessed to have a significant size collection but much of my recent time has been spent on Heritage auctions and they can make even someone lucky financially feel damn poor. In any case thanks again and I look forward to shows coming back and walking the bourse floors, have not done this in way too long and always found the fast majority of dealers to be great people who love the hobby.
CFA, LSU AND ANA
First don't take a dealers word that a coin is going to upgrade and then be upset about it. The dealer is not in the grading room even if he/she is sincere and believes it should upgrade. Buy the coin you want to begin with. Second, if you want the best chance to hold value, buy only CAC coins.
Best, SH
Successful transactions with-Boosibri,lkeigwin,TomB,Broadstruck,coinsarefun,Type2,jom,ProfLiz, UltraHighRelief,Barndog,EXOJUNKIE,ldhair,fivecents,paesan,Crusty...
Regarding dealers telling you a coin may upgrade---i once asked one of the dealers mentioned on this thread if a coin he was selling had the potential to upgrade. His response was "im a coin dealer---its not my practice to leave money on the table." Bottom line in most cases any knowledgeable dealer will upgrade a coin if he is so certain it will.
I have dealt with Harry Laibstain for years, Dave Kahn same thing (actually he's a good freind), The ReededEdge boys, Gary Adkins. There are some good coins that come up in auctions from time to time, such as GC, and stacksbowers, etc, but you really have to have a go to guy/gal that you trust to view a coin if you cant on your own. You have to fish thru all the retreads, duds, problem issues (that may or may not be described accurately).
If I was serious enough to want to bid on a sizeable coin, even though there are some great folks eye's I trust, there's no better viewer than myself. over the years, I have made a point to get it looked at.
Years ago, I was searching for a 1901-s Quarter upgrade because I only had a VG-10 at the time, there was an XF 40 that was coming up for auction. I actually flew down to dallas that morning, and back just to view the coin in hand. Was actually back at home like a normal work day and nobody even knew I had left and came back. Glad I did, because it was not what I had hoped. I would have not been happy spending 34K and receiving that. Years, Later I was able to get a nicer AU from one of the dealers I mentioned above and had built up enough repoir over the years with them to get it on approval.
In this market, you need a dealer that has access to "hidden coins". I'm talking about the kind of material that essentially disappears before it even hits the internet. Virtually all the great coins are locked up in collections. You want "A" material. Therefore, you need a dealer that has loyal clients, has dealt in great coins for many years, and buys those coins back, and then offers them quietly to their best clients. It just takes the hard work to locate those dealers, and those relationships only come through trust and time and persistence. This is the formula that all great Collectors over the years have generally utilized. Good luck.
Some of those great coins placed by great dealers with contacts....end up in auctions where the bulk of the collection is posted. There you have the same shot as all the other dealers and top collectors of competing for them. That was my primary source for great coins in the past. I couldn't trust most other dealers to send me great coins and "fair" prices. Supposedly a gem I needed was in inventory of one of the nations largest coin dealer back in the mid-1980's. A coin on my want list. A raw "gem" BU 1858-0 seated quarter at $3000. The coin was rushed to me. It turned out to be a cleaned AU worth around $400. Fortunately, I found the world's finest example of this date in a Superior Auction for around $4200....graded choice/gem BU. And it was. The real deal, no rub. That pop top coin is PCGS MS65 today.
When I did get to that point where I was "offered" great coins by top dealers early on day 1 at shows, they were more than often just taking shots at me. The coins weren't great even if the grade said otherwise. I recall being offered an Eliasberg MS66 no drapery quarter for around $38K...ogh at the time. Off the market for 5-6 yrs since Eliasberg. Problem for me was that the luster was dead on 1/4 of the reverse where it didn't get through the nearly black toning. A big problem on a MS66 coin imo. I passed....making the dealer not so happy. And eventually I got tired of being given 1st shots on not so "all there coins." That might work if you were Dave Akers buying for Pogue, or Bill Nagle buying for Gene Gardner, doesn't always work that great for the rest of us. Who was Joe Thomas' insider?
Eldorado9 is 100% correct, some of my best quality pieces, have come from contacts from dealers that I have done business with over the years in private transactions where it was offered to me, before offered publicly.
I learned of this years ago, I used to try to get into shows early bird, etc to find the coins I was after before the general public got in, but later learned after helping a national dealer friend (now retired) that even then sometimes it was too late. Many dealers scoured the floor or were offered coins from past clients, contacts, and they were whisked off and tucked away for their better clients, and the show crowd incl early birds never got a chance to see them.
This is starting to sound like bash a dealer post. Just saying
Read this one over again as it is a gem.
I don't think I ever had a top retail dealer ever tell me NO- don't buy that from our inventory......unless I asked them specific questions about rub, luster, and marks. And then the "truth" might come out. I recall one time when I tried to sell my very first local coin dealer (1975) some of her coins back to her. She outright told me she had never sold any of those to me. OK.....that was a quick end to our relationship. Another time around 2004 I tried to sell some coins back to one of the nation's top dealers at the ANA show. They "laughed" when asking if I had bought some of them from them (ie I did). They recognized them and knew they sort of sucked. Needless to say they made no attempts at offers....essentially ending our relationship. I can probably point out half a dozen times for different dealers where this has occurred. That's when you realize those guys usually have no interest in buying back the mistakes they sold you. Who wants mistakes back?
always research your coins no matter what the coin or coins are that way you know what you are getting and such
1997- Present
2003-present
I have sold several coins at a 50% loss and not one even came close to 35K, come to think of it, not even close to being in the same ballpark!
I have lost a couple of hundred dollars on several coins (selling them to a dealer), and than turned around and spent that same money on a coin or two that knew that I paid to much for (same dealer).
Wish I had your problem BAYOUBENGAL.
If you're looking for coin dealers to provide investment advice, you're doing it all wrong. Far better to figure out what you want and then find the dealers who can help you get it.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
You should never place a huge amount of faith in a dealer's representation, about how great a coin is, if that dealer is trying to sell it to you.
You need to develop the knowledge needed to make your own decision independently, and then factor in the opinions of others. There is no real point in buying a collectible if you don't truly understand what you are buying. You have to be willing to put in the time needed to acquire the knowledge needed to do this. He who has the lesser knowledge usually gets the short end of the stick in a coin transaction.
Don't look for angelic dealers, look for knowledge.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Maybe yes, maybe no.
I'm sure the results will follow.
So coin dealers are a bad source for advice for investment?
My guess is that we should buy high from dealers and sell low to dealers......right?
I don't really know the percentage of "suspect" coin dealers that are out there, but just on my years of collecting I would say that it's probably 50/50.
OTOH, I do know quite a few dealers that I will deal with again.
That certainly won't be me. RCNH sold me a Barber half with graffiti carved into the eagle's chest once. They thought it was a perfectly fine coin but gave me a refund.
Actually, they can be a great source for advice. Just not so much when they’re trying to sell you something.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
I have never and will never push coins as an investment. I get asked this all the time. My canned response pretty much goes like this. Collecting coins is a great hobby and one of the few hobbies where you can get a good bit of your money back. A prudent collector can make money but there are no guarantees. Just about every series out there cycles up and down and become popular and then less popular.
To all people watching this thread this is my hobby, and as all hobbies go it's going to cost you and me $.
I'm not in this to make any money, I just enjoy it for some reason, maybe it's the history or nostalgia?
Now back to the dealers, maybe it's the dealers that are just dealers for no other purpose than for ripping people off are the ones that really P me off.
You know the dealers, you want to sell a coin and he/she says "The coin is over graded, I give you blah blah below grey sheet".
If you want to purchase a coin from the same dealer they do a 180 " this coin should be graded one point higher because i'm a dealer" "I do this for a living" "I have seen enough of them"
Like I have said, it's not all dealers but I have run into more than my share that I have wanted to choke (can I say that?).
Collectors say the same thing, you know.
“Confirmation bias is the tendency to search for, interpret, favor, and recall information that confirms or support one's prior personal beliefs or values. It is an important type of cognitive bias that has a significant effect on the proper functioning of society by distorting evidence-based decision-making.“
Excellent post!
@BAYOUBENGAL I would highly recommend Pinnacle Rarities for these material. They certainly carry and specialize in most of the non modern items you speak of and very fair comes to mind.
www.paradimecoins.com - Specializing in Top Pop Type PCGS CAC coins. Subscribe To Our NEWPs Mailing List
Shameless plug email sent.
siliconvalleycoins.com
Dempsey & Baxter JMS Coins, there are many good dealers with good material that want to put good coins in collectors hands, period. I would shoot for a PNG dealer.
RAD#306
One dealer to another?
I really don't care but the "bad" dealers are the ones that REALLY get me riled up.
Dealer MasonG?
Collectors can't get away with it, dealers get out their lap top and say...……"this is the price, and it's the price that you WILL pay"
There are still some nice dealers out there...…………….
...but none have posted in this thread so far that I know.
99.99% of the world will screw you over in a heartbeat under the right circumstances and especially when there are large sums of money involved. This isn’t limited to coins. Trust no one. That doesn’t mean don’t form business relationships, but always verify things for yourself and always have a plan B assuming you’ll be duped.
I sell stuff on eBay. To collectors. That I bought from dealers.
Nobody can make you pay more than you want to.
They're a great source for investment advice if you're looking for someone to advise you to put your money in coins.
Honest dealers offer a valuable service and in order to stay in business, they need to make a profit just like any other business.
Who was the one here who said, after looking around the bourse....
"Ninety percent of the dealer's here will bury you up to your neck... And steel the shovel"
My Saint Set