IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO COLLECTS WHAT OR EVEN IF THEY DON'T COLLECT ANYTHING !!
MILLIONS of people are gonna inherit STUFF
and....if they don't have specific guidance or a well thought out succession plan prepared by their parents.... they are gonna be IN THE DARK with what to do with said...
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore.
This WILL extend eventually to coins as well, it has hit stamps, cards, toys, figurines, very very hard.
Compare How many homes in the 1980’s and into the 1990’s had curio cabinets and all types of collectibles around—and then compare to lately.....almost none.
I am being very careful in the coin area what I retain going forward.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO COLLECTS WHAT OR EVEN IF THEY DON'T COLLECT ANYTHING !!
MILLIONS of people are gonna inherit STUFF
and....if they don't have specific guidance or a well thought out succession plan prepared by their parents.... they are gonna be IN THE DARK with what to do with said...
..... STUFF....
I agree!!!
To all you collectors out there.
Make sure your heirs know exactly what you have. Certification can also help them greatly.
I pounded in daily to my family what to do with my coins when I pass for so many years that I do not do it anymore.
My direct heirs know exactly what to do with my coins.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
Sneakers are huge. I work on a team of about 15 people and two of them collect sneakers. The sneaker subreddit has 900,00 subscribers, Mechanical Keyboards has 428,000 subscribers, Vinyl has 370,000 and Coins has 42,000 subscribers. It's always good to have some perspective.
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore....
This may be the case, but I've asserted before that collecting stuff is an innate personality trait more than it is a learned habit. Since the population is growing, there should be an increase in the number of collectors in the world, and those "dormant" collectors should have a collecting itch that needs scratching. The trick is to turn on collectors to coins, not to turn on non-collectors to coin collecting.
Oh, and 15 years ago, nobody really played board games anymore.
There are many parts of the world where there is little or even no evidence of collecting anything. It isn't because everyone there is broke either which means they just don't want it.
Specifically with coins, this especially applies in cultures and geographies that never struck their coinage, such as most of Africa and Latin America.
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore.
This WILL extend eventually to coins as well, it has hit stamps, cards, toys, figurines, very very hard.
Compare How many homes in the 1980’s and into the 1990’s had curio cabinets and all types of collectibles around—and then compare to lately.....almost none.
I am being very careful in the coin area what I retain going forward.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
No, a lot of is is generational. As a group, they don't like accumulating stuff like other generations. This is well known sociologically. It's also not a bad trait. But it does decrease the relative number of collectors in many categories.
Coins aren't the worst. Stamps are worse. World fair collectibles even worse than stamps. Lol.
It is what it is. Makes it a great time to collect. Makes it not such a great time to "invest"
Since, as a group, they don't like accumulating stuff, then I guess we can assume that they wouldn't get pissed if I left everything to the NRA or SPCA.
I'm not young but I am young compared to most on this board.
I'm going the Eric Newman route.... maybe I'll sell when I'm about 100 just to see how I'll do, then I won't 'burden' my heirs. Was talking to my dad about this the other day and he says why should you sell something that you truly love? Keep it as long as you can and it will only appreciate. My dad is a very wise and successful man with many years of experience, so I am going with his opinion. I've learned a lot from him in both business and life. Coins have been around for thousands of years and I don't see them fading overnight or not even in our lifetime. Once again; I see a very bull market and I am not one of The 'Sky is Falling crowd'! Certainly there are Cycles but the trend is upward in the long term. I've been hearing all this same BS, ever since I was a child, and that was 40 odd years ago. This is my attitude take it or leave it!! I'm sick of this tired, old argument.....
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore....
This may be the case, but I've asserted before that collecting stuff is an innate personality trait more than it is a learned habit. Since the population is growing, there should be an increase in the number of collectors in the world, and those "dormant" collectors should have a collecting itch that needs scratching. The trick is to turn on collectors to coins, not to turn on non-collectors to coin collecting.
Oh, and 15 years ago, nobody really played board games anymore.
There are many parts of the world where there is little or even no evidence of collecting anything. It isn't because everyone there is broke either which means they just don't want it.
Specifically with coins, this especially applies in cultures and geographies that never struck their coinage, such as most of Africa and Latin America.
Africa and Latin America are among the poorest, most corrupt and most violent parts of the world. If you think the average African or Latin American family isn’t living meal to meal, there’s no reasoning with you.
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore.
This WILL extend eventually to coins as well, it has hit stamps, cards, toys, figurines, very very hard.
Compare How many homes in the 1980’s and into the 1990’s had curio cabinets and all types of collectibles around—and then compare to lately.....almost none.
I am being very careful in the coin area what I retain going forward.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
No, a lot of is is generational. As a group, they don't like accumulating stuff like other generations. This is well known sociologically. It's also not a bad trait. But it does decrease the relative number of collectors in many categories.
Coins aren't the worst. Stamps are worse. World fair collectibles even worse than stamps. Lol.
It is what it is. Makes it a great time to collect. Makes it not such a great time to "invest"
You do realize you’re speaking to one of “them”, right?
I do have groups, connections and my own venues to buy and sell coins. Just because there’s few young people at coin shows doesn’t mean the coin collecting community is dying. Maybe the coin hobby and the dinosaurs that inhabit the hobby are the ones lagging the rest of the world. eBay has 10x as many coins at cheaper prices than coins shows and you can access it from home. I can count the number of coins I have purchased from coin shows on my hands because normally they’re significantly overpriced and I have bought many coins. I go to coin shows to talk to some of my friends (like roadrunner and other old codgers 😉) and to meet new dealers.
GC, Heritage, Stacks as various forums have a better selection and more competitive price than many lcs’s and Coin shows. That’s a fact.
While I support coin clubs and my local LCS’s, I learn a lot more on here and other forums at ZERO cost, little effort and from the comfort of my home. I just sold 2 coins tonight on Reddit and made a 40% profit on them, lol.
How come there are millions of subscribers on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit and other coin forums dominated by younger people? Maybe you’re the one who hasn’t adapted and realized that there is whole other coin world and collecting community out there?
You know what @jmlanzaf, you’re right! I’ll do you a favor and I’ll grudgingly buy your coins at 30 cents on the dollar. We both know I’m doing you a favor... since there won’t be anyone in 10 years to buy your coins. Whenever you want, feel free to thank me👍!
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore.
This WILL extend eventually to coins as well, it has hit stamps, cards, toys, figurines, very very hard.
Compare How many homes in the 1980’s and into the 1990’s had curio cabinets and all types of collectibles around—and then compare to lately.....almost none.
I am being very careful in the coin area what I retain going forward.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
No, a lot of is is generational. As a group, they don't like accumulating stuff like other generations. This is well known sociologically. It's also not a bad trait. But it does decrease the relative number of collectors in many categories.
Coins aren't the worst. Stamps are worse. World fair collectibles even worse than stamps. Lol.
It is what it is. Makes it a great time to collect. Makes it not such a great time to "invest"
You do realize you’re speaking to one of “them”, right?
I do have groups, connections and my own venues to buy and sell coins. Just because there’s few young people at coin shows doesn’t mean the coin collecting community is dying. Maybe the coin hobby and the dinosaurs that inhabit the hobby are the ones lagging the rest of the world. eBay has 10x as many coins at cheaper prices than coins shows and you can access it from home. I can count the number of coins I have purchased from coin shows on my hands because normally they’re significantly overpriced and I have bought many coins. I go to coin shows to talk to some of my friends (like roadrunner and other old codgers 😉) and to meet new dealers.
GC, Heritage, Stacks as various forums have a better selection and more competitive price than many lcs’s and Coin shows. That’s a fact.
While I support coin clubs and my local LCS’s, I learn a lot more on here and other forums at ZERO cost, little effort and from the comfort of my home. I just sold 2 coins tonight on Reddit and made a 40% profit on them, lol.
How come there are millions of subscribers on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit and other coin forums dominated by younger people? Maybe you’re the one who hasn’t adapted and realized that there is whole other coin world and collecting community out there?
You know what @jmlanzaf, you’re right! I’ll do you a favor and I’ll grudgingly buy your coins at 30 cents on the dollar. We both know I’m doing you a favor... since there won’t be anyone in 10 years to buy your coins. Whenever you want, feel free to thank me👍!
I know to whom I'm speaking. But your testimony is anecdotal. I know a lot of coin collectors, for example, that doesn't make the percentage of coin collectors among my friends anything but a reflection of me.
Look at the psychological and sociological profiles of milleniums and post-milleniums. This has been studied. We get briefed on it every year. The eschewing of possessions even extends to buying houses.
Millenials and post-millenials prefer to spend money on experiences than objects.
Again, it's not a bad thing. It's just a thing.
There are millenial collectors. They are simply not as prevalent as they were in the previous generation.
@topstuf said:
Since, as a group, they don't like accumulating stuff, then I guess we can assume that they wouldn't get pissed if I left everything to the NRA or SPCA.
They would prefer the cash to take a trip to someplace interesting. LOL
I'm not young but I am young compared to most on this board.
I'm going the Eric Newman route.... maybe I'll sell when I'm about 100 just to see how I'll do, then I won't 'burden' my heirs. Was talking to my dad about this the other day and he says why should you sell something that you truly love? Keep it as long as you can and it will only appreciate. No one in my family is hurting for money. My dad is a very wise and successful man with many years of experience, so I am going with his opinion. I've learned a lot from him in both business and life. Coins have been around for thousands of years and I don't see them fading overnight or not even in our lifetime. Once again; I see a very bull market and I am not one of The 'Sky is Falling crowd'! Certainly there are Cycles but the trend is upward in the long term. I've been hearing all this same BS, ever since I was a child, and that was 40 odd years ago. This is my attitude take it or leave it!! I'm sick of this tired, old argument.....
You are tired of it, but you jumped right into it. LOL. [I kid]
The trend over the last 15 years or so has NOT been up in the broad, widget part of the market. Look at modern proof and mint sets. Silver commemoratives are mostly just bullion. Circ Morgan dollars. The list goes on and on.
And there is no doubt what happened to stamps as a hobby. That used to be the King of Hobbies. Now, the prices can't find a bottom after 20 years of looking. But if you like stamps and want to collect them, you can put together collections now that you couldn't have afforded 20 to 30 years ago. It's a great time to collect but it gets to be a worse and worse time to sell.
The heyday for postcards was the 1920s. It's been downhill since. LOL. But, you know what, deltiologists still exist. There are just fewer of them enjoying the lower prices and glut of great material to buy.
Don't mistake simple inflation for appreciation. And be careful about the comp when considering opportunity costs. Might your particular coins go up? Sure. The broader market? No one has a crystal ball. But we shouldn't ignore the challenges.
You are tired of it, but you jumped right into it. LOL. [I kid]
The trend over the last 15 years or so has NOT been up in the broad, widget part of the market. Look at modern proof and mint sets. Silver commemoratives are mostly just bullion. Circ Morgan dollars. The list goes on and on.
And there is no doubt what happened to stamps as a hobby. That used to be the King of Hobbies. Now, the prices can't find a bottom after 20 years of looking. But if you like stamps and want to collect them, you can put together collections now that you couldn't have afforded 20 to 30 years ago. It's a great time to collect but it gets to be a worse and worse time to sell.
The heyday for postcards was the 1920s. It's been downhill since. LOL. But, you know what, deltiologists still exist. There are just fewer of them enjoying the lower prices and glut of great material to buy.
Don't mistake simple inflation for appreciation. And be careful about the comp when considering opportunity costs. Might your particular coins go up? Sure. The broader market? No one has a crystal ball. But we shouldn't ignore the challenges.
Thanks for your opinion. Now that I'm about done with my Walkers, I'm not going to start anything major and I'm going to just collect casually. Yes, I am going to diversify, as I have been for the last 10-15 years. Coins are not my only thing.
Your comparison of coins to the stamp and postcard Market is not a fair comparison. The latter two have been dead for decades, while the coin Market still flourishes.
Are they the best investment vehicle? Probably not. But are they safe and appreciable?..... I believe they are.
He is a market expert and is not afraid to spend his money on coins. If it was a dangerous investment; I don't think he would be doing it, especially given what he knows.
@WildIdea said:
47 now so I don’t count as young anymore I guess. Still, 20+ years as a young collector has taught me a few things.
I’ve noticed that when a family bails on a collection the nicest stuff stays in family as long as possible or may never come out. It takes a strong market or bids to get quality pieces off the sidelines. A falling market won’t present many opportunities to buy killers for less.
I believe the circulating coinage creates interest argument is hollow because it takes much more than that to peel 4 plus digits out of someone. It’s when they’re considered miniature art sculptures does one get comfortable trading huge lumps of cash.
The potential millions who will be selling or passing their collections mostly don't have anything that can't be bought right now any day of the week.
Even if 2% of those collections have “rare” or “better” coins (that can’t be bought every day), that’s still enough to excite the market in anticipation of those sales and elicit strong bids when sold.
Collecting is fun and hobbies are know to be good for your health. But collecting can be like gambling.....an addiction.
Most people want money in the form of inheritance, preferring to sell the willed collectibles.
Don’t burden your loved ones with your collectibles.....i.e. Beannie babies. Sell!!!!!!
By the way , “ How much do you want for that ?”
You are tired of it, but you jumped right into it. LOL. [I kid]
The trend over the last 15 years or so has NOT been up in the broad, widget part of the market. Look at modern proof and mint sets. Silver commemoratives are mostly just bullion. Circ Morgan dollars. The list goes on and on.
And there is no doubt what happened to stamps as a hobby. That used to be the King of Hobbies. Now, the prices can't find a bottom after 20 years of looking. But if you like stamps and want to collect them, you can put together collections now that you couldn't have afforded 20 to 30 years ago. It's a great time to collect but it gets to be a worse and worse time to sell.
The heyday for postcards was the 1920s. It's been downhill since. LOL. But, you know what, deltiologists still exist. There are just fewer of them enjoying the lower prices and glut of great material to buy.
Don't mistake simple inflation for appreciation. And be careful about the comp when considering opportunity costs. Might your particular coins go up? Sure. The broader market? No one has a crystal ball. But we shouldn't ignore the challenges.
Thanks for your opinion. Now that I'm about done with my Walkers, I'm not going to start anything major and I'm going to just collect casually. Yes, I am going to diversify, as I have been for the last 10-15 years. Coins are not my only thing.
Your comparison of coins to the stamp and postcard Market is not a fair comparison. The latter two have been dead for decades, while the coin Market still flourishes.
Are they the best investment vehicle? Probably not. But are they safe and appreciable?..... I believe they are.
He is a market expert and is not afraid to spend his money on coins. If it was a dangerous investment; I don't think he would be doing it, especially given what he knows.
I wasn't really comparing to postcards. It was more of a joke, pointing out a market that was huge, probably bigger than coins at the time, that gradually all but disappeared.
But stamps are not that different than coins. Both markets peaked in 1990. The only real difference is that SOME coin segments recovered from the collapse while MOST stamp segments did not.
I'd also point out other stamp/ coin similarities. Stamp widgets continue to slide while high end stamps (6 figure up) continue to set records.
ANA and APS membership have both dropped precipitously and are actually both in the 25,000 range. There are probably still as many stamp collectors as coin collectors, though there used to be more of each and stamp collectors used to outnumber coin collectors by a fair bit.
There are other market similarities. Commemorative stamp issues exploded in the 1980s. Commemorative coin issues are exploding in the 2000s.
You don't need there to be no collectors to have a market problem. You just need a supply surplus. That is the stamp problem and that is the coin problem in many market segments.
Again, that is not a "the sky is falling" observation. It is also not a reason not to collect. It IS a reason not to consider coins as investments. It is also a reason to keep an eye on the market and to try to encourage new collectors.
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore.
This WILL extend eventually to coins as well, it has hit stamps, cards, toys, figurines, very very hard.
Compare How many homes in the 1980’s and into the 1990’s had curio cabinets and all types of collectibles around—and then compare to lately.....almost none.
I am being very careful in the coin area what I retain going forward.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
No, a lot of is is generational. As a group, they don't like accumulating stuff like other generations. This is well known sociologically. It's also not a bad trait. But it does decrease the relative number of collectors in many categories.
Coins aren't the worst. Stamps are worse. World fair collectibles even worse than stamps. Lol.
It is what it is. Makes it a great time to collect. Makes it not such a great time to "invest"
You do realize you’re speaking to one of “them”, right?
I do have groups, connections and my own venues to buy and sell coins. Just because there’s few young people at coin shows doesn’t mean the coin collecting community is dying. Maybe the coin hobby and the dinosaurs that inhabit the hobby are the ones lagging the rest of the world. eBay has 10x as many coins at cheaper prices than coins shows and you can access it from home. I can count the number of coins I have purchased from coin shows on my hands because normally they’re significantly overpriced and I have bought many coins. I go to coin shows to talk to some of my friends (like roadrunner and other old codgers 😉) and to meet new dealers.
GC, Heritage, Stacks as various forums have a better selection and more competitive price than many lcs’s and Coin shows. That’s a fact.
While I support coin clubs and my local LCS’s, I learn a lot more on here and other forums at ZERO cost, little effort and from the comfort of my home. I just sold 2 coins tonight on Reddit and made a 40% profit on them, lol.
How come there are millions of subscribers on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit and other coin forums dominated by younger people? Maybe you’re the one who hasn’t adapted and realized that there is whole other coin world and collecting community out there?
You know what @jmlanzaf, you’re right! I’ll do you a favor and I’ll grudgingly buy your coins at 30 cents on the dollar. We both know I’m doing you a favor... since there won’t be anyone in 10 years to buy your coins. Whenever you want, feel free to thank me👍!
I know to whom I'm speaking. But your testimony is anecdotal. I know a lot of coin collectors, for example, that doesn't make the percentage of coin collectors among my friends anything but a reflection of me.
Look at the psychological and sociological profiles of milleniums and post-milleniums. This has been studied. We get briefed on it every year. The eschewing of possessions even extends to buying houses.
Millenials and post-millenials prefer to spend money on experiences than objects.
Again, it's not a bad thing. It's just a thing.
There are millenial collectors. They are simply not as prevalent as they were in the previous generation.
Its funny that you can't see your own bias. Let me take a bite out of my avocado toast and sip on my $9 latte and I'll give you the rundown. I'll repeat what I said above. Why is it some magic cards are selling for $100,000+? How come people buy and sell mechanical keyboards for hundreds and thousands of dollars? Who is paying $10,000 for a pair of Jordan's? What about vintage video games and board games? Are old people buying this stuff??? Or are these the people who weren't psychological and sociological profiled? lol
If you were familiar with millennials, you would know that many were affected pretty hard by the "great recession". Don't you think entering the workforce as the economy tanked could have an impact on their ability to be able to buy a house, get a job, and afford the necessities for years or affect their future earnings? Where does that sit on the hierarchy of needs compared to collecting? That doesn't mean us millennials and zoomers don't want to collect stuff, it means many are not able to AFFORD to collect stuff or don't have the time right now.
You also neglected to respond to my offer to buy your soon to be worthless coins off you?!? Its funny how the sky is falling and there will be no young people to buy your coins, yet you don't want to sell to me while you have the chance. Something here doesn't add up...
on a side note, thanks for the real advice and wisdom @topstuf
@ShadyDave said:
Don't you think entering the workforce as the economy tanked could have an impact on their ability to be able to buy a house, get a job, and afford the necessities for years or affect their future earnings?
I'm pretty sure people who were entering the workforce when interest rates were in double digits and approaching 20% know something about the difficulty in buying a house and all that other stuff.
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore.
This WILL extend eventually to coins as well, it has hit stamps, cards, toys, figurines, very very hard.
Compare How many homes in the 1980’s and into the 1990’s had curio cabinets and all types of collectibles around—and then compare to lately.....almost none.
I am being very careful in the coin area what I retain going forward.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
No, a lot of is is generational. As a group, they don't like accumulating stuff like other generations. This is well known sociologically. It's also not a bad trait. But it does decrease the relative number of collectors in many categories.
Coins aren't the worst. Stamps are worse. World fair collectibles even worse than stamps. Lol.
It is what it is. Makes it a great time to collect. Makes it not such a great time to "invest"
You do realize you’re speaking to one of “them”, right?
I do have groups, connections and my own venues to buy and sell coins. Just because there’s few young people at coin shows doesn’t mean the coin collecting community is dying. Maybe the coin hobby and the dinosaurs that inhabit the hobby are the ones lagging the rest of the world. eBay has 10x as many coins at cheaper prices than coins shows and you can access it from home. I can count the number of coins I have purchased from coin shows on my hands because normally they’re significantly overpriced and I have bought many coins. I go to coin shows to talk to some of my friends (like roadrunner and other old codgers 😉) and to meet new dealers.
GC, Heritage, Stacks as various forums have a better selection and more competitive price than many lcs’s and Coin shows. That’s a fact.
While I support coin clubs and my local LCS’s, I learn a lot more on here and other forums at ZERO cost, little effort and from the comfort of my home. I just sold 2 coins tonight on Reddit and made a 40% profit on them, lol.
How come there are millions of subscribers on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit and other coin forums dominated by younger people? Maybe you’re the one who hasn’t adapted and realized that there is whole other coin world and collecting community out there?
You know what @jmlanzaf, you’re right! I’ll do you a favor and I’ll grudgingly buy your coins at 30 cents on the dollar. We both know I’m doing you a favor... since there won’t be anyone in 10 years to buy your coins. Whenever you want, feel free to thank me👍!
I know to whom I'm speaking. But your testimony is anecdotal. I know a lot of coin collectors, for example, that doesn't make the percentage of coin collectors among my friends anything but a reflection of me.
Look at the psychological and sociological profiles of milleniums and post-milleniums. This has been studied. We get briefed on it every year. The eschewing of possessions even extends to buying houses.
Millenials and post-millenials prefer to spend money on experiences than objects.
Again, it's not a bad thing. It's just a thing.
There are millenial collectors. They are simply not as prevalent as they were in the previous generation.
Its funny that you can't see your own bias. Let me take a bite out of my avocado toast and sip on my $9 latte and I'll give you the rundown. I'll repeat what I said above. Why is it some magic cards are selling for $100,000+? How come people buy and sell mechanical keyboards for hundreds and thousands of dollars? Who is paying $10,000 for a pair of Jordan's? What about vintage video games and board games? Are old people buying this stuff??? Or are these the people who weren't psychological and sociological profiled? lol
If you were familiar with millennials, you would know that many were affected pretty hard by the "great recession". Don't you think entering the workforce as the economy tanked could have an impact on their ability to be able to buy a house, get a job, and afford the necessities for years or affect their future earnings? Where does that sit on the hierarchy of needs compared to collecting? That doesn't mean us millennials and zoomers don't want to collect stuff, it means many are not able to AFFORD to collect stuff or don't have the time right now.
You also neglected to respond to my offer to buy your soon to be worthless coins off you?!? Its funny how the sky is falling and there will be no young people to buy your coins, yet you don't want to sell to me while you have the chance. Something here doesn't add up...
on a side note, thanks for the real advice and wisdom @topstuf
I'm a dealer. I'll sell you every coin I own. Go to my ebay store and buy everything. Please. I'll reload and you can come back and buy it all again. I've got 30,000 in old inventory i'll sell you at my cost.
I don't have a bias. I have data. Millennials AS A GROUP are less interested in possessions than earlier generations. That is NOT a bad thing. That is not all millennials. It is statistical. I'm not sure why you are taking it personally. All the other generations should be mad at the characterization because they come off as being more possession oriented, more McDuck.
Collecting tastes, fads, and prices change over time. Some classics will always be valuable. I don't care what anyone says, Duesenberg's, Van Gogh's, and 1795-1834 early gold will always have a lot of value. United States coins dated starting with 17 or 180 will always have a lot of value. They are scarce.
When millennials move into VP positions after the boomers croak or inherit the boomers wealth, they will collect. Where did Green, Lilly, Bass, Pogue etc. get their collecting money? Millennials broke on student debt and expensive experiences will not collect.
edit - to comment on the OP topic, it is great advice, and I will add that experienced collectors can also be mentors, both in general and specialized areas of collecting. Look for a good coin club.
Robert Scot: Engraving Liberty - biography of US Mint's first chief engraver
@7over8 said:
The main issue is with collectibles in general—the majority of young people don’t want anything to do with them. No one really collects anything anymore....
This may be the case, but I've asserted before that collecting stuff is an innate personality trait more than it is a learned habit. Since the population is growing, there should be an increase in the number of collectors in the world, and those "dormant" collectors should have a collecting itch that needs scratching. The trick is to turn on collectors to coins, not to turn on non-collectors to coin collecting.
Oh, and 15 years ago, nobody really played board games anymore.
There are many parts of the world where there is little or even no evidence of collecting anything. It isn't because everyone there is broke either which means they just don't want it.
Specifically with coins, this especially applies in cultures and geographies that never struck their coinage, such as most of Africa and Latin America.
Africa and Latin America are among the poorest, most corrupt and most violent parts of the world. If you think the average African or Latin American family isn’t living meal to meal, there’s no reasoning with you.
There are plenty of people (thousands to millions) who have the financial capacity to collect to the same financial level as most members on this board in every single country on the planet.
The idea that collecting is limited in most of the world due to lack of affluence is a complete myth. It's a widely believed myth among US collectors but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a myth.
Younger generation would probably shell 1K for a new iPhone without blinking but maybe would think really hard to spend it on a perfect Peace 21
Twelve years ago I bought a really nice 1921 MS65 Peace Dollar (pre CAC days) for $2850. Today's value $1,850. I guess if it's a choice between an iPhone or another Peace Dollar of this same quality for $1000, I'll take the Peace Dollar.
Comments
I....shall....try...once....more......
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO COLLECTS WHAT OR EVEN IF THEY DON'T COLLECT ANYTHING !!
MILLIONS of people are gonna inherit STUFF
and....if they don't have specific guidance or a well thought out succession plan prepared by their parents.... they are gonna be IN THE DARK with what to do with said...
..... STUFF....
I define "young coin people" as anyone under 70.
This is your opinion, I am a millennial and I see something very different. Some millennials aren't interested in collectibles however, others are. Don't you think part of that that can be $$$$ related? Who has more spare money, millennials or boomers? Look at sneakers, pokemon cards, magic cards, designer handbags, mechanical keyboards, vintage videogames etc. There are some crazy prices being paid for collectibles by millennials. How do you explain that if "they don't want anything do to with collectibles"??
I suggest you go on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit, Discord and see where us younger collectors hang out.
I agree!!!
To all you collectors out there.
Make sure your heirs know exactly what you have. Certification can also help them greatly.
I pounded in daily to my family what to do with my coins when I pass for so many years that I do not do it anymore.
My direct heirs know exactly what to do with my coins.
My coin collecting hobby is not to make $.
I have had and/or having other venues for the green stuff.
Sneakers are huge. I work on a team of about 15 people and two of them collect sneakers. The sneaker subreddit has 900,00 subscribers, Mechanical Keyboards has 428,000 subscribers, Vinyl has 370,000 and Coins has 42,000 subscribers. It's always good to have some perspective.
IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
"Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me
There are many parts of the world where there is little or even no evidence of collecting anything. It isn't because everyone there is broke either which means they just don't want it.
Specifically with coins, this especially applies in cultures and geographies that never struck their coinage, such as most of Africa and Latin America.
No, a lot of is is generational. As a group, they don't like accumulating stuff like other generations. This is well known sociologically. It's also not a bad trait. But it does decrease the relative number of collectors in many categories.
Coins aren't the worst. Stamps are worse. World fair collectibles even worse than stamps. Lol.
It is what it is. Makes it a great time to collect. Makes it not such a great time to "invest"
Since, as a group, they don't like accumulating stuff, then I guess we can assume that they wouldn't get pissed if I left everything to the NRA or SPCA.
Here is my unsolicited opinion:
I'm not young but I am young compared to most on this board.
I'm going the Eric Newman route.... maybe I'll sell when I'm about 100 just to see how I'll do, then I won't 'burden' my heirs. Was talking to my dad about this the other day and he says why should you sell something that you truly love? Keep it as long as you can and it will only appreciate. My dad is a very wise and successful man with many years of experience, so I am going with his opinion. I've learned a lot from him in both business and life. Coins have been around for thousands of years and I don't see them fading overnight or not even in our lifetime. Once again; I see a very bull market and I am not one of The 'Sky is Falling crowd'! Certainly there are Cycles but the trend is upward in the long term. I've been hearing all this same BS, ever since I was a child, and that was 40 odd years ago. This is my attitude take it or leave it!! I'm sick of this tired, old argument.....
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Africa and Latin America are among the poorest, most corrupt and most violent parts of the world. If you think the average African or Latin American family isn’t living meal to meal, there’s no reasoning with you.
I'm starting a set of proof voodoo dolls and uncirculated tortillas.
You do realize you’re speaking to one of “them”, right?
I do have groups, connections and my own venues to buy and sell coins. Just because there’s few young people at coin shows doesn’t mean the coin collecting community is dying. Maybe the coin hobby and the dinosaurs that inhabit the hobby are the ones lagging the rest of the world. eBay has 10x as many coins at cheaper prices than coins shows and you can access it from home. I can count the number of coins I have purchased from coin shows on my hands because normally they’re significantly overpriced and I have bought many coins. I go to coin shows to talk to some of my friends (like roadrunner and other old codgers 😉) and to meet new dealers.
GC, Heritage, Stacks as various forums have a better selection and more competitive price than many lcs’s and Coin shows. That’s a fact.
While I support coin clubs and my local LCS’s, I learn a lot more on here and other forums at ZERO cost, little effort and from the comfort of my home. I just sold 2 coins tonight on Reddit and made a 40% profit on them, lol.
How come there are millions of subscribers on Facebook, Instagram, Reddit and other coin forums dominated by younger people? Maybe you’re the one who hasn’t adapted and realized that there is whole other coin world and collecting community out there?
You know what @jmlanzaf, you’re right! I’ll do you a favor and I’ll grudgingly buy your coins at 30 cents on the dollar. We both know I’m doing you a favor... since there won’t be anyone in 10 years to buy your coins. Whenever you want, feel free to thank me👍!
I know to whom I'm speaking. But your testimony is anecdotal. I know a lot of coin collectors, for example, that doesn't make the percentage of coin collectors among my friends anything but a reflection of me.
Look at the psychological and sociological profiles of milleniums and post-milleniums. This has been studied. We get briefed on it every year. The eschewing of possessions even extends to buying houses.
Millenials and post-millenials prefer to spend money on experiences than objects.
Again, it's not a bad thing. It's just a thing.
There are millenial collectors. They are simply not as prevalent as they were in the previous generation.
They would prefer the cash to take a trip to someplace interesting. LOL
You are tired of it, but you jumped right into it. LOL. [I kid]
The trend over the last 15 years or so has NOT been up in the broad, widget part of the market. Look at modern proof and mint sets. Silver commemoratives are mostly just bullion. Circ Morgan dollars. The list goes on and on.
And there is no doubt what happened to stamps as a hobby. That used to be the King of Hobbies. Now, the prices can't find a bottom after 20 years of looking. But if you like stamps and want to collect them, you can put together collections now that you couldn't have afforded 20 to 30 years ago. It's a great time to collect but it gets to be a worse and worse time to sell.
The heyday for postcards was the 1920s. It's been downhill since. LOL. But, you know what, deltiologists still exist. There are just fewer of them enjoying the lower prices and glut of great material to buy.
Don't mistake simple inflation for appreciation. And be careful about the comp when considering opportunity costs. Might your particular coins go up? Sure. The broader market? No one has a crystal ball. But we shouldn't ignore the challenges.
Thanks for your opinion. Now that I'm about done with my Walkers, I'm not going to start anything major and I'm going to just collect casually. Yes, I am going to diversify, as I have been for the last 10-15 years. Coins are not my only thing.
Your comparison of coins to the stamp and postcard Market is not a fair comparison. The latter two have been dead for decades, while the coin Market still flourishes.
Are they the best investment vehicle? Probably not. But are they safe and appreciable?..... I believe they are.
Ask @Justacommeman what he thinks.
He is a market expert and is not afraid to spend his money on coins. If it was a dangerous investment; I don't think he would be doing it, especially given what he knows.
Would love to hear his opinion.
@tradedollarnut too.
Neither one strikes me as unsensible businessmen.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Even if 2% of those collections have “rare” or “better” coins (that can’t be bought every day), that’s still enough to excite the market in anticipation of those sales and elicit strong bids when sold.
Collecting is fun and hobbies are know to be good for your health. But collecting can be like gambling.....an addiction.
Most people want money in the form of inheritance, preferring to sell the willed collectibles.
Don’t burden your loved ones with your collectibles.....i.e. Beannie babies. Sell!!!!!!
By the way , “ How much do you want for that ?”
I wasn't really comparing to postcards. It was more of a joke, pointing out a market that was huge, probably bigger than coins at the time, that gradually all but disappeared.
But stamps are not that different than coins. Both markets peaked in 1990. The only real difference is that SOME coin segments recovered from the collapse while MOST stamp segments did not.
I'd also point out other stamp/ coin similarities. Stamp widgets continue to slide while high end stamps (6 figure up) continue to set records.
ANA and APS membership have both dropped precipitously and are actually both in the 25,000 range. There are probably still as many stamp collectors as coin collectors, though there used to be more of each and stamp collectors used to outnumber coin collectors by a fair bit.
There are other market similarities. Commemorative stamp issues exploded in the 1980s. Commemorative coin issues are exploding in the 2000s.
You don't need there to be no collectors to have a market problem. You just need a supply surplus. That is the stamp problem and that is the coin problem in many market segments.
Again, that is not a "the sky is falling" observation. It is also not a reason not to collect. It IS a reason not to consider coins as investments. It is also a reason to keep an eye on the market and to try to encourage new collectors.
Its funny that you can't see your own bias. Let me take a bite out of my avocado toast and sip on my $9 latte and I'll give you the rundown. I'll repeat what I said above. Why is it some magic cards are selling for $100,000+? How come people buy and sell mechanical keyboards for hundreds and thousands of dollars? Who is paying $10,000 for a pair of Jordan's? What about vintage video games and board games? Are old people buying this stuff??? Or are these the people who weren't psychological and sociological profiled? lol
If you were familiar with millennials, you would know that many were affected pretty hard by the "great recession". Don't you think entering the workforce as the economy tanked could have an impact on their ability to be able to buy a house, get a job, and afford the necessities for years or affect their future earnings? Where does that sit on the hierarchy of needs compared to collecting? That doesn't mean us millennials and zoomers don't want to collect stuff, it means many are not able to AFFORD to collect stuff or don't have the time right now.
You also neglected to respond to my offer to buy your soon to be worthless coins off you?!? Its funny how the sky is falling and there will be no young people to buy your coins, yet you don't want to sell to me while you have the chance. Something here doesn't add up...
on a side note, thanks for the real advice and wisdom @topstuf
I'm pretty sure people who were entering the workforce when interest rates were in double digits and approaching 20% know something about the difficulty in buying a house and all that other stuff.
Just sayin'.
I'm a dealer. I'll sell you every coin I own. Go to my ebay store and buy everything. Please. I'll reload and you can come back and buy it all again. I've got 30,000 in old inventory i'll sell you at my cost.
I don't have a bias. I have data. Millennials AS A GROUP are less interested in possessions than earlier generations. That is NOT a bad thing. That is not all millennials. It is statistical. I'm not sure why you are taking it personally. All the other generations should be mad at the characterization because they come off as being more possession oriented, more McDuck.
Collecting tastes, fads, and prices change over time. Some classics will always be valuable. I don't care what anyone says, Duesenberg's, Van Gogh's, and 1795-1834 early gold will always have a lot of value. United States coins dated starting with 17 or 180 will always have a lot of value. They are scarce.
When millennials move into VP positions after the boomers croak or inherit the boomers wealth, they will collect. Where did Green, Lilly, Bass, Pogue etc. get their collecting money? Millennials broke on student debt and expensive experiences will not collect.
edit - to comment on the OP topic, it is great advice, and I will add that experienced collectors can also be mentors, both in general and specialized areas of collecting. Look for a good coin club.
There are plenty of people (thousands to millions) who have the financial capacity to collect to the same financial level as most members on this board in every single country on the planet.
The idea that collecting is limited in most of the world due to lack of affluence is a complete myth. It's a widely believed myth among US collectors but that doesn't change the fact that it's still a myth.
Twelve years ago I bought a really nice 1921 MS65 Peace Dollar (pre CAC days) for $2850. Today's value $1,850. I guess if it's a choice between an iPhone or another Peace Dollar of this same quality for $1000, I'll take the Peace Dollar.