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Rant: What's the reasoning behind over pricing cards to sell?
steel75
Posts: 1,589 ✭✭✭✭
Just trying to understand the end game as a seller for knowingly over pricing a card. I know "they can ask whatever they want, just move on..." way of thinking but that's from the buyers side. From the seller perspective I don't get it. If card X has sold 10 times for $150 and you ask $250, how do you plan on making a sale? I thought that was the goal. Waiting for the infamous "sucker" to come along?
Just my rant I guess.
1970's Steelers, Vintage Indians
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There are a couple of known "big" sellers on Ebay where I am just stunned at what they are asking. How do they ever sell anything? How can they money/inventory locked up for so long and stay afloat?
I agree. I have seen one particular item that would be a nice addition to my set that has been on ebay for a couple of years.
Seller did drop the price, but it still seems beyond comprehension!
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1971-TOPPS-TATTOOS-HARMON-KILLEBREW-PSA-MINT-9-POP-1-3/233094937748?hash=item36458a7c94:m:mwFAdkZF8UYGbivFONyThyg
Some coin dealers do this quite a bit as well. So it's not just sports cards.
707, Dean, Fritsch, Yep Dog....how do those guys stay afloat ? How many threads over how many years has that question been asked ? I wonder if they get a kick out of reading them. I just assume every seller is entitled to ask a price below which he prefers not to sell. Glad it does not annoy me like it seems to annoy some.
Bowman Baseball -1948-1955
Fleer Baseball-1923, 1959-2007
Al
I really wanted that tattoo, but settled for an 8. I am happier than if I overpaid for a "better" item.
Been there...….just don't want to give them any business.
I wish sellers accepted bags of marshmallows as payment. I have access to a lot of bags of marshmallows.
Some ebay sellers like having their own personal museum where they're basically showing off their cards while having no intention of selling. I've been doing the same ebay searches daily going on 2-3 years now and I see cards that have been sitting there for the same prices during that entire time span.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Showing off to who? I don't get that or frankly respect it.
They are showing of their stupidity but they are too dumb to realize it.
perfectly said
They're basically showing off their cards to ebay buyers with no intention of selling them. I only collect Jordan and I see many of his cards listed with outrageous prices. I'm talking prices that are sometimes 4-5 times more than what previous sales were. Asking prices on PSA 8's that are as high as the previous PSA 10 sold prices, from high end to stuff that normally sells cheap. Some of these sellers are just people that came across some MJ cards and they think they hit the jackpot by listing for crazy prices but others are collectors that know what they have and if you want their card you gotta pay their price:hence that is why we'll see cards sometimes sitting their for very long periods of time.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
But some of these "sellers" are what I thought were running a business. Which is what my original post was about.
Some private collector "showing off" as you say, is really showing only one thing......his a**
You'll see it from both the private collector and the guy with his "business."
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
You can add Sports-Cards-Forever to this list.
Many items are at least 3-4 X VCP or more
yet when I do checks for cards on VCP I see that they (and others here) have sold cards.
Like mentioned here I have seen cards listed for years.
1948-76 Topps FB Sets
FB & BB HOF Player sets
1948-1993 NY Yankee Team Sets
I asked one a while back just to sniff them out if they would accept a offer higher than any other sale for card X in the last 90 days...….....and nothing......not even a response.
Find a different seller and move on. Vcp is not a federal pricing law. If the sellers do not get sales, that is on them. Move on.
I'm kinda ok if the seller has a unique 1/1 type thing and they are waiting for a buyer to reach/overspend.... It's the run of the mill stuff that is common and listed by others and their prices are skyrocket high that I find tedious/annoying to deal with
Thanks, that was stated in the original post
Stopped looking at BIN a long time ago - it was a waste of time.
Ebay should charge for BIN listings that don't sell.
Buyer: Hi Seller 2Hi. I noticed you have a card I want but you're asking $200 for it. Seller IAMOut has it for only $100.
Seller 2Hi: when I'm out of it? I only charge 25.
Well huzzah huzzah
I also wish sellers would accept cans of green beans as payment. I've got plenty of those also.
If there are any Ebay sellers out there that accept bags of marshmallows or cans of green beans as payment, just PM me.
Glad to see your posts contribute nothing to the conversation as usual.
Agree 100%. I've read the boards regularly for the last dozen years and he is easily the biggest tool-shed this forum has ever known. Not funny, not clever, with possibly the most pathetic marital situation ever; assuming if what he says is true and not some vain attempt at "schtick".
The ball is in the sellers court. If you want the card, you have to play by his rules. You can always ask him to work with you, but it's his choice. Sometimes, sellers will work with you. I have gotten a lot of sellers to work with me on prices. If they won't budge, then I accept it.
He can be a bit tiring, but I like him anyway!
Once again this is obvious and not the point of the thread at all. I wasn't looking for the cookie cutter answers of "if the price is too high, move on" as stated in the original post. I was trying to dig deeper than the cut & paste responses. Maybe there is no real answer. Just trying to see if someone had some better insight.
Most sellers on eBay with consistent high pricing have no overhead and probably have a “day job”
That’s how you routinely ask way above market.
ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw 3, 100, 103, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ISO 1978 O-Pee-Chee in NM-MT High Grade Raw12, 21, 29, 38, 49, 65, 69, 73, 74, 81, 95, 100, 104, 110, 115, 122, 132, 133, 135, 140, 142, 151, 153, 155, 160, 161, 167, 168, 172, 179, 181, 196, 200, 204, 210, 224, 231, 240
Also, these sellers also probably have other avenues in which to sell and eBay is just a bonus if somebody hits
ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw 3, 100, 103, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ISO 1978 O-Pee-Chee in NM-MT High Grade Raw12, 21, 29, 38, 49, 65, 69, 73, 74, 81, 95, 100, 104, 110, 115, 122, 132, 133, 135, 140, 142, 151, 153, 155, 160, 161, 167, 168, 172, 179, 181, 196, 200, 204, 210, 224, 231, 240
Could be. Card shops in my area have all but died off. The internet certainly changed the hobby for sure.
I believe some sellers are probably just greedy. Not all of them, but some of them are greedy.
Now, I have cracked enough corny jokes for the night, I have to get to bed. I will see you all tomorrow. Everyone have a good night sleep, and I love you all.
-doubledragon
Agreed. Sit back and wait for a sucker approach.
In all seriousness, my wife is a wonderful person and there isn't anything I wouldn't do for her. She does get upset when I overspend on cards which is understandable because we are on a budget, but she has a big heart and I love her more than anything. She knows I tell stories about her on the forum. She doesn't mind. I do clear the stories with her first though. She knows how much my cards mean to me, so she tolerates my shenanigans. She also tolerates my affair with Joe Louis. She knows he's my schnookems.
The essence of a market economy - if they can afford to have it sit on the shelves, it will sit on shelves until someone meets their terms.
Another tenant, buyers and sellers have freedom to participate. Production and consumption of goods and services is voluntary. Individuals are free to acquire, consume, or produce as much or as little as their own needs and resources require.
Profit is encouraged. Companies that excel in a sector will profit as their share of the market expands. Some of those profits benefit individuals or investors, while other capital is channeled back into the business to seed future growth. As markets expand, producers, consumers, and workers all benefit.
Sucks, yes, as you have a specific goal in mind, however, your goal and theirs complement each other but are significantly different at the core.
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OP I don't think there is a clear answer to your question. I have found the business knowledge of a lot of hobby participants to be quite low and so some just simply have no clue how to run a business. I have also found that some ask prices that appear to be elevated and try and let the market come to them and many times it works. There are also casual sellers like me that list "museum" pieces at prices that are simply unrealistic so the item won't sell but the market will become more aware that the item exists and it enhances its overall appeal.
In my segment we went from an auction driven market years ago to either very high BIN's or very high opening bid auctions and it can be frustrating but I think many simply don't want their items to go cheap and it takes time for sellers to get more realistic on value. It does sound cookie cutter as you suggest but the best answer on an item that is readily available that you feel is overpriced is to simply move on.
I'm not suggesting that they must lower their prices. It just won't sell and you move on. Was just throwing out it there trying to figure out the mindset IF there is a mindset...….maybe not
When I am gone (or sell for retirement) my collection will be sold. I am willing to pay sometimes significantly over VCP as I am often after the top end of quality. I fully understand the supply/demand market. When you are on this end of the scale VCP starts to become meaningless. Yes, a very good starting point. However, when it is time to sell you need to find a similar like buyer. PWCC has figured this out a while ago. Top end/scarce cards get more money.
What boggles my mind is some of these museum sellers have low end cards for big dollars.
For me I just exclude these sellers on my ebay searches. I am free to bid or not to for any item.
This new ebay sales tax has now made buying at the high end even more difficult. I would tend to believe it hurts these seller more than most.
1948-76 Topps FB Sets
FB & BB HOF Player sets
1948-1993 NY Yankee Team Sets
Trust me every eBay seller that seems to "bother" you is making sales. If you ever find one of those "museum" sellers that has all zeros in his eBay past sales history, then your "why is he still doing this" question will have some validity.
This
Most of them will spend 6k to take their overpriced cards on vacation to Chicago next week.
Keep in mind, in some cases there are no "current values". Ie: item is not regularly offered on ebay, last vcp sale in the grade was 2016-17, etc. Sometimes, I'll throw a # out there and see if I get offers. To me that is the key, accept offers, at least then you know where you stand, even if you reject them all.
I have to much S**t; so if you working on sets or are a player/team collector, send me your want list, with conditions desired. Keep in mind I have a another job so please allow me a few days to respond.
For Fritsch, could it be that Ebay is their "retail", but most of their sales are "wholesale" to 4SC/NESC, BBCE and the like?
This is right on and I'll add to that. If a seller only needs to make $x profit per month and is already doing so at the higher price point, what is the motivation to sell everything all at once at a cheaper price? It can be hard, grinding work to find deals and flip for a small profit. If your able to wait for the higher price cause you don't need to worry about cash flow, why not wait for someone to come along and buy at your price? If you take a look at someone like 707, I don't think he has any concern with finances that would force him to sell quickly. If you ever look at his registry sets, you'll see very quickly he could easily survive for years just selling a couple key high-demand cards a year. He also has clients who go to him right away because they've been dealing with him for 30+ years, know he'll have any Topps card they want in the grade they want, and he'll send cards out before even getting paid. Convenience can be expensive.
Here's my perspective. I dabble in antiques and I have a successful booth in a very popular antique mall. I have an item in my booth that is worth roughly $300. I have mine tagged at $400. The reason for me that I like it and don't care if I sell it. It looks super cool in my booth and draws people in simply to look at it. It's fairly tough to find and if someone pays my asking price I'll know they love it as much as I do, which is important to me.
I know that's different from a card on eBay, but maybe not that different. Sometimes people will.be loyal to certain sellers and be willing to pay more. Sometimes people don't know any better. Or maybe sometimes it's a rare item and they don't know when they will see one again so they will pay more.
I remember a day when it was all auctions and you actually got good prices for everything. As a seller, I use the BIN feature more than traditional auctions these days. Basically because it is easier for me than having a ton go on at the same time and off at the same time. I try to set my prices as cheap or cheaper than other comparable items and sometimes they still sit. Other times the prices drop and I forget to adjust the price so I may have some items that seem overpriced. I'm not a dealer, just a regular Joe who collects and sells extra stuff to fund the stuff I actually collect. Personally, I have cards that mean nothing to me and I'm always glad to see them in the hands of a collector that will appreciate them.
But, on the other side of the coin you have the guy out there that will lowball you on everything so it doesn't matter where you set your price. Just as an example, I have a 55 Topps AA Lujack PSA 5.5 on Ebay. It is priced $20 lower than any of the others and I believe the centering is even nicer. It is also cheaper than any have sold in past auctions. Guy offers me $10 less than my asking price. I get it, you want to get cards as cheap as you can... I know I do. I'm sure they get a few hits doing this. The worst seems to be when I list Mantle cards.....the low ball offers ROLL in!
Anyhow, sorry I got way off topic here OP. But I just think that they don't have to sell anything, as has been stated before and don't care if they do. I guess if the market goes up and they don't raise their prices, they eventually get tomorrow, what they want for the card today.
When you say "overpricing" a card, you're assuming that a card priced above what you think is reasonable is "overpriced." And it sounds like you use VCP as a gauge to determine average prices. Many cards are priced and sell well above VCP either on eBay or privately for any number of reasons:
1) The card is extremely strong for the grade. If the seller has a great eye for cards and offers a PSA 9 or PSA 10 that clearly outshines other cards in that grade, sometimes those cards are priced at a premium. I'm willing to pay a premium on cards that outshine the average. I've paid it and I've charged it countless times.
2) Some sellers aren't dealers. They are collectors. If a collector isn't motivated to sell, he may list the price as a "make me sell" price to be willing to part with his item. He doesn't need to maximize turns or cash flow. If it sells, it sells. If not, he's perfectly happy keeping it in his collection. This tends to work when you have a card that is high in demand and rare (high grade or lower grade but presents amazing for the grade).
3) Some sellers who are dealers charge high prices because they offer (or think they offer) additional service or value beyond the actual card. Fast shipping, free shipping, no questions asked returns, good communication, answers questions, etc. To some, it's worth paying a premium to a seller that stands out from the rest. Agree with Peck that many dealers in the hobby are not good business people. All you have to do is walk around the national at lunch and see if you can pull dealers away from their lunch to talk to you. You can try to charge a premium price and not offer anything different from anyone else on cards that are very common and it won't get you very far. But many try.
I'll give you a recent example, as I tend to fall into camp #2. Recently, I listed a Star Jordan RC BGS 9 for $27K. Now, this particular copy had very strong centering and imo was extremely strong for the grade. The person I purchased it from thought so too because I paid a premium for it a year prior. Then two other BGS 9s sold on PWCC with noticeably worse centering and while they were the equivalent overall grade, I felt mine was still superior. They sold for about 30% less than what I was willing to accept for this card.
So when I got ebayers quoting those two prior sales, I explained why mine was priced at a premium. I also asked them if they liked that price so much, why didn't they buy it? They're either looking for a steal (I had many offers under 10K) or they don't place the same premium on the card's attributes as I do. Which is fine--that's part of selling on eBay. You have a ton of buyers that want an extraordinary card for an ordinary price. People love quoting you the lowest possible price on the grade for the best possible card in that grade. It used to bother me, but it slides right off me. Comes with the territory on eBay.
So the Jordan sat for 3 months on eBay eventually a buyer came around that appreciated it the same way I did. And he paid my price. I simply told him my price and that he was free to wait for another one to come around that matches or beats it. I did every thing I could to accommodate some of his unusual requests, and in the end, he got the card he wanted at a price he was willing to pay. And I got my price.
This approach has worked very well for me in the 15 years I've been back in the hobby. I'm sure I've frustrated a buyer or two, but to them they can freely choose to buy from somebody else.