@maxdome said:
There are no meaningful exceptions to that rule was stated first.
Then, after 1970s points out his error, he then says "except for Fenway".
If you can find someone who knows how to read to read this thread to you, what you'll find is that the first person to mention Fenway, or indeed anyone on the Red Sox, was me. I had mentioned Fenway twice, both times in the context of allowing that in that park a great outfielder could conceivably be asked to play LF, when you chimed in with an example involving the Red Sox. You pointed out an error, of sorts, except it was not an error I had made.
You wrote: Then, after 1970s points out his error, he then says "except for Fenway".
What you meant to write was: After he said "except for Fenway" twice, then 1970s pointed out his error for not excepting Fenway.
I can't help that what you intended to write was so incredibly stupid, and I have no idea why you go to such monumental lengths to prove to me that you're an idiot. You can stop, your mission has been accomplished. I think Darin has a fresh bag of Cheetos; maybe you can succeed where he has failed and get them to go in one nostril and out the other.
This is for you @thisistheshow - Jim Rice was actually a pretty good player.
@1970s said:
I'd like to know if there was any other pitching duo in the history of major league baseball that was 13-2 over a three
year World Series championship run. Fingers was a big help to these guys as well.
They were so good that the series didn't last long enough to amass as many wins, but Lefty Gomez and Monte Pearson were 8-0 over a three series Stretch. Throw in Red Ruffing and they were 11-1.
This is for you @thisistheshow - Jim Rice was actually a pretty good player.
@maxdome said:
The 76 Red's were better than the 76 A's. The 72,73 and 74 A's would of beat the 76 Red's . A's had a better all around team .
The 76 Reds would not have beat Catfish. Catfish in the playoffs from 72-74 was 7 wins and 1 loss in the postseason.
Holtzman from 72 to 74 was 6-1 in the postseason.
I'd like to know if there was any other pitching duo in the history of major league baseball that was 13-2 over a three
year World Series championship run. Fingers was a big help to these guys as well.
Oh, but the 76 Reds beat up on a Doyle Alexander and his 77 mph fastball, and a washed up, drugged up Doc Ellis, and a tired arm Catfish Hunter. Not impressive.
A's win.
72 A's took 7 games to beat 72 Reds. 76 Reds never lost a playoff or World Series game. They destroyed a 4X cy young winner in the playoffs. 76 Reds would've crushed 72 A's.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
72 A's took 7 games to beat 72 Reds. 76 Reds never lost a playoff or World Series game. They destroyed a 4X cy young winner in the playoffs. 76 Reds would've crushed 72 A's.
They scored 4 runs off Carlton in 7 IP. That's hardly "destroyed".
72 A's took 7 games to beat 72 Reds. 76 Reds never lost a playoff or World Series game. They destroyed a 4X cy young winner in the playoffs. 76 Reds would've crushed 72 A's.
They scored 4 runs off Carlton in 7 IP. That's hardly "destroyed".
Disagree. Carlton gave up 8 hits and a HR in 7 innings. Carlton 5.14 era and lost the game at veterans stadium....Not exactly one of his best starts
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Their 125-50 is the best record ever posted by a team that won the World Series. Not all Hall of Famers, obviously, but a pretty great collection of baseball players that could win games a lot of different ways. Versatile offense.
Chuck Knoblauch (2B)
Derek Jeter (SS)
Paul O’Neill (RF)
Bernie Williams (CF)
Tino Martinez (1B)
Daryl Strawberry (DH)
Scott Brosius (3B)
Jorge Posada (C)
Tim Raines (LF)
Alternates - DH Chili Davis, OF Ricky Ledee, Chad Curtis, C Joe Girardi,
1998-2000 Yankees are second to nobody as a team for sure
72 A's took 7 games to beat 72 Reds. 76 Reds never lost a playoff or World Series game. They destroyed a 4X cy young winner in the playoffs. 76 Reds would've crushed 72 A's.
They scored 4 runs off Carlton in 7 IP. That's hardly "destroyed".
Disagree. Carlton gave up 8 hits and a HR in 7 innings. Carlton 5.14 era and lost the game at veterans stadium....Not exactly one of his best starts
Big difference between "not one of his best" and "destroyed". "Destroyed" is what the Tigers did to Washburn in game 6 in 68 - 5 ER in 2 IP. 4 in 7? LOTS of guys have won games like that.
72 A's took 7 games to beat 72 Reds. 76 Reds never lost a playoff or World Series game. They destroyed a 4X cy young winner in the playoffs. 76 Reds would've crushed 72 A's.
They scored 4 runs off Carlton in 7 IP. That's hardly "destroyed".
Disagree. Carlton gave up 8 hits and a HR in 7 innings. Carlton 5.14 era and lost the game at veterans stadium....Not exactly one of his best starts
Big difference between "not one of his best" and "destroyed". "Destroyed" is what the Tigers did to Washburn in game 6 in 68 - 5 ER in 2 IP. 4 in 7? LOTS of guys have won games like that.
Well 5.14 era and having to leave the game in the middle of a inning because of getting hit on and walking batters...is not good.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
As per 76 Reds crushing 72 A's . A's were a better all around team . The A's won three in a row compared to the Reds only winning 2 in a row . The A's beat basically the same team in 72 and were without Reggie Jackson and Darold Knowles for the entire series due to injury.
Their 125-50 is the best record ever posted by a team that won the World Series. Not all Hall of Famers, obviously, but a pretty great collection of baseball players that could win games a lot of different ways. Versatile offense.
Chuck Knoblauch (2B)
Derek Jeter (SS)
Paul O’Neill (RF)
Bernie Williams (CF)
Tino Martinez (1B)
Daryl Strawberry (DH)
Scott Brosius (3B)
Jorge Posada (C)
Tim Raines (LF)
Alternates - DH Chili Davis, OF Ricky Ledee, Chad Curtis, C Joe Girardi,
1998-2000 Yankees are second to nobody as a team for sure
Great teams, none as good as the 76 Reds. They> @maxdome said:
As per 76 Reds crushing 72 A's . A's were a better all around team . The A's won three in a row compared to the Reds only winning 2 in a row . The A's beat basically the same team in 72 and were without Reggie Jackson and Darold Knowles for the entire series due to injury.
The same team? No...76 Reds scored 150 more runs than the 72 team.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Yes, basically same players. 1972 season was considered part of the 2nd dead ball period so of course they scored more in 1976 . In 1972 Reds were the second highest scoring team in MLB and barely missed being the highest scoring team . They scored way more than the A's but still couldn't beat a banged up A's squad. The 76 red were first in scoring but that wasn't against the A's pitching staff !
@maxdome said:
Yes, basically same players. 1972 season was considered part of the 2nd dead ball period so of course they scored more in 1976 . In 1972 Reds were the second highest scoring team in MLB and barely missed being the highest scoring team . They scored way more than the A's but still couldn't beat a banged up A's squad. The 76 red were first in scoring but that wasn't against the A's pitching staff !
1976 Phillies Pitching staff had a better pitcher than any of those A's pitchers. Plus a Pitcher who won 283 games.
Reds were undefeated in the playoffs in 76.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
The 1976 Reds scored a lot more runs than the 1972 Reds because they replaced Menke and Tolan with Foster and Griffey, and Concepcion went from absolutely putrid as a hitter to pretty good. The run context of the league didn't change from 1972 to 1976; there were 0.07 more runs per game in 1976, but that was mostly because the Reds got so much better (4.59 runs per game to 5.29 runs per game).
This is for you @thisistheshow - Jim Rice was actually a pretty good player.
Well 5.14 era and having to leave the game in the middle of a inning because of getting hit on and walking batters...is not good.
Didn't say it was good. But 2 ER through 7 IP is definitely not "destroyed". Giving up a double and a walk in the 8th and then leaving is not "destroyed". The game was 3-1 when he left it.
A's had a better pitching staff than 76 Phillies. Carlton was great but didn't have one of his best season's in 1976.
Team ERA for 76 Phillies 3.08 league average 3.51
Team ERA for 72 A's 2.58 league average 3.26. 73 A's 3.29 league average 3.74 . 74 A's 2.95 league average 3.62.
@maxdome said:
A's had a better pitching staff than 76 Phillies. Carlton was great but didn't have one of his best season's in 1976.
Team ERA for 76 Phillies 3.08 league average 3.51
Team ERA for 72 A's 2.58 league average 3.26. 73 A's 3.29 league average 3.74 . 74 A's 2.95 league average 3.62.
All of that is an illusion caused by the fact that Oakland was a pitcher's park; everyone who pitched in Oakland, home team and visitors, saw their ERA's go down. bb-ref shows the ERA+ for the entire team: for the 1976 Phillies it was 115 (15% better than league average), 1972 A's - 111; 1973 A's - 109; 1974 A's - 113. The A"s pitching staff was very good for that stretch, but the 1976 Phillies staff was a little bit better.
This is for you @thisistheshow - Jim Rice was actually a pretty good player.
@1970s said:
What Dallas and some of you fail to realize is that some players throughout the history of major league baseball had the ABILITY to come up huge in the postseason. They brought that little bit of extra when the moment mattered the most.
What Dallas can do is read, and understand context. If you could read the post I was responding to, you'd see that it referenced the regular season stats of the A's and Phillies, so my reply addressed that.
I can't remember if you asked me to let you know when it happened or not, but yes, your stalking of me is starting to cross the line to "creepy". Not sure if that's a problem or if that was your goal, but forewarned is forearmed.
This is for you @thisistheshow - Jim Rice was actually a pretty good player.
1972 World Series in which only 3 of the seven games was played in Oakland.
Player AVG HR RBI
Bench .261 1 1 League MVP and had one of the best seasons ever for a catcher
Morgan .125 0 1 One of the greatest
@maxdome said:
1972 World Series in which only 3 of the seven games was played in Oakland.
Player AVG HR RBI
Bench .261 1 1 League MVP and had one of the best seasons ever for a catcher
Morgan .125 0 1 One of the greatest
Rose .214 1 2 All time hits leader
No match for the A's pitching !
Took the A's 5 games in 72 to beat the Tigers. 76 Reds were unstoppable. Slim chance A's wouldve taken 1 game.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
@garnettstyle said:
Great pitching dont always win championships. The 1979 Baltimore Orioles staff had 3 Cy Young winners, and lost to the Lumber Company.
But great pitching usually does beat great hitting, and everyone here knows it.
However, there are a few mushroom eaters here who are grasping at straws. Everyone here
is enjoying their folly, so please, carry on.
Great pitching didnt beat the Reds awesome lineup in 75 and 76.
Atlanta Braves only won 1 championship in the 90's.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
@1970s said:
What Dallas and some of you fail to realize is that some players throughout the history of major league baseball had the ABILITY to come up huge in the postseason. They brought that little bit of extra when the moment mattered the most.
What Dallas can do is read, and understand context. If you could read the post I was responding to, you'd see that it referenced the regular season stats of the A's and Phillies, so my reply addressed that.
I can't remember if you asked me to let you know when it happened or not, but yes, your stalking of me is starting to cross the line to "creepy". Not sure if that's a problem or if that was your goal, but forewarned is forearmed.
When one is losing a discussion, one tends to stray away from the subject on hand.
Please stick to the subject.
Oh that's right, you have nothing left to offer. All your bullets are blanks. Your efforts futile.
Swing and a miss. A three putt. Wide right. Mike Schmidt in the postseason.
@garnettstyle said:
Great pitching dont always win championships. The 1979 Baltimore Orioles staff had 3 Cy Young winners, and lost to the Lumber Company.
But great pitching usually does beat great hitting, and everyone here knows it.
However, there are a few mushroom eaters here who are grasping at straws. Everyone here
is enjoying their folly, so please, carry on.
Great pitching didnt beat the Reds awesome lineup in 75 and 76.
Atlanta Braves only won 1 championship in the 90's.
Atlanta ? Yeah. Yankees pitching was pretty darn good too, and Atlanta had pitchers who couldn't outperform in the postseason like Catfish, Fingers, and Holtzman could. It's that easy.
Great pitching faced the Reds in 76 ? A washed up, drugged up Doc Ellis. 77mph Doyle Alexander, and a tired arm towards the end of his career Catfish Hunter ?
Nice try.
76 Phillies pitching staff were better than the 72 A's staff.
Nice try.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
No stadium in baseball had more foul territory than the Oakland Coliseum. In fact, statisticians believe that the large amount of foul territory takes five to 10 points off of every batter’s batting average.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Comments
If you can find someone who knows how to read to read this thread to you, what you'll find is that the first person to mention Fenway, or indeed anyone on the Red Sox, was me. I had mentioned Fenway twice, both times in the context of allowing that in that park a great outfielder could conceivably be asked to play LF, when you chimed in with an example involving the Red Sox. You pointed out an error, of sorts, except it was not an error I had made.
You wrote: Then, after 1970s points out his error, he then says "except for Fenway".
What you meant to write was: After he said "except for Fenway" twice, then 1970s pointed out his error for not excepting Fenway.
I can't help that what you intended to write was so incredibly stupid, and I have no idea why you go to such monumental lengths to prove to me that you're an idiot. You can stop, your mission has been accomplished. I think Darin has a fresh bag of Cheetos; maybe you can succeed where he has failed and get them to go in one nostril and out the other.
They were so good that the series didn't last long enough to amass as many wins, but Lefty Gomez and Monte Pearson were 8-0 over a three series Stretch. Throw in Red Ruffing and they were 11-1.
72 A's took 7 games to beat 72 Reds. 76 Reds never lost a playoff or World Series game. They destroyed a 4X cy young winner in the playoffs. 76 Reds would've crushed 72 A's.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Reds currently have a nine game winning streak in the World Series. Not sure what the record is.
http://www.unisquare.com/store/brick/
Ralph
They scored 4 runs off Carlton in 7 IP. That's hardly "destroyed".
Disagree. Carlton gave up 8 hits and a HR in 7 innings. Carlton 5.14 era and lost the game at veterans stadium....Not exactly one of his best starts
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
1998-2000 Yankees are second to nobody as a team for sure
ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw 3, 100, 103, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________ISO 1978 O-Pee-Chee in NM-MT High Grade Raw12, 21, 29, 38, 49, 65, 69, 73, 74, 81, 95, 100, 104, 110, 115, 122, 132, 133, 135, 140, 142, 151, 153, 155, 160, 161, 167, 168, 172, 179, 181, 196, 200, 204, 210, 224, 231, 240
Big difference between "not one of his best" and "destroyed". "Destroyed" is what the Tigers did to Washburn in game 6 in 68 - 5 ER in 2 IP. 4 in 7? LOTS of guys have won games like that.
Well 5.14 era and having to leave the game in the middle of a inning because of getting hit on and walking batters...is not good.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
As per 76 Reds crushing 72 A's . A's were a better all around team . The A's won three in a row compared to the Reds only winning 2 in a row . The A's beat basically the same team in 72 and were without Reggie Jackson and Darold Knowles for the entire series due to injury.
Great teams, none as good as the 76 Reds. They> @maxdome said:
The same team? No...76 Reds scored 150 more runs than the 72 team.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Yes, basically same players. 1972 season was considered part of the 2nd dead ball period so of course they scored more in 1976 . In 1972 Reds were the second highest scoring team in MLB and barely missed being the highest scoring team . They scored way more than the A's but still couldn't beat a banged up A's squad. The 76 red were first in scoring but that wasn't against the A's pitching staff !
1976 Phillies Pitching staff had a better pitcher than any of those A's pitchers. Plus a Pitcher who won 283 games.
Reds were undefeated in the playoffs in 76.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
The 1976 Reds scored a lot more runs than the 1972 Reds because they replaced Menke and Tolan with Foster and Griffey, and Concepcion went from absolutely putrid as a hitter to pretty good. The run context of the league didn't change from 1972 to 1976; there were 0.07 more runs per game in 1976, but that was mostly because the Reds got so much better (4.59 runs per game to 5.29 runs per game).
Didn't say it was good. But 2 ER through 7 IP is definitely not "destroyed". Giving up a double and a walk in the 8th and then leaving is not "destroyed". The game was 3-1 when he left it.
A's had a better pitching staff than 76 Phillies. Carlton was great but didn't have one of his best season's in 1976.
Team ERA for 76 Phillies 3.08 league average 3.51
Team ERA for 72 A's 2.58 league average 3.26. 73 A's 3.29 league average 3.74 . 74 A's 2.95 league average 3.62.
All of that is an illusion caused by the fact that Oakland was a pitcher's park; everyone who pitched in Oakland, home team and visitors, saw their ERA's go down. bb-ref shows the ERA+ for the entire team: for the 1976 Phillies it was 115 (15% better than league average), 1972 A's - 111; 1973 A's - 109; 1974 A's - 113. The A"s pitching staff was very good for that stretch, but the 1976 Phillies staff was a little bit better.
Talk all you want about illusions. A's won three straight World Series !
What Dallas can do is read, and understand context. If you could read the post I was responding to, you'd see that it referenced the regular season stats of the A's and Phillies, so my reply addressed that.
I can't remember if you asked me to let you know when it happened or not, but yes, your stalking of me is starting to cross the line to "creepy". Not sure if that's a problem or if that was your goal, but forewarned is forearmed.
1972 World Series in which only 3 of the seven games was played in Oakland.
Player AVG HR RBI
Bench .261 1 1 League MVP and had one of the best seasons ever for a catcher
Morgan .125 0 1 One of the greatest
Rose .214 1 2 All time hits leader
No match for the A's pitching !
Took the A's 5 games in 72 to beat the Tigers. 76 Reds were unstoppable. Slim chance A's wouldve taken 1 game.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Great pitching dont always win championships. The 1979 Baltimore Orioles staff had 3 Cy Young winners, and lost to the Lumber Company.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
Great pitching didnt beat the Reds awesome lineup in 75 and 76.
Atlanta Braves only won 1 championship in the 90's.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
😂😂😂
76 Phillies pitching staff were better than the 72 A's staff.
Nice try.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
72 A's starters ERA 76 Phillies starters ERA
Hunter 2.04 HOF Carlton 3.13 HOF
Holtzman 2.51 Kaat 3.48
Odom 2.50 Lonborg 3.08
Blue 2.80 Christenson 3.68
Hamilton 2.93 Underwood 3.53
Bull Pen Bullpen
Fingers 2.51 HOF Reed 2.46
Horlen 3.00 McGraw 2.50
Locker 2.65 Garber 2.82
Knowles 1.57 Twitchell 1.75
Waslewski 2.04 Schueler 2.90
No stadium in baseball had more foul territory than the Oakland Coliseum. In fact, statisticians believe that the large amount of foul territory takes five to 10 points off of every batter’s batting average.
IT CAN'T BE A TRUE PLAYOFF UNLESS THE BIG TEN CHAMPIONS ARE INCLUDED
1972 Catfish Hunter ERA at home 1.66 Away 2.58
1976 Steve Carlton ERA at home 2.16 Away 4.16
Seems like home helped the Phillies more than A's !