The downfall of Dual Grading

jradke4

So, I had an order pop last Friday. I sent in 5 cards from two different sets for dual card/auto grading. All are sticker auto's and I am presuming all obtained (at least for each company) at the same time. These are all new cards so I could have sent them in for just card grading but decided why not just do the dual card/auto. Well the results show what that was a bad idea...some how they were unable to render an opinion on 3 of the 5 autographs.

Line # Item # Cert # Grade Description Type
1 1 Auto Grade: Inconclusive/Unable to Render Opinion 2006 Topps Triple Threads Relic Autograph 61 Brett Favre Gold Card
2 1 42697413 Item Grade: MINT 9
Auto Grade: GEM MT 10 2006 Topps Triple Threads Relic Autograph 63 Brett Favre Red PSA/DNA Certified Card
3 1 42697414 Item Grade: NEAR MINT-MINT 8
Auto Grade: GEM MT 10 2006 Playoff National Treasures 73 Brett Favre Signature-Gold PSA/DNA Certified Card
4 1 Auto Grade: Inconclusive/Unable to Render Opinion 2006 Playoff National Treasures 73 Brett Favre Material Signature-Jersey Number Card
5 1 Auto Grade: Inconclusive/Unable to Render Opinion 2006 Playoff National Treasures Timeline Materials Sign-AFC/NFC TL-BF Brett Favre Card

More than likely I will send the other three back for just card grading so I can add them to my Favre Master set. But I find these results rather shocking.

jradke4

PopeyesSpinach

Favre has a pretty distinct Auto and I'm sure you're very familiar with it. Did they look good to you? If so I don't see why they had a problem with them. Pretty strange

craig44

I think many collectors would be surprised how many autos that are "certified" by the card companies are not authentic. They do not view these signings and are trusting the athletes. Good on PSA for actually checking the auto instead of just slapping authentic on the slab.

alifaxwa2

I am confused... did you send these to PSA or PSA/DNA?

jradke4

Well the issue is PSA/DNA is just an opinion. I have had things fail that I have sent into the the only place the person signs from. In this case I sent two items signed at the same time. One passed PSA/DNA the other failed PSA/DNA.

Craig44, what I don't get is how one sticker passes but the other one from the same company didn't. More than likely the whole sheet that they were using for cards for that year were signed all at the same time. I do agree its great that they get the fakes out of the hobby. But Favre was one of the first athletes that was worried about fake autographs. That is one of the reasons he only signs through one source. And every autograph that he has signed since around 1996 comes with a sticker of his own. Now that's not the case for these cards. But as Popeye says he does have a pretty distinct auto.

jradke4

They were sent to PSA for dual autograph and card grading. from PSA "Autographed cards dated pre-1998 or those not certified directly through the manufacturer must be submitted under this service. Any autographed cards dated 1998 to present and certified through the manufacturer can be submitted under the Card Submission form under any service level, but may also be submitted under the Dual Service."

You do have a choice in if you want post-1998 company issued autographed cards submitted under the dual service.

@alifaxwa2 said:
I am confused... did you send these to PSA or PSA/DNA?

dan89

These cards were graded and sent in for auto grade to be added. Put minimum of 10 for auto grade as these are really sweet. Popped today and clearly I am pleased. Will post when in new holders.

alifaxwa2

@jradke4 said:
They were sent to PSA for dual autograph and card grading. from PSA "Autographed cards dated pre-1998 or those not certified directly through the manufacturer must be submitted under this service. Any autographed cards dated 1998 to present and certified through the manufacturer can be submitted under the Card Submission form under any service level, but may also be submitted under the Dual Service."

You do have a choice in if you want post-1998 company issued autographed cards submitted under the dual service.

@alifaxwa2 said:
I am confused... did you send these to PSA or PSA/DNA?

I know that stuff. I didn't realize the only way to get an auto grade was to have the auto authenticated despite being post 1998.

wrestlingcardking

I had a 1991 Lou Albano from the card company come back as questionable. I know the background of the signing as the signed cards were in the presence of the company employee but psa DNA failed this card of mine.

ReggieCleveland

Sorry you got jammed up on your sub but this is actually a fantastic piece of news.

There's been some forgeries on high-dollar "certified" sticker autos hit the market lately, including a '09 Bowman Chrome Trout rookie. If an auto gets smudged or damaged -- or even if it just won't grade out as a 10 -- some people are wiping the authentic auto off the card and forging the player's auto back onto the sticker, knowing that the grading companies weren't even checking the autos on all these modern certified sticker cards. It's gotten pretty bad.

So to see that they're not only checking the autos now but doing so in such detail that they're holding back authenticity on some is great news. I think PSA saw how BGS was getting torn apart and figured they'd better step up their game. Nice work, PSA.

Arthur

jradke4

@ReggieCleveland said:
Sorry you got jammed up on your sub but this is actually a fantastic piece of news.

There's been some forgeries on high-dollar "certified" sticker autos hit the market lately, including a '09 Bowman Chrome Trout rookie. If an auto gets smudged or damaged -- or even if it just won't grade out as a 10 -- some people are wiping the authentic auto off the card and forging the player's auto back onto the sticker, knowing that the grading companies weren't even checking the autos on all these modern certified sticker cards. It's gotten pretty bad.

So to see that they're not only checking the autos now but doing so in such detail that they're holding back authenticity on some is great news. I think PSA saw how BGS was getting torn apart and figured they'd better step up their game. Nice work, PSA.

Arthur

well all five cards were obtained from another Favre collector. now i don't know where he obtained them from. but i do know that he doesn't have his cards graded either. from what i remember none of them looked like too out of place. i have seen quite a few Favre signatures over the years.