2019 Topps WWE Transcendant 1/1 Andre The Giant Cut Signature

Dpeck100

This item is going to bring a big price. Nice to see such spirited bidding.

I am thinking over $6,500

No bids from me

LOTSOS

I’ve seen a few of these listings. The cards themselves are very, very nice. The cuts however are horrible. This one is a perfect example. You couldn’t find a cut that fits the window or at the very least size the window to the cut? I saw a Andre and Bobby the Brain 1/1 on twitter and it was the same thing. A cut that didn’t fit the window.

I’m not a wrestling collector at all but I would assume that autos should be relatively plentiful to find cuts from. Great idea. Executed poorly.

Kevin

Dpeck100

@LOTSOS

I agree. Not overly impressed with the layout of the signatures.

One really cool thing about this release is it does feature legit Vince autos.

I like seeing Topps put out a product that modern collectors are bidding to the moon.

KNAPP

In my opinion both Andre autographs from this set are fake.

LOTSOS

@KNAPP said:
In my opinion both Andre autographs from this set are fake.

Just curious could you elaborate for those of us not nearly as familiar as you with the auto?

Thanks
Kevin

Dpeck100

When I first saw this card pop up on EBAY I shared the auction on my Facebook page and my comment was this auto looks like one of the index cards I have purchased that I can't get to pass third party authentication.

On my friends list is a collector who has a ton of signed Wrestling All Stars and used to work for JSA and he quickly said he thought both were fake. We chatted on the phone yesterday about it and he said a lot of bad stuff of Andre has passed the authenticators.

The Andre auto is an interesting one because the price is high enough where it has to bring out forgers. Quite frankly I am not sure how anyone can know for certain on some of his stuff due to changes in the size of his hand, extreme alcohol intake, anger as his life progressed, holding a picture up vs. an item being flat, size of the pen, variance in signature style over the years etc. Everything I have read is Andre was very fan friendly during the first half of his career but got much less accessible as time went on.

I doubt Topps offers any guarantee and if these autos were bought in a slab and cracked out for use they have the cover they would need I would think.

Here is the auction link.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/ANDRE-THE-GIANT-Signed-2019-Topps-WWE-Transcendent-1-1-Cut-Autographed-AUTO-6x8/382789182952?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649

Dpeck100

From another board.

This doesn't sound too promising.

this was posted in Houdini's first Transcendent break thread by Shatteredsoul14 and got buried pretty quickly as it was posted just prior to the random he also shared an image of the auto encapsulated by Beckett...

Something you should know about the Andre autos in this set. The one singular andre one shown in the preview for this release came from me.

Its very similar to the one that was pulled in this break.

I had about 8 or 9 of those Andres authenticated by beckett a year and a half ago or so. I bought a larger collection and when i went to get more authenticated by beckett, they refused to even look at them.

So either they are legit andre autos, or beckett made a mistake authenticating them and no longer believe they are real. there seemed to be a bunch of those andres floating around and i still have quite a few of them.

so yeah beware of authenticity i guess. and if you do think they are legit, hit me up, ill sell some to you for great deals.

KNAPP

I am not an expert, but I've been collecting Andre autographs for over 15 years now and have over 70 autographs with over 40 of them authenticated. Yes, Andre's auto has changed over the years, but there a few characteristics that stayed the same. About a year or two ago a buddy of mine obtained a huge lot of wrestling autographs with many of them being Andre. The two Topps cuts that were turned into cards came out of this lot. The autographs came with a story. I didn't like the autographs or the story. Most of the Andre autographs were signed wrestling magazines. My buddy is very knowledgeable, but I hate to say it, I think he bought the story. For the record, this same buddy has found some of the best wrestling autographs in the hobby. Back to autograph. The "N" in a real Andre auto did not connect with the "D". The "D" did not loop from the low point of the "D". If that makes any sense. The "G" in giant is unusually short and the angle is slightly irregular. Beckett authenticated several from this lot, but they will not authenticate any more from the same lot. My guess is that they finally realized they messed up. I would be very curios if PSA or JSA would authenticate these.

SpinFadeSplash23

Even more reason why In-Person authenticated autographs will be what collectors need in the future. This is scary stuff.

LOTSOS

@KNAPP & @Dpeck100 Thanks for taking the time I've to reply and sharing your knowledge! Crazy to think that you have to have concerns about the authenticity of autos directly from a card company. But as you said if they cracked TPG examples they have their cover.

KNAPP

1970s I get your point. I have autos that one or two letters are totally different. That happens, I get it. You should never just look at one part of an auto and say it didn't match, so it must be bad. There was more to critique about the Andre autos, but I only pointed out three points. Anyway, you couldn't pay me to have those two autos in my collection. Topps bought the cheapest authenticated Andre autos that were on the market and made them into cards. Such a big company should have went to the top 3 authentication companies and if they all said it was good, then they should have moved forward with making the cards.

Dpeck100

Conceptually I love autographs but I think there is so much margin for error that it is a really tough segment. I was just having a conversation this week with my brother Bill and took out a piece of paper and signed it six or seven times. At first I tried my hardest to sign it with my best looking signature. I let it get a little more sloppy and then signed it like I would a receipt at 2:45 AM paying for bottle service. You can see the correlation on the first few but after that there is a zero percent chance you would know those were indeed signed by the same person. This to me is the toughest part about autograph collecting because someone with excellent penmanship could easily learn to sign like a persons primary autograph and the actual person you want the autograph from can sign it completely different and it still be their signature.

Dpeck100

Here are my two "Andre autos" I purchased both from a very reputable dealer on EBAY. She has sold legit Elvis autos, John Wayne and many other entertainment related autos. The one from 1978 supposedly was gotten in Oklahoma after a match with Harley Race. I don't remember the date but they did wrestle then. I don't have a lot in them and actually I have spent more trying to get them authenticated at this point than I originally paid. I showed them to someone from NY that got a lot of in person autos from wrestlers that I used to talk to frequently and he thought they were real. I am not sure if I will ever know for certain. I actually had kind of forgotten what they looked like and they aren't that close to the signature used for that card.

HighGradeLegends

@SpinFadeSplash23 said:
Even more reason why In-Person authenticated autographs will be what collectors need in the future. This is scary stuff.

Agreed, but tough when they are deceased, like Andre

KNAPP

This debate could go on forever. I wish this hobby was full of honest people, but unfortunately it isn't. Dpeck this person from NY, did he ask you to sell any items on ebay for him?

Dpeck100

@KNAPP said:
This debate could go on forever. I wish this hobby was full of honest people, but unfortunately it isn't. Dpeck this person from NY, did he ask you to sell any items on ebay for him?

You know who it is. We had a falling out last year and I won't speak with him.

KNAPP

We are getting off topic, but why do think he asked you? Because you have a great reputation in the hobby and he wanted you to sell his nonsense.

Dpeck100

@KNAPP said:
We are getting off topic, but why do think he asked you? Because you have a great reputation in the hobby and he wanted you to sell his nonsense.

Yes. I sell my own items and for the most part have gotten very strong prices for the items or at least at the time they were sold and he felt I could get higher prices than if he sold them himself.

I did try and help him once and listed some Gino autograph but after getting a very nasty message on EBAY from whomever the person is that comes on here and debates that topic only I pulled it and said sorry there is nothing in this for me I am out. Sell it yourself. Not sure if it ever sold or not.

Dpeck100

@1970s said:
Let's all keep in mind that there are thousands upon thousands of legit autos on the market.
From Babe Ruth to Hulk Hogan to many other sport superstars, millions of legit autos are
out on the market. The sad thing is that many fakes are out there as well. You just have to know your source.

No doubt. I have several hundred signed wrestling cards that I had done for me at the various wrestling conventions in card savers and there is no doubt they are real. I have sold some to other collectors to help them with their Wrestling All Stars signed sets because I am not trying to complete one and all have passed PSA/DNA so you are spot on.

Dpeck100

@1970s said:
That's right. Keep in mind though that all it takes is for a guy like you to want to "become bigger" in the hobby. These guys start out like straight shooters, get a following, and then one day reason that because they are trusted, they now can make lots of coin off of their good reputation.

Not saying this would ever happen to you, and please don't even think it. But just look at Tropicana Orange Juice, the most trusted OJ company in America. They began selling Trop50 years ago. It was advertised as having less this and less that. It tastes great. More people started to buy it. Thing is that all they did was add water to the product to give it less sugar, and less calories. They figured they could make more money this way, and they did. People were buying watered down OJ without even knowing it.

Anyone who's heart is in the money will do this. Anyone who's heart is in the integrity of
the hobby for himself and others, and wants to sleep well at night, will do the right thing.

Being that you and I are most likely collectors and not dealers, I'm sure we would never
want any fakes in our own collections, or in others.

I would be weary of big ebay sellers and autos. I wouldn't trust them one bit, but to each
their own.

Yeah definitely just a collector here but do sell some things occasionally. I agree completely with your point and would never knowingly sell something that was a forgery and if I did would certainly take it back and face the financial repercussions myself.

KNAPP

Two days to go.

Dpeck100

@KNAPP said:
Two days to go.

It will be interesting to see with the information that has been posted online how this auction turns out. Obviously not everyone checks online forums so they might be oblivious to it and others might just want this "1/1".

Other cards from this set apparently have been really disappointing and people are losing heavily on this product. No interest here. If anyone is going to drop this kind of cash on a signed Andre it needs to look like your avatar.

KNAPP

Andre

Dpeck100

The Andre auto didn't get much more action. I have to think the information discussed online slowed the momentum of the auction.

Here is an interesting Andre "auto"

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Andre-the-Giant-Signed-Wrestling-Photo-/273735216370?_trksid=p2047675.m43663.l44720&nordt=true&rt=nc&orig_cvip=true

I am shocked this went for $540 when the seller made an update when it was at $22. I knew this item looked super familiar and I have a copy but mine doesn't have the stamp in the lower left corner. I did the same thing and thought it looked real at first and maybe just faded and bought a lot for maybe $40 or less. What makes it so believable is when you look at the picture in hand it looks like there is actual pen marks that are just broken up. I think it is just the glossy printing.

Here is my copy.

This is a really cool Canadian item that came with it and it is a fold out with a poster on the other side of Pat Patterson and Raymond Rougeau. They held the titles in June of 1980 so it would make sense with Hulk and Andre feuding in the Northeast that it would be from around that time.

KNAPP

The Jean Ferre photo has a facsimile autograph. I messaged the person through ebay and he changed the listing. The buyer took a loss on this one.

Dpeck100

@KNAPP said:
The Jean Ferre photo has a facsimile autograph. I messaged the person through ebay and he changed the listing. The buyer took a loss on this one.

I have a feeling this item is getting sent back once in hand. When the seller did his update he stated he would accept returns.

You would have thought that update would have been a strong enough signal to bidders that the item wasn't real. I guess the fear of missing out is just too strong for some.

jgraben

@Dpeck100 said:

@KNAPP said:
This debate could go on forever. I wish this hobby was full of honest people, but unfortunately it isn't. Dpeck this person from NY, did he ask you to sell any items on ebay for him?

You know who it is. We had a falling out last year and I won't speak with him.

You know, I gotta say, EVERYTHING I ever bought from “This Person From New York” would not pass PSA/DNA Authentication. It always came with JSA Certs, but every time I sent the stuff from “This Person from New York” to PSA, it always came back Questionable Authenticity. He offered me several AMAZING....almost “Unbelievable” items, but after the first stuff that I tried to crossover came back questionable, I couldn’t do it again.

wrestlingcardking

@jgraben said:

@Dpeck100 said:

@KNAPP said:
This debate could go on forever. I wish this hobby was full of honest people, but unfortunately it isn't. Dpeck this person from NY, did he ask you to sell any items on ebay for him?

You know who it is. We had a falling out last year and I won't speak with him.

You know, I gotta say, EVERYTHING I ever bought from “This Person From New York” would not pass PSA/DNA Authentication. It always came with JSA Certs, but every time I sent the stuff from “This Person from New York” to PSA, it always came back Questionable Authenticity. He offered me several AMAZING....almost “Unbelievable” items, but after the first stuff that I tried to crossover came back questionable, I couldn’t do it again.

Your signature line debut is pretty epic JGraben! LOL

Cooptown

Bumping this thread up. I listened to Thats Sports Card Show that had Dpeck as a guest. This thread came up and I searched it out to read through it. Lots of informative stuff here.

Dpeck100

@Cooptown said:
Bumping this thread up. I listened to Thats Sports Card Show that had Dpeck as a guest. This thread came up and I searched it out to read through it. Lots of informative stuff here.

Thanks for listening.

I will put Knapp's opinion above everyone's on Andre signatures.

KNAPP

Thanks David.

Dpeck100

Here is the link to the show

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/episode-55-david-peck-pro-wrestling-legend-kevin-sullivan/id1172062333?i=1000467839816

KNAPP

I enjoyed the show.

Bad Andre auto

BAS Encapsulate Serial Number: 0010264093
• Andre the Giant – 4” x 5” Cut
• Date Graded – Wednesday, December 13, 2017
• This item sold at Iconic Auctions on June 23, 2018 for $1455.09 (includes buyer’s premium).
• This Andre cut was later used by Topps for their 2019 WWE Transcendent Collection – Andre the Giant Tribute Cut Signature Autograph 1/1 Card # C –AG.

Dpeck100

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Andre-the-Giant-deceased-Pro-wrestler-autographed-check-/274341901199?hash=item3fe00d338f:g:6iEAAOSwO8xenJ0w&nma=true&si=YGsAj1iDYIatoOap%2BuZCPhTx34Q%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&fbclid=IwAR3r8ObXAeYdXLTpssjdxc89mlri7TuWkPdwYgIO6bY1xfUR_UcRVH3Xijg

Just adding this to the thread. A great reference point on how Andre signed his name when he just used the Andre signature.

Super cool item.

GColton48

@Dpeck100 said:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Andre-the-Giant-deceased-Pro-wrestler-autographed-check-/274341901199?hash=item3fe00d338f:g:6iEAAOSwO8xenJ0w&nma=true&si=YGsAj1iDYIatoOap%2BuZCPhTx34Q%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557&fbclid=IwAR3r8ObXAeYdXLTpssjdxc89mlri7TuWkPdwYgIO6bY1xfUR_UcRVH3Xijg

Just adding this to the thread. A great reference point on how Andre signed his name when he just used the Andre signature.

Super cool item.

Very cool! Tough auto to find - and that's about as legit as it gets. Good stuff.