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Ebay Return Policy-Sellers prepare to get fleeced.....WOWZA!
Verno
Posts: 325 ✭✭✭
Did you know you can buy gold on ebay , and then if it goes down in the next 30 days you can return it for a full refund at your original purchase price(minus of course the retun postage fees of about $2 an ounce)? Same with coins...no more restocking fee...policy 1 week old....have my own story...can anyone think of ways to abuse this system...oh let me count the ways.....no skin in the game for buyers....told ebay they finally jumped the shark.... PS I am on the record as very pro ebay RJ
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But what if the gold was listed in us coins and someone used 10% ebucks coupon on it
Please note my scenario is fact...talked to high value return representative and worked through a number of scenarios....he confirmed above....they are super anaware of the anintended consequences of the new policy
Well, what are they going to do about it?
So Is Mine. But of course not in all cases.
my scenario ...
Buyer buys gold in us coin category and uses a 10% ebucks coupon.
If Gold moves down, say 5%, in 30days, the buyer is still ahead.
If Gold moves up, buyer gets the extra bonus, price appreciation, plus protection, a sweet deal.
As a seller, If You list your gold in US Coin during an ebay 10% period, and the buyer uses the 10%, you are also somewhat protected.
That's all.
They said they would act if/when they get more complaints...I told most will not compain, they will just not list..they totally do not get that the market place will police itself and that what make ebay different than other sites is the abilty to negotiate between buyer and seller in a "safe" envirnoment...a restocking fee is seller protection...they do not understand that.
How about this scenario....1894 Morgan Dollar in AU 58 on ebay for $2750....buyer(maybe a dealer) pm you that he will pay you $2350....you accept using make an offer as part of reply system( under old policy, 10% restocking fee protects you) ...he get 10% ebay bucks, charges to paypal credit card...now he take to a client for $2650...client says not exactly what he wanted....he sends it back to you...cost him $3....no money out of pocket. Buyer has all the upside...under best circumstances you broke even...why bother?
How about your scenario (assuming the Morgan is in a NGC holder) where instead of showing it to a client, he sends it to PCGS for crossover at same grade or above? I have actually had this done to me a long time ago by a dealer who said "he had a client"...….
“In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock." - Thomas Jefferson
My digital cameo album 1950-64 Cameos - take a look!
You can do a lot of things to game the system with 30 days and not having to worry about any VIG
This has been covered in paranoid detail in other threads.
Much ado about nothing.
They're would be no point. If you buy it and it goes up $30, you can't make any money with bid/ ask spread. If it goes down 30, you could return it, but what would be the point? So you can buy it again after it goes up?
How often does gold move enough to make it worth even trying? How much money are you going to parkin my bank account for a month going to make $20?
I've begun offering free returns since March or April. I have the same return rate as last year.
But, if you believe in this, it's just another reason to be sympathetic to the coin dealers that get flack around her sometimes
And the biggest reason this is bunk, you can always come a chargeback out to 180 days in many cases. The Ebay 30 days is the least of your problems. The payment processors are much more generous.
Under the old policy I had someone buy a V nickel. Try to clean it by polishing it, then return under SNAD.
There's nothing in the new policy that you couldn't do in the old policy using the magic SNAD or CC chargeback.
Funny that my analysis of a bad business decision by one of my valued partners is "paranoid"....there is absolutely no upside to the policy, good sellers that value their time will not list as many items & I was merely pointing out that the return policy is just part of the negotiating that goes on between a buyer and a seller and if it is stripped away by edict then prices have to go up and number of deals will have to go down. Econ 101... I assure you that price is the number 1 concern of most buyers.
Can you PM your ebay link so I can get a feel for the type of coins you sell? Thanks, RJ
Duplicate
Like most safes are only good for keeping honest men out, the restocking fee was sgood for keeping honest men honest...no more no less, crooks and abusers will always beat the system if the want to...but why make it easier?
You don't have to offer to take returns. If you have to offer returns to maintain a final value fee discount, bullion is exempt - you don't have to offer returns on bullion to keep a FVF discount.
Give Me Liberty or Give Me Debt
Wow! I never thought about this before. But couldn't you just not allow returns for any bullion coins?
YN Member of the ANA, ANS, NBS, EAC, C4, MCA, PNNA, CSNS, ILNA, TEC, and more!
Always buying numismatic literature and sample slabs.
Maybe the buyer just didn't like the coin, say the picture depicted an original toned coin, but the buyer received a brilliant hardly toned coin and not to his liking. It could happen, I think it depends largely on how fast the return comes back into the seller. Looking at pictures and trying to decide on a purchase is still tough on Ebay, I don't think I would expect too many people would do the above, no real money in it, but the gold price no risk for 30 days that makes for gaming the system.
Sellers can select No Returns.
I just bought some nice gold on a No Return listing. And I was pleased. I guess you have to find reputable sellers to do that, of course.
"paranoid detail" refered to the other thread.
"everythingvaluable.com" on eBay
You can always SNAD!
You are assuming that the buyer would still have bought the gold with say a 5% bucks promotion.
Having said that, I have had very few problems with Ebay returns.
Just got hit by a fly by non payer though.
We had this debate about two weeks ago if I recall correctly. There is a small but die hard cohort who still believes that eBay is god's gift to man. The rest of us think eBay is abusive.
The fact that you keep repeating this over and over again doesn't make it anymore true in this thread than it did in the last one. I repeat, no credit card company will allow you to do a large number of charge backs nor will PayPal without terminating your account privileges. If you offer a 30 day return privilege (even if coerced by eBay), eBay will not boot a buyer who uses it often and why would it if the buyer is complying with the terms of the listing? Unlike other retailers, eBay doesn't have much skin in the game. It doesn't do distribution (for the most part) and really has no capital tied up in merchandise or warehouse/storage fees. Comparing it to other retailers is naive. Last time you also posted a number of irrelevant links, including one claiming to boot a buyer from eBay. That was true, but it was for excessive returns outside of the seller's return privilege period (i.e. SNAD claims which actually proves my point and not yours - SNADS are limited too just like charge backs). You selectively gloss over that part.
Well, if someone repeats the exact same thread with the exact same content shouldn't I have the exact same response?
Hey, look, you just posted the exact same reply to my exact same response!
So, I will also say to you, repeat yourself doesn't make it anymore true. I've SEEN all of these things under the old system. They happened to me. With returns as late as 3 months after sale. SO WHAT IS ACTUALLY NEW HERE?
[And, as per the previous thread, you ASSUME that eBay wouldn't shut people down for excessive returns under the new system just like Walmart and everyone else does regardless of whether they violate terms or not.]
Much love to you, anyway.
Ebay loves us and wants us to enjoy life. I could tell , with the way their representative talked to me, the other day. Then again, she could have just been a lonely girl needing someone to talk to.
Maybe if you listed it on your sales page as a collectible only and not a bullion offer. Perhaps then you may have a leg to stand on. Just a thought.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
I was notified I had lost my ability to return items on ebay for too many returns: 3
All three were the same guy, shipping 3 lots, all empty boxes.
Paypal made me good, but I opened a new account on ebay and did all my buying there until my 6 month suspension from being able to return was over.
Anything is possible and frankly bad sellers ruined it for the honest and reasonable ones; fortunately I haven't had any problem results in a long time.
I'm more concerned about someone buying coins (not bullion), shopping it around at a mark up, then returning it if they can't make money on it. Basically free inventory for the time cost of money.
It can be flippers nightmare on moderns..................
Buy 10 new palladium issues raw spacing purchases several days apart.
Sent to TPG as they arrive.
Any that don't grade 70 return to your most recently delivered coins seller.
This cheat along with PM swing pricing.............
Palladium has swung $250 in last 90 days.........................
Hey @cameonut2011
Don't they understand that it should cost more than $3 to send a $1500 coin back?
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
I've always been pro eBay, but extending the return policy to 30 days is a TERRIBLE idea. What's next, 45 days? 2 months?
Dave
The seller is in control of the return policy, not ebay.
Give Me Liberty or Give Me Debt
Yes, it is correct that there are limits to how many times you can do this. So one would not be able to set up an operation to do this on a large scale. However, you can absolutely do this occasionally. Regardless of how you sell online, fraud is just a reality of human nature and e-commerce. Where different retailers draw the line on the convenience/fraud avoidance scale varies based on their appetite for risk. Some will sell to multiple channels accepting just about any payment method. Others do in person, cash only. Heck, even then you could get burned by high end counterfeit cash.
So no, this isn't a seller friendly policy, but also not the end of the world. My guess is that the likely impact will be pretty small.
like charge backs). You selectively gloss over that part.
True. EXCEPT YOU CAN DO IT NOW. File a SNAD, you can ship the item back to the seller for FREE! You can file a chargeback up to 180 days NOW.
The main point here is that this 30 day return policy changes nothing. Everyone selling on eBay is already offering 30 days Free and 180 days overall.
I did not do a very good job of expressing what I am displeased about. The restocking fee was just one part of what was in "my" sellers negotiating toolbox, made it a little tougher to be an approval service, and that has been taken away. The ebay high value rep, told me that when I refund the money, I still have the power to "ding " the seller forproduct damages, not packaging correctly, not returning in the same fashion that it was shipped etc...I just thought that picking a number on the back end is far worse than being upfront on the front end. Additionally, the transaction was distateful since I was not taking offers, got private messaged an offer, accepted because I thought the restocking was in place etc...
Does anyone know if I can leave negative comments for buyer? If he then leaves me any, will they stick?
You can not leave negative feedback. You could put negative comments in there positive feedback, but who would read them. If he returns excessively, ebay will suspend him.
Returns area cost of doing business. You aren't out any money. Life is short. Block him. Realist. Move on.
You can put negative comments about the buyer all day long in ebay, including swear words and other offensive terms.
It is a violation of the terms and conditions, but nothing is stopping you.
Of course, the buyer can request the comment be removed, which is will be, and you can get suspended from ebay for a period of time, for violating the rules of the site, but you will have the satisfaction of leaving the negative comment.