Options
Problematic eBay buyer you may want to block
Bayard1908
Posts: 4,181 ✭✭✭✭
The buyer's name is 1onewayup
I believe this buyer also uses an alt account named jjspds
Here's what happened. Buyer purchased a 1951 proof set for $450. I shipped it to him immediately. Apparently he inspected it with a microscope and decided to return it.
I put in a transaction cancellation request so I could get my final value fee refunded. The buyer did not respond to the cancellation request. I didn't think this was a big deal because after 7 days of no response, the transaction will cancel by default.
Today the buyer emails and inquires about his refund. I ask him to please cancel the transaction and then he will receive an immediate refund. He somehow decides this is a battle of wills and refuses to cancel the transaction before he receives a refund. In fact, instead of doing nothing and just letting the transaction cancel by default later this week, he responds to eBay that he does not want to cancel the transaction. eBay then sent me an automated email asking me to complete the transaction saying I will not receive a final value fee refund.
The buyer now claims that he is filing a complaint with eBay.
I don't need this kind of grief and have never had anybody pull a stupid stunt like this before.
I just want to get rid of this guy and get my final value fee refunded. As things stand now, I fear eBay might refund the guy everything he paid, including the shipping cost, and also expect me to pay the final value fee and Paypal fee.
What should I do next: (1)sit tight until I hear from eBay, (2) give the guy a full refund, (3) give the guy a refund minus the final value fee, (4) ship the proof set back to him? I think it's almost a foregone conclusion that this character is going to post negative feedback regardless of what I do.
I believe this buyer also uses an alt account named jjspds
Here's what happened. Buyer purchased a 1951 proof set for $450. I shipped it to him immediately. Apparently he inspected it with a microscope and decided to return it.
I put in a transaction cancellation request so I could get my final value fee refunded. The buyer did not respond to the cancellation request. I didn't think this was a big deal because after 7 days of no response, the transaction will cancel by default.
Today the buyer emails and inquires about his refund. I ask him to please cancel the transaction and then he will receive an immediate refund. He somehow decides this is a battle of wills and refuses to cancel the transaction before he receives a refund. In fact, instead of doing nothing and just letting the transaction cancel by default later this week, he responds to eBay that he does not want to cancel the transaction. eBay then sent me an automated email asking me to complete the transaction saying I will not receive a final value fee refund.
The buyer now claims that he is filing a complaint with eBay.
I don't need this kind of grief and have never had anybody pull a stupid stunt like this before.
I just want to get rid of this guy and get my final value fee refunded. As things stand now, I fear eBay might refund the guy everything he paid, including the shipping cost, and also expect me to pay the final value fee and Paypal fee.
What should I do next: (1)sit tight until I hear from eBay, (2) give the guy a full refund, (3) give the guy a refund minus the final value fee, (4) ship the proof set back to him? I think it's almost a foregone conclusion that this character is going to post negative feedback regardless of what I do.
0
Comments
Refund the guy and move on. Yeah, he's a jerk but...what are we arguing over here, a $20 fee? Life is too short.
Free Trial
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE >>
I should expect to eat the final value fee on a return?
<< <i>I should expect to eat the final value fee on a return? >>
No I do not think you should get charged for the final value fee on a return
SNMAN
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE. >>
+1. If you would have refunded the money when you received the item back you wouldn't be in this situation.
<< <i>
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE. >>
+1. If you would have refunded the money when you received the item back you wouldn't be in this situation. >>
You think it's unreasonable to ask the buyer to cancel the transaction, before a refund is issued, so I can get my $30 final value fee back?
<< <i>
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE >>
I should expect to eat the final value fee on a return? >>
The only reason you're now eating it is because you held the buyer's refund hostage waiting for them to agree to the mutual cancellation.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>You think it's unreasonable to ask the buyer to cancel the transaction, before a refund is issued, so I can get my $30 final value fee back? >>
Yes. If you would have refunded the payment he would have either canceled the transaction or just let the 7 days expire. I doubt he would have filed a complaint with eBay.
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE >>
+2
I think it would be interesting to tally how many times the OP is actually at "fault" in the block buyer/seller threads.
Not that there aren't any valid reasons to block someone, it's just that I think some come to conclusions too quickly without giving enough thought to the situation and/or asking the right questions.
Joe.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE >>
I should expect to eat the final value fee on a return? >>
The only reason you're now eating it is because you held the buyer's refund hostage waiting for them to agree to the mutual cancellation.
Russ, NCNE >>
In my mind, canceling the transaction is a necessary condition for receiving a refund, not holding a refund hostage. It costs the buyer nothing and allows the seller to have his final value fees refunded. I see no reason that the seller should even have to risk eating the final value fee.
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction. >>
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy? The buyer has no incentive to do anything once he has received a refund and may even spitefully refuse to cancel the transaction.
<< <i>
<< <i>Have you received the return? If so, you should have already issued a refund. You're wrong, the buyer is right.
Russ, NCNE >>
+2
I think it would be interesting to tally how many times the OP is actually at "fault" in the block buyer/seller threads.
Not that there aren't any valid reasons to block someone, it's just that I think some come to conclusions too quickly without giving enough thought to the situation and/or asking the right questions.
Joe. >>
I don't care if you block the guy or not. I made what I think is a very reasonable request, to cancel the transaction so I could get my final value fee back, and the buyer decided he needs to go to war. If that's the kind of person you want to do business with, he's all yours.
<< <i>
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction. >>
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy?
It is the right thing to do.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction. >>
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy?
It is the right thing to do. >>
Unless eBay has a policy of which I'm unaware, I respectfully disagree. Until the transaction is cancelled, I don't think a refund should be issued. That's an obligation of the buyer in addition to returning the merchandise.
<< <i>
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction. >>
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy? The buyer has no incentive to do anything once he has received a refund and may even spitefully refuse to cancel the transaction. >>
What do you call not sending the buyer his refund after you received the goods back?
I think you need to rethink your position.
Joe.
<< <i>I don't care if you block the guy or not. I made what I think is a very reasonable request, to cancel the transaction so I could get my final value fee back, and the buyer decided he needs to go to war. If that's the kind of person you want to do business with, he's all yours. >>
I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you've got to be kidding. You tried to extort a cancellation from the buyer by withholding money that's rightfully his. Between the two of you, you're the one who most people wouldn't want to do business with.
<< <i>
<< <i>I don't care if you block the guy or not. I made what I think is a very reasonable request, to cancel the transaction so I could get my final value fee back, and the buyer decided he needs to go to war. If that's the kind of person you want to do business with, he's all yours. >>
I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you've got to be kidding. You tried to extort a cancellation from the buyer by withholding money that's rightfully his. Between the two of you, you're the one who most people wouldn't want to do business with. >>
I have to agree with the others....when I receive an item back I refund the money right away and then I expect the buyer to mutually cancel the transaction...not before I refund and I have not run into the issue you are describing in 12+ years on ebay. If you would have issued the refund promptly I am 99% certain we wouldn't be talking about this now.
<< <i>I issue a refund as soon as I can when I get a return. If the buyer doesn't cancel the transaction, I get the fee after 7 days. If the buyer says the transaction isn't canceled, then I suppose you can open an NPB or show proof that you refunded the payment. That said, I've never had a buyer not cancel the transaction within a day or two. >>
I get about one return per year. I've never had a buyer refuse to cancel before. It makes no sense to me.
What's the situation?
How can you start the process to get a credit?
When can this happen?
What happens next?
The buyer opened a case in the Resolution Center, you resolved it, and issued the buyer a full refund
Note: Final value fee credits are only available when the buyer is given a full refund.
1.
Resolve the transaction problem in the Resolution Center.
2.
Issue the buyer a full refund.
Note: You won't receive a credit if the buyer asks eBay to review the case, even if you issue a refund after the buyer contacts us.
Also, the case must be open in the Resolution Center for you to receive a final value fee credit. You won't receive a credit for cases opened on PayPal.
The buyer can open a case 3 days after the estimated delivery date or 7 days after making payment if you didn't provide an estimated delivery date.
The buyer has up to 45 days after the making payment to open a case.
1.
The day the buyer opens a case, we contact you.
2.
You have 7 days to reply to a case and 3 days to refund the buyer after you receive the returned item.
3.
7-10 days after you resolve the problem and close the case, you'll receive a credit to your seller account.
Important: If you don't resolve the problem in the Resolution Center, eBay automatically closes the case and you aren't credited the final value fee, even if you give the buyer a full refund.
Once your case is closed by you or eBay, you can't reopen the case.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I don't care if you block the guy or not. I made what I think is a very reasonable request, to cancel the transaction so I could get my final value fee back, and the buyer decided he needs to go to war. If that's the kind of person you want to do business with, he's all yours. >>
I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you've got to be kidding. You tried to extort a cancellation from the buyer by withholding money that's rightfully his. Between the two of you, you're the one who most people wouldn't want to do business with. >>
I have to agree with the others....when I receive an item back I refund the money right away and then I expect the buyer to mutually cancel the transaction...not before I refund and I have not run into the issue you are describing in 12+ years on ebay. If you would have issued the refund promptly I am 99% certain we wouldn't be talking about this now. >>
Instead we'd be talking about how the guy got a refund and I'm stuck paying the final value fee.
I've also been on eBay for 12 years, and I've never run into a buyer who refused to cancel the transaction before. Your refund policy is fine if all buyers behave rationally. Unfortunately, not all buyers are reasonable rational people.
<< <i>
<< <i>I issue a refund as soon as I can when I get a return. If the buyer doesn't cancel the transaction, I get the fee after 7 days. If the buyer says the transaction isn't canceled, then I suppose you can open an NPB or show proof that you refunded the payment. That said, I've never had a buyer not cancel the transaction within a day or two. >>
I get about one return per year. I've never had a buyer refuse to cancel before. It makes no sense to me. >>
Maybe the buyer want the "security" of ebay and keeping the transaction open. Once he gets HIS money back then he may no longer feel the need for "security" and cancel the transaction. I believe you have things in the REVERSE order.
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy?
It is the right thing to do.
Unless eBay has a policy of which I'm unaware, I respectfully disagree. Until the transaction is cancelled, I don't think a refund should be issued. That's an obligation of the buyer in addition to returning the merchandise.
You think eBay "policy" has any relationship to the right thing to do? Fundamental customer service dictates that when an item is returned, a refund is issued immediately. Basic business practice dictates that when a customer returns an item, they are due a refund. The FVF fee re-imbursement has nothing to do with doing right by your customer.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction. >>
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy?
It is the right thing to do. >>
Unless eBay has a policy of which I'm unaware, I respectfully disagree. Until the transaction is cancelled, I don't think a refund should be issued. That's an obligation of the buyer in addition to returning the merchandise. >>
You think eBay "policy" has any relationship to the right thing to do? Fundamental customer service dictates that when an item is returned, a refund is issued immediately. Basic business practice dictates that when a customer returns an item, they are due a refund. The FVF fee re-imbursement has nothing to do with doing right by your customer.
Russ, NCNE >>
I have lots of repeat eBay buyers, and only get about one return per year. I am not out to bilk anyone; however, I respectfully disagree with you.
<< <i>If the buyer returned the coins and you haven't refunded yet, you have both the buyer's money and the coins. One of the two does not belong to you. >>
There's one variable you neglected to mention. eBay has my $30 final value fee and the cooperation of the buyer is required for me to obtain it.
TC
<< <i>cooperation of the buyer is required for me to obtain it. >>
Incorrect.
Buying most large and small type notes and some nationals for inventory
<< <i>
<< <i>You think it's unreasonable to ask the buyer to cancel the transaction, before a refund is issued, so I can get my $30 final value fee back? >>
Yes. If you would have refunded the payment he would have either canceled the transaction or just let the 7 days expire. I doubt he would have filed a complaint with eBay. >>
<< <i>
<< <i>If the buyer returned the coins and you haven't refunded yet, you have both the buyer's money and the coins. One of the two does not belong to you. >>
There's one variable you neglected to mention. eBay has my $30 final value fee and the cooperation of the buyer is required for me to obtain it. >>
And, this has absolutely nothing to do with your obligation to refund the customers money.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>There's one variable you neglected to mention. eBay has my $30 final value fee and the cooperation of the buyer is required for me to obtain it. >>
If you're taking the position that the buyer owes you the FVF (is that one of terms of sale in your eBay listings- if not, it probably should be), then you still owe him the difference.
edited to add... even if you think the buyer's being a jerk, you have no right to keep both the coins and his payment.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>If the buyer returned the coins and you haven't refunded yet, you have both the buyer's money and the coins. One of the two does not belong to you. >>
There's one variable you neglected to mention. eBay has my $30 final value fee and the cooperation of the buyer is required for me to obtain it. >>
And, this has absolutely nothing to do with your obligation to refund the customers money.
Russ, NCNE >>
Not to be disrespectful, but, unsupported bombastic pronouncements are not convincing. We have an honest disagreement on the obligations of the buyer when making a return.
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction.
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy?
It is the right thing to do.
Unless eBay has a policy of which I'm unaware, I respectfully disagree. Until the transaction is cancelled, I don't think a refund should be issued. That's an obligation of the buyer in addition to returning the merchandise.
You think eBay "policy" has any relationship to the right thing to do? Fundamental customer service dictates that when an item is returned, a refund is issued immediately. Basic business practice dictates that when a customer returns an item, they are due a refund. The FVF fee re-imbursement has nothing to do with doing right by your customer.
Russ, NCNE >>
I truly wish you the best of luck on this, but I feel you are the one in the wrong, not the buyer. JMO.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
<< <i>I would very mad as a buyer if I returned and The seller did not issue a refund yet. Refund the the full amount, and then ask politely to cancel the transaction.
What is your rationale for that being the proper policy?
It is the right thing to do.
Unless eBay has a policy of which I'm unaware, I respectfully disagree. Until the transaction is cancelled, I don't think a refund should be issued. That's an obligation of the buyer in addition to returning the merchandise. >>
One of the main reasons (and one of the choices to choose from) for a buyer canceling a claim or dispute is that the buyer has received a refund. Refund comes before buyer can be satisfied to the point of canceling the claim. Buyer is right in this case.
Seller should have humbly accepted return (if he in fact state that he does) and refunded payment upon return of item. If refund process does not automatically return fees to seller then seller should have initiated cancellation request AT THAT TIME and requested buyer to support the cancellation.
Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat
<< <i>eBay has my $30 final value fee and the cooperation of the buyer is required for me to obtain it. >>
I contacted both eBay and PayPal regarding a buyer who refused to cooperate in filing insurance claim when a package went missing. Both of them stated unequivocally that I was expected to refund (I already had) and that the buyer had no obligation to assist in filing an insurance claim, even if that meant I had to eat the loss. I would suspect that, should you ask, you would get the same response regarding your FVF.
<< <i>Bad, bad, bad seller! While ebay may have your final fee tied up, it is due to your holding the buyer's refund for ransom. The seller offers a refund if not satisfied, the buyer is not satisfied, the buyer sends coins back, if coins are in satisfactory condtion, then seller owes a refund---END of story. The final fee is between you and ebay--not you and the seller. Ebay even makes it easy should the buyer not agree to a cancellation--they refund your fees anyway in 7 days. What is the issue here. Many sellers like to hold things for ransom, such as feedback, refunds and the like. That is why we have such screwed up policies at ebay now. Please give the man his refund and move on. I would definitely not block this buyer for your reasoning.
I truly wish you the best of luck on this, but I feel you are the one in the wrong, not the buyer. JMO.
Jim >>
What you think of as ransom, I think of as an obligation of the buyer. Frankly, I find the term ransom offensive.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I don't care if you block the guy or not. I made what I think is a very reasonable request, to cancel the transaction so I could get my final value fee back, and the buyer decided he needs to go to war. If that's the kind of person you want to do business with, he's all yours. >>
I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you've got to be kidding. You tried to extort a cancellation from the buyer by withholding money that's rightfully his. Between the two of you, you're the one who most people wouldn't want to do business with. >>
I have to agree with the others....when I receive an item back I refund the money right away and then I expect the buyer to mutually cancel the transaction...not before I refund and I have not run into the issue you are describing in 12+ years on ebay. If you would have issued the refund promptly I am 99% certain we wouldn't be talking about this now. >>
Instead we'd be talking about how the guy got a refund and I'm stuck paying the final value fee.
I've also been on eBay for 12 years, and I've never run into a buyer who refused to cancel the transaction before. Your refund policy is fine if all buyers behave rationally. Unfortunately, not all buyers are reasonable rational people. >>
Your so backward on this it's amazing...because of your inaction (not refunding the payment) you caused the reaction by the buyer. If you would have refunded the payment we would not have anything to talk about becuase at that point there would have been 0 reasons for the buyer to not follow through with the transaction cancellation. Now as it stand the buyer does have a reason not to cancell as you have not fufilled your end of the deal by refunding the agreed upon sale amount. I believe now that you will indeed lose your $30 again becuase of your action becuase I think it said in the rules posted above that if a case is opened for the refund that you won't get your final value fee credited back to you....could be wrong on that and I hope not but the blame lies entirely with you whether you agree or not.
You have to be realistic and step back and take a hard look at the situation. You have pretty much been told by 98% of the posters to this thread that you are not correct in your thinking and the buyer is right to be upset. Instead of realizing you could be in error you would rather believe everyone else is wrong including the buyer.....truly that make no sense any where on this planet but of course you can think what you like and be as wrong as you like and in this case it will probably only cost you $30
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I don't care if you block the guy or not. I made what I think is a very reasonable request, to cancel the transaction so I could get my final value fee back, and the buyer decided he needs to go to war. If that's the kind of person you want to do business with, he's all yours. >>
I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but you've got to be kidding. You tried to extort a cancellation from the buyer by withholding money that's rightfully his. Between the two of you, you're the one who most people wouldn't want to do business with. >>
I have to agree with the others....when I receive an item back I refund the money right away and then I expect the buyer to mutually cancel the transaction...not before I refund and I have not run into the issue you are describing in 12+ years on ebay. If you would have issued the refund promptly I am 99% certain we wouldn't be talking about this now. >>
Instead we'd be talking about how the guy got a refund and I'm stuck paying the final value fee.
I've also been on eBay for 12 years, and I've never run into a buyer who refused to cancel the transaction before. Your refund policy is fine if all buyers behave rationally. Unfortunately, not all buyers are reasonable rational people. >>
Your so backward on this it's amazing...because of your inaction (not refunding the payment) you caused the reaction by the buyer. If you would have refunded the payment we would not have anything to talk about becuase at that point there would have been 0 reasons for the buyer to not follow through with the transaction cancellation. Now as it stand the buyer does have a reason not to cancell as you have not fufilled your end of the deal by refunding the agreed upon sale amount. I believe now that you will indeed lose your $30 again becuase of your action becuase I think it said in the rules posted above that if a case is opened for the refund that you won't get your final value fee credited back to you....could be wrong on that and I hope not but the blame lies entirely with you whether you agree or not.
You have to be realistic and step back and take a hard look at the situation. You have pretty much been told by 98% of the posters to this thread that you are not correct in your thinking and the buyer is right to be upset. Instead of realizing you could be in error you would rather believe everyone else is wrong including the buyer.....truly that make no sense any where on this planet but of course you can think what you like and be as wrong as you like and in this case it will probably only cost you $30
I recognize that there's room for honest disagreement. If other people want to handle returns differently, I won't interfere or criticize them. However, my policy of asking for a cancellation before making a refund will not change. I get very few returns; so, it's almost a non-issue.
I telephoned eBay and believe everything is going to get worked out. There is also something weird with the buyer's Paypal account and I had to telephone Paypal to request they make a manual refund. 10 seconds of cooperation from the buyer could have prevented all this.
Just my opinion
AL
<< <i>10 seconds of cooperation from the buyer could have prevented all this. >>
Wow. Apparently we're
Seller is worried that if buyer gets money first, ebay could take the $30 and run. (We've established that the seller is covered in this event, so no reason to worry.)
Buyer is worried that if he cancels transaction prior to refund, seller could take $450 and run. By agreeing to cancel the transaction, buyer is essentially saying to ebay and paypal and the powers that be... "everything has been taken care of," when, in fact it has not. As a buyer myself, I have returned expensive items for a refund, and never would I consider canceling prior to receiving the refund. Canceling is the final step. It makes the case a "done deal," case closed, at which point the modest FV fee is credited to the seller. If done before the buyer is refunded, it would be very hard as a buyer to make a case to get your money if the seller decides to take it and run, because you basically told ebay you were already refunded by canceling.
Buying most large and small type notes and some nationals for inventory
<< <i>He somehow decides this is a battle of wills... >>
Some people...
Buyer has received a full refund including his shipping cost.
eBay has credited me for the final value fee (done via a phone call).
I have blocked the buyer.
My policy of asking for a cancellation before issuing a refund will not change.
Anybody who criticized me in this thread, no hard feelings; however, I hope you encounter this buyer on eBay.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
<< <i>Glad it is over for both of you. Although, I must comment that your blocking of the buyer is somewhat superfluous as I highly doubt this buyer would ever bid on an item in your auction again. >>
I hope you're right. lol
Cheers!
Kirk
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BONGO HURTLES ALONG THE RAIN SODDEN HIGHWAY OF LIFE ON UNDERINFLATED BALD RETREAD TIRES