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Thread Title: Another CSNS Show Report
Created On Friday April 18, 2008 3:10 PM
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speety
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:10 PM

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I just got back from the bourse and i'm tired! I'll be going back tomorrow morning to pick up an auction win and chat with a few dealers before heading home.

Overall the show was average, maybe a little below, for a CSNS show. The room was huge but half empty, giving the allusion of a bad dealer turnout until 4 hours later you realize you have only been to half of the tables. The big-name dealers and auction houses were located as soon as you walked in, I for one did not like this as these are the tables that have no coins in their cases and tend to be less friendly for the most part. Nothing like starting off a show with a bunch of blank cases....

By about the 400 row the tables picked up. We located a stunning proof 1885 liberty nickel at harry laibsteins table and picked that up. Next we stopped by Wayne Herndon's table and made our greatest find (imo) for the entire show. An 1988 Prestiege set with no cloudiness on the dollar coin. It must have taken 100+ sets to find one, if you don't believe me, try to find one for yourself. Needless to say we picked it up at their outrageous () asking price of $27.50! It was well worth it and ended up being our last purchase of the show.

My main objectives today were to find a well-struck 1883 No Cents liberty nickel in MS-64/5 (you know the common one), seated dollars in AU that we were missing, and the Wiley-Bugert half dollar book. Well I struck out. There was not a single fully struck 1883 N/C nickel on the floor, i'm starting to doubt that they exist. Also, i failed in finding a seated dollar for our set, but we did pick one up during the Queller auction (more details and my pics will be up later), and the Wiley-Bugert book was nowhere to be seen.

I was finally able to meet a few people from the forum and talk to some dealers. Ed and Lance Hipps were nice as always, the guys at CCU were fun to talk to, TMOT was very courteous and had an interesting product to sell, and I saw Joe O'connor and Foodood but they were busy so I looked at their eye candy and slid by.

On a side note, dealers don't be fooled by someones age. Once again I, who just turned 18, got a snooty response from a dealer when I asked to see an 1841 AU-58 seated dollar. The dealer, at Lenny Bird's table, just replied with 'It's $2,800' twice when I asked to see the coin and didn't move a muscle to open the case. Now $2,800 isn't pocket change but when someone asks to see the coin you allow them to see the coin -- I certaintly could have dropped $2,800 on the coin if i thought it was nice, but because of his BS attitude he lost a potential customer for good.

That's my first real show report, how'd I do? Any suggestions for further ones would be great!

Mark

-------------------------
 Seated Dollar Registry

Want to buy an auction catalog for the William Hesslein Sale (December 2, 1926). Thanks to all those who have helped us obtain the others!!!

Edited: Friday April 18, 2008 at 4:08 PM by speety

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Elcontador
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:18 PM

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The N/C Nickel is as common as dirt in grades through MS 65 and isn't difficult to find in MS 66. I don't recall if the strike on this coin is better / worse than the others, but remember one thing. On almost all business strike Liberty Nickels, star 7 (oberverse) is softly struck and lt. ear of corn (reverse) is either missing detail (or often, doesn't have any detail at all). I am surprised that you didn't find one that met your specs.

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speety
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:25 PM

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<< The N/C Nickel is as common as dirt in grades through MS 65 and isn't difficult to find in MS 66. I don't recall if the strike on this coin is better / worse than the others, but remember one thing. On almost all business strike Liberty Nickels, star 7 (oberverse) is softly struck and lt. ear of corn (reverse) is either missing detail (or often, doesn't have any detail at all). I am surprised that you didn't find one that met your specs. >>



Bingo! The obverse is often found fully struck, but the left corn is (almost) always a blob. We already have an MS-64 that is very well struck, so we are being extremely picky on our upgrade/duplicate (it is one of the very few dates that we don't have two of already, i love this series!).

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 Seated Dollar Registry

Want to buy an auction catalog for the William Hesslein Sale (December 2, 1926). Thanks to all those who have helped us obtain the others!!!

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percyb
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:28 PM

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<< I just got back from the bourse and i'm tired! I'll be going back tomorrow morning to pick up an auction win and chat with a few dealers before heading home.

Overall the show was average, maybe a little below, for a CSNS show. The room was huge but half empty, giving the allusion of a bad dealer turnout until 4 hours later you realize you have only been to half of the tables. The big-name dealers and auction houses were located as soon as you walked in, I for one did not like this as these are the tables that have no coins in their cases and tend to be less friendly for the most part. Nothing like starting off a show with a bunch of blank cases....

By about the 400 row the tables picked up. We located a stunning proof 1885 liberty nickel at harry laibsteins table and picked that up. Next we stopped by Wayne Herndon's table and made our greatest find (imo) for the entire show. An 1988 Prestiege set with no cloudiness on the dollar coin. It must have taken 100+ sets to find one, if you don't believe me, try to find one for yourself. Needless to say we picked it up at their outrageous () asking price of $27.50! It was well worth it and ended up being our last purchase of the show.

My main objectives today were to find a well-struck 1883 No Cents liberty nickel in MS-64/5 (you know the common one), seated dollars in AU that we were missing, and the Wiley-Bugert half dollar book. Well I struck out. There was not a single fully struck 1883 N/C nickel on the floor, i'm starting to doubt that they exist. Also, i failed in finding a seated dollar for our set, but we did pick one up during the Queller auction (more details and my pics will be up later), and the Wiley-Bugert book was nowhere to be seen.

I was finally able to meet a few people from the forum and talk to some dealers. Ed and Lance Hipps were nice as always, the guys at CCU were fun to talk to, TMOT was very courteous and had an interesting product to sell, and I saw Joe O'connor and Foodood but they were busy so I looked at their eye candy and slid by.

On a side note, dealers don't be fooled by someones age. Once again I, who just turned 18, got a snooty response from a dealer when I asked to see an 1841 AU-58 seated dollar. The dealer, Lenny Bird, just replied with 'It's $2,800' twice when I asked to see the coin and didn't move a muscle to open the case. Now $2,800 isn't pocket change but when someone asks to see the coin you allow them to see the coin -- I certaintly could have dropped $2,800 on the coin if i thought it was nice, but because of his BS attitude he lost a potential customer for good.

That's my first real show report, how'd I do? Any suggestions for further ones would be great!

Mark >>



I had a wonderful response from the same dealer. Since I live in the area, I asked him where his shop was located. He wouldn't tell me. Howz that for a friendly how do you do. WTF? I agree. The bourse seemed somewhat sparse, but not too bad. I saw most of the action at the Currency tables though, to be quite honest. Picked up an 1864 3 center amd a 1883 nickle along with an Abe Lincoln Chicago Exposition ticket. I really wanted to buy an SBA 1979 S type 2...but the friggin price the dealer wanted for an ANAC 66 ($220) was twice the price I could pay on the bay for an NGC 69. I'm not kidding. See the evidence. I wonder how these folks stay in business.
EBAYSBAIWANTEDBUTDIDNT220ATBOURSE

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 "Poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world." PBShelley

Edited: Friday April 18, 2008 at 3:30 PM by percyb

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Walkerguy21D
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:36 PM

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Nice report. I'm glad you also enjoy talking to and dealing with Ed and Lance Hipps - they're good folks. I don't know this Lenny Bird fellow, but I think that's probably a good thing...

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CaptHenway
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:41 PM

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Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago.

-------------------------
 "SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL BRICK & MORTAR COIN SHOP!"

Edited: Friday April 18, 2008 at 3:42 PM by CaptHenway

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speety
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:46 PM

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<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>



Do you know lenny personally? I ask this because IIRC the person who was a Jerk at his table didn't have Lenny Bird on his name tag. Perhaps someone else was working his table for this show? I was just in awe that a dealer would have that kind of reaction to a potential customer.

Mark

-------------------------
 Seated Dollar Registry

Want to buy an auction catalog for the William Hesslein Sale (December 2, 1926). Thanks to all those who have helped us obtain the others!!!

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BlindedByEgo
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:47 PM

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<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>



I was going tho mention that he had been through a lot, and maybe that we should not pile on too quick.

For those who don't remember, there is this.

I'm glad to hear that they caught the $%^$ suspects.

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bestday
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:47 PM

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<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>


Yes indeed ..he has been quoted in the Chicago newspapers saying he wishes he never got in the coin business..because it cost him his son .Say a PRAYER FOR BOTH

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BlindedByEgo
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:49 PM

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<<

<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>



Do you know lenny personally? I ask this because IIRC the person who was a Jerk at his table didn't have Lenny Bird on his name tag. Perhaps someone else was working his table for this show? I was just in awe that a dealer would have that kind of reaction to a potential customer.

Mark >>



In that case, let's string the bastidge up!

I hope that you don't have to experience that kind of behaviour too often - it really sucks.

-------------------------
 NEW! Items on eBay all $0.99 with NO RESERVE!

Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you:

1. Jesus Christ

2. The American G. I.

One died for your soul, both died for your freedom.

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CaptHenway
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:51 PM

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<<

<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>



Do you know lenny personally? I ask this because IIRC the person who was a Jerk at his table didn't have Lenny Bird on his name tag. Perhaps someone else was working his table for this show? I was just in awe that a dealer would have that kind of reaction to a potential customer.

Mark >>



Big, heavy-set guy, balding with a dark fringe of hair slicked back.
I merely assumed that anybody who would badmouth somebody by name would know who it was they are talking about.

-------------------------
 "SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL BRICK & MORTAR COIN SHOP!"

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percyb
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:52 PM

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I did cut him slack otherwise he would have caught my mad Irish wrath.

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speety
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Friday April 18, 2008 3:53 PM

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<<

<<

<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>



Do you know lenny personally? I ask this because IIRC the person who was a Jerk at his table didn't have Lenny Bird on his name tag. Perhaps someone else was working his table for this show? I was just in awe that a dealer would have that kind of reaction to a potential customer.

Mark >>



Big, heavy-set guy, balding with a dark fringe of hair slicked back.
I merely assumed that anybody who would badmouth somebody by name would know who it was they are talking about. >>



Sounds like the guy i saw, maybe it was just the outside circumstances. Is he usually a pretty nice guy?

-------------------------
 Seated Dollar Registry

Want to buy an auction catalog for the William Hesslein Sale (December 2, 1926). Thanks to all those who have helped us obtain the others!!!

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BlindedByEgo
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:03 PM

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<<

<<

<< Cut Lenny some slack. He's had a rough week.
Earlier this week the police arrested the @#$%^&*( who shot Lenny's son dead during an attempted robbery at Lenny's house about a year ago. >>



Do you know lenny personally? I ask this because IIRC the person who was a Jerk at his table didn't have Lenny Bird on his name tag. Perhaps someone else was working his table for this show? I was just in awe that a dealer would have that kind of reaction to a potential customer.

Mark >>



Big, heavy-set guy, balding with a dark fringe of hair slicked back.
I merely assumed that anybody who would badmouth somebody by name would know who it was they are talking about. >>



With all due respect, I didn't hear bad-mouthing Captain - I heard an honest assessment of bad behaviour by a dealer. Shocking that it should ever actually happen, what?

BTW, I enjoyed the show report - thanks for taking the time to share your experience, Speety!

-------------------------
 NEW! Items on eBay all $0.99 with NO RESERVE!

Only two defining forces have ever offered to die for you:

1. Jesus Christ

2. The American G. I.

One died for your soul, both died for your freedom.

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percyb
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:07 PM

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<<
Big, heavy-set guy, balding with a dark fringe of hair slicked back.
I merely assumed that anybody who would badmouth somebody by name would know who it was they are talking about. >>



Sounds like the guy i saw, maybe it was just the outside circumstances. Is he usually a pretty nice guy? >>



The guy I saw wasn't the heavy set guy. That guy was nice. It was the thin guy....dark hair. I'm sure he's a nice guy. He was only very terse and abrupt with me. I knew about his son....and the recent developments. I just let it go....but jeeze.

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speety
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:11 PM

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<<

<<
Big, heavy-set guy, balding with a dark fringe of hair slicked back.
I merely assumed that anybody who would badmouth somebody by name would know who it was they are talking about. >>



Sounds like the guy i saw, maybe it was just the outside circumstances. Is he usually a pretty nice guy? >>



The guy I saw wasn't the heavy set guy. That guy was nice. It was the thin guy....dark hair. I'm sure he's a nice guy. He was only very terse and abrupt with me. I knew about his son....and the recent developments. I just let it go....but jeeze. >>



I changed the OP to say 'at Lenny Bird's Table...'. I'm sure Lenny is going through a hard time and what happened to his son is a tragedy and i hope the criminals get what they deserve, but i'm still shocked how potential customers were treated at Lenny's table today.

-------------------------
 Seated Dollar Registry

Want to buy an auction catalog for the William Hesslein Sale (December 2, 1926). Thanks to all those who have helped us obtain the others!!!

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SeattleSlammer
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:16 PM

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There was not a single fully struck 1883 N/C nickel on the floor, i'm starting to doubt that they exist.

Well, if you can't find one well struck, at least get one with some color! Some of the reverse corn on mine looks more like sausage....but that's okay with me because I bought it for the color.


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CaptHenway
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:20 PM

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Purty!

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DeusExMachina
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:30 PM

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Speety, nice report. Thanks for the update.

My advice would be to turn a negative into a positive. I'm a little older than 18 but I do look young for my age. And I look really young compared to most of the collectors on the bourse. My experience has been that if a dealer appears uninterested in showing me an expensive coin, I speak intelligently about the coin itself or the series. This approach has always worked for me.

I was at a local show in Southern California and was speaking with an elderly dealer. He had a fantastic 1839-O reeded edge half dollar in his case (I would have bought it but I already own an example). I asked to see the coin and he responded, "that's a four figure coin, you know." I told him how I thought the date was underrated and I hadn't ever seen a coin with such a toning pattern. He immediate changed his tune and let me view the coin.

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DaveG
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Friday April 18, 2008 4:31 PM

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Speety,

I'm not surprised you haven't been able to find a copy of W-B - it has been out of stock for three or four years now.

I recommend keepig an eye on eBay and the numismatic book auctions if you want a shot at a copy.

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