A brief comparison of populations and prices for some Mint State and Proof Type coins....

Comments

• Typetone Posts: 1,621 ✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:13AM

  Mark:
  
  The prices all seem way to low to make meaningful comparisons. Looks like you are using Blue Sheet bids. Can you put up say grey sheet offers next to each listing.
  
  Greg

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• Louis Posts: 3,687

  September 25, 2003 4:16AM

  If every coin listed was purchased in every grade listed it would still be a considerably smaller investment than this..

  
  
  

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• barberlover Posts: 2,228 ✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:20AM

  Mark, I like your prices!!!!
  
  Les

  The President claims he didn't lie about taxes for those earning less then $250,000 a year with public mandated health insurance yet his own justice department has said they will use the right of the government to tax when the states appeals go to court.

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• jeffnpcb Posts: 1,943 ✭

  September 25, 2003 4:21AM

  Other than attrition, I don't understand why the Liberty Nickles and Barber dimes are so high in price. I may have answered my own question, yet I am not a big fan of the Barber series of coins. They only fit in my type sets!
  
  Next, are these real world prices or a little high because of the people writing and backing the publication![always believe it's a conspiracy theory out there!]
  
  On the other hand, why are early 20th. century coins selling for the prices listed? I'm just wondering as some key dates are always showing up in big numbers as if the owners are hitting the market while the fire's hot. Come back later and buy when it cools down.

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• coinguy1 Posts: 13,484 ✭✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:33AM

  
  
  << <i>The prices all seem way to low to make meaningful comparisons. Looks like you are using Blue Sheet bids. Can you put up say grey sheet offers next to each listing. >>
  
  Greg, as per my comment #7 in my initial post - "Listed prices are from the September 19, 2003 Certified Coin Dealer Newsletter".
  
  Regardless of whether (lower) Certified Coin dealer Newsletter prices or (higher) Coin Dealer Newsletter prices are used, this is meant to be a RELATIVE comparison of populations and prices. I think that purpose is well served, either way. Please feel free to add Coin Dealer Newsletter prices if you want to - in fact, I "insist" upon it.

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• Newmismatist Posts: 1,802 ✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:47AM

  
  
  << <i>7) Listed prices are from the September 19, 2003 Certified Coin Dealer Newsletter.
  
  Indian Head Cents (Bronze):
  MS65RD: Population 3513; Price $325
  PF65RD: Population 1058; Price $775
  MS66RD: Population 849; Price $725
  PF66RD: Population 458; Price $1450
  
  What looks to be a relatively good value? >>
  
  
  
  Coinguy - those are Blue sheet bid prices, which as I understand are "sight-unseen" prices that some one will pay for the ugliest over-graded example of that particular coin, so I'm not sure that it applies to the coins that I've excerpted for the following reasons:
  
  Red IHCs are very dependant on the visual look of the coin - to be exact, is it really RD!! For example, I wouldn't pay $1450 for a PF66RD which is really a solid, acurately graded PF66RB IHC - I think they're worth about 1/2 of that - But I would pay a lot more than $1450 for a real PQ PF66RD IHC, (and I have, from Pinnacle & others) - so my response is an accurately graded PF66RD IHC is abargain at $1450. the same is probably true regarding the other listed IHCs - the look and the color are extremely important.
  
  Now the Bid prices might be realistic for say, common date MS Morgan dollars that have a high population, because the buy/sell range for those coins is much narrower, or common date MS St. Gauden $20s - (current gold would affect those prices though)
  
  I'm sure others who collect/specialize in the other named coin series listed will have similar comments. I'm just not sure that the most someome would pay, sight un-seen for the ugliest over-graded coin is an accurate way to determine what are the good value coins, & which ones are the over-priced (or not-so-good-value) coins.
  
  BTW would I be able to use blue-sheet to buy at your table? You have a lot of really nice coins and ....

  Collecting eye-appealing Proof and MS Indian Head Cents, 1858 Flying Eagle and IHC patterns and beautiful toned coins.
  
  “It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.” Mark Twain
  Newmismatist

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• Typetone Posts: 1,621 ✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:51AM

  Mark:
  
  Unfortunately, I don't have a greysheet. Do you have any ability to post those prices next to? The problem with bluesheet is that it is for bids only for sight unseen pieces. For any given series if there are a few dogs, the sight-unseen bid can be very distorted from where the typical piece would trade. So, I don't really believe it is a good relative indicator. Grey sheet offers on the other hand are for correctly graded sight seen pieces. As such, while they are high (being offers) they should be more relatively correct. Actually, in today's "hot" market even greysheet offers are possibly too low.
  
  Greg

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• barberlover Posts: 2,228 ✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:53AM

  Mark, your prices are just fine!!!
  
  Les

  The President claims he didn't lie about taxes for those earning less then $250,000 a year with public mandated health insurance yet his own justice department has said they will use the right of the government to tax when the states appeals go to court.

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• FinallyHere Posts: 821 ✭✭✭

  September 25, 2003 4:54AM

  At a quick glance, I like Mint State Three Cent Nickels, Shield and Liberty Nickels when compared to the Proofs. But, I was liking them when they were 20% lower than they are now and I still like them for value.....
  
  Mike

  Mike Printz
  Harlan J. Berk, Ltd.
  https://hjbltd.com/#!/department/us-coins

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• BillJones Posts: 34,768 ✭✭✭✭✭

  September 25, 2003 5:12AM

  Yes, the copper-nickel coinage is a lot harder to find in Choice Mint State than Proof. The trouble is a lot of the coins, even in slabs with numbers one them like MS-65 and 66 have too many black ("carbon") spots on them for my taste. Also too many of them have been dipped. A lot of these coins end up looking like heaven today and hell tomorrow.

  Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?

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• greghansen Posts: 4,301 ✭✭✭

  September 25, 2003 5:21AM

  The MS65 Shield Nickels look like a good buy at current prices.
  
  Trimes & Half Dimes will always be hampered by their small size, IMO. 3 Cent Nickels will be hampered by their ugliness.
  
  IHC are always going to outperform based upon large collector base.
  
  I also think every unimpaired MS65RD Two Cent piece that can be bought for under $1,000....should be.
  
  Good post! Interesting stuff.

  Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum

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• mgoodm3 Posts: 17,497 ✭✭✭

  September 25, 2003 5:29AM

  They seem to fall pretty well into a pop vs price scale. It would be interesting if they could be graphed with populationon the x and price on the Y. See how they fall out.

  coinimaging.com/my photography articles Check out the new macro lens testing section

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• michael Posts: 9,524 ✭✭✭

  September 26, 2003 3:45PM

  greg hansen i totally disagree with you i think you are totally wrong
  
  
  
  half dimes trimes and three cent nicks are stand out rare coins that look absolutely fantastic no matter what their size is
  
  
  and rare and rarely seen as such
  
  here are four examples of totally ugly trime in ms three cent nicks both in proof and half dime in ms totally common crappy coins
  
  michael

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• roadrunner Posts: 28,313 ✭✭✭✭✭

  September 26, 2003 10:25PM

  When comparing prices vs pops I use a basic thumbrule of 3x pops for a halving of the price. At 2x the pop it's not such a bargain at half the price. I look for 4x to 6x the pops for half the price as good deals. 20-50% pop spreads are often just not significant for a price increase. Look at MS65 RD half cents vs. say any of the proof dollar types. You have to get into PF67/68 grades to equal the rarity. Yet the price of the half cent is but a fraction. About the same pop for a PF68 PCGS Morgan vs a MSRD half cent (40 pieces). Yet 4x the price.
  Of course Morgans ar e in feverish demand and the bigger coin is very impressive. But I like the half cent for long term value.
  
  I use proof trade and morgan dollars as the beacon for overpriced proofs. That is compare the Morgans to any other major proof type coin. Too common. MS65 trade/seated dollars far tougher than
  the proofs by leaps and bounds. MS65 Trades are a give away compared to the PF65's.
  
  roadrunner

  Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold

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