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odds that this 64 mantle psa 9 shows?
begsu1013
Posts: 1,943 ✭✭
9/7/15
1964 mantle
i am on the fence and giving it about a 13% chance it shows.
but figured it'd be a good thing to watch progress and potentially help others somewhere in the future,
been down this road before, know the process and helped/conversed w/ another member recently that was subject of a hijacked account...
several red flags:
1. feedback barely above 300.
2. it's listing/sell price was just under the $5K magical number that is auto escalated upon listing/selling/cc processing
3. smr = $5500. (yes, smr so...) listing price was only $4800obo
4. last three vcp prices are about a year old, but: $5400, $6800 & $4990...so my "purchase" price is well below all of these
5. only one other recent item sold: michael jordan signed card w/ $5000obo.
6. the rest is small dollar buy items and most are set to "private"
(ok, so no real recent sell activity other than a jordan/mantle. the 2 names synonymous w/ fake listings)
to fully protect myself i:
went ahead and called in ahead of time and had the hv security team (dustin) give the a-ok to pay.
used the amex, naturally.
documenting everything (here)
my guess is that i get a UPS tracking number tomorrow that gets delivered somewhere in savannah on wed., but not to my address....
fully protected but maybe there's a chance it shows.
i figure if it's bogus, then at least it's off the bay/somebody else doesn't get taken advantage who mighta got the request to pay offline via bank account...
and another hijacked ebay acct closed.
so, let's see what happens...
and if anyone wants to weigh in w/ their chances of this thing showing, please do.
1964 mantle
i am on the fence and giving it about a 13% chance it shows.
but figured it'd be a good thing to watch progress and potentially help others somewhere in the future,
been down this road before, know the process and helped/conversed w/ another member recently that was subject of a hijacked account...
several red flags:
1. feedback barely above 300.
2. it's listing/sell price was just under the $5K magical number that is auto escalated upon listing/selling/cc processing
3. smr = $5500. (yes, smr so...) listing price was only $4800obo
4. last three vcp prices are about a year old, but: $5400, $6800 & $4990...so my "purchase" price is well below all of these
5. only one other recent item sold: michael jordan signed card w/ $5000obo.
6. the rest is small dollar buy items and most are set to "private"
(ok, so no real recent sell activity other than a jordan/mantle. the 2 names synonymous w/ fake listings)
to fully protect myself i:
went ahead and called in ahead of time and had the hv security team (dustin) give the a-ok to pay.
used the amex, naturally.
documenting everything (here)
my guess is that i get a UPS tracking number tomorrow that gets delivered somewhere in savannah on wed., but not to my address....
fully protected but maybe there's a chance it shows.
i figure if it's bogus, then at least it's off the bay/somebody else doesn't get taken advantage who mighta got the request to pay offline via bank account...
and another hijacked ebay acct closed.
so, let's see what happens...
and if anyone wants to weigh in w/ their chances of this thing showing, please do.
0
Comments
- carrod58"
responded w/ sounds good and how do ya plan to ship? usps, fedex or ups?
and agreed. certainly not the best 9 either, but for the price (again, if it shows) it's a no brainer...
Lou Gehrig Master Set
Non-Registry Collection
Game Used Cards Collection
<< <i>if you do get a package, video-record when you open it .... it'd be great to receive something but suck to open a box that only contains a dirty shoe ... >>
ha! but what if it's a jordan v? (non retro of course)
and hate that another collector would have to sell at a loss. especially mantles.
but i must say, things are looking up odds wise....
also got a response back stating that he'd be shipping via USPS insured, so that hopefully knocks the current "UPS scam" off the list.
<< <i>I got bad news...... I'm the one who bought the 52 Psa 8 and after I kindly ask for a picture of the card in his possession because he has no history of selling high dollor cards but It's been 4 days and no response. He's lifting scans so 0% chance of getting it. There's a epidemic of accounts being hijacked and scans being lifted on ebay. It's really scary. >>
Thanks for posting this begus. If this is real, it would be a miracle. As noted earlier, this card was sold to e***u from mint express in Oct of last year fro $5,400. If you look at the image in that auction, it's the exact same image in the current auction (shadowing/light/angle). Not necessarily a smoking gun, but enough to make one pause based on the cumulative evidence you noted. Appears you've done a great job of risk mitigation, so kudos for outing this bid.
I'm in the camp that this is fraud. Who sells high grade Mantles after a year of massive appreciation for a loss? What you may have going for you; if this scan was lifted, where is the owner of the actual card (e***u)? What are the odds the owner doesn't see this listing? Someone buying vintage PSA 9 Mantles would certainly see this listing, right? Maybe even a board member...
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
..right now don't have the time to absorb the small details of this thread but just read your reply...once i read that, i looked up his listing again......are you saying someone (a CU member) may own the mantle thats pictured in his listing? i know my 9 has that wrinkled appearing flip, thats whats ringing a bell....but it does look familiar.....but i don't think I've ever bought from "mint express" or do you mean thru ebay...who are they?
.i know this is time sensitive and want to help begsu1013 ASAP....im not near the card and would take a lot of doing to get someone to locate it....but the pic is familiar...mostly cause of the flip and not many 9s out there
main point in posting was to simply advise folks on what/how to properly spot/document for an easy claim process.
I've been thru it before and hopefully helped addictedtoebay w/ his hijacked recovery efforts...
if it's not done properly it can be a long, drawn out and extremely aggravating process, especially in an empty box or right town/wrong address scam.
for the record and just to have it out there:
the last thing you want to do in this instance is claim fraud on your amex.
ya need to let the ebay/paypal thing run it's course. this is especially important if the UPS "same hometown but different address" scam is used.
once you file w/ amex, it takes the claims and recourse that ebay/paypal have right off the table and you are stuck w/ amex appeal process (which isn't a bad thing).
but it's simply just not wise to burn your ebay/paypal chances right outta the gate. instead of 3 appeals (ebay/paypal/amex) you are automatically down to 1 (amex).
also, do not rely simply on the "auto process".
it's best to take the extra 10 minutes and call in and document who you talked to and when.
will keep updating and let ya'll know if any tracking numbers are generated and of which carrier.
<< <i>i know this is time sensitive and want to help begsu1013 ASAP....im not near the card and would take a lot of doing to get someone to locate it....but the pic is familiar...mostly cause of the flip and not many 9s out there >>
i'm good. no worries or need to feel rush. naturally check when ya get a sec and lemme know...
a nail in the coffin would be good and i'll get ya that money so you can send me my mantle asap!
<< <i>sdub.....
..right now don't have the time to absorb the small details of this thread but just read your reply...once i read that, i looked up his listing again......are you saying someone (a CU member) may own the mantle thats pictured in his listing? i know my 9 has that wrinkled appearing flip, thats whats ringing a bell....but it does look familiar.....but i don't think I've ever bought from "mint express" or do you mean thru ebay...who are they?
.i know this is time sensitive and want to help begsu1013 ASAP....im not near the card and would take a lot of doing to get someone to locate it....but the pic is familiar...mostly cause of the flip and not many 9s out there >>
No, I was hypothetically proposing that if this scan was lifted, it may be a card that is now owned by someone on this board, unless of course, you are e***u on e-bay. Between the lurkers and the members here, you would think that odds of someone owning that card would notice this thread; again, assuming this is a lifted-scan. I made reference to the exact same photo in the 10/14/14 auction only to reference the possibility of a stolen scan, not ownership. Lifting a scan of a high profile card, with a low pop, that sells rarely, seems to me would increase the risk of the owner seeing it.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
but seriously, i would sell you my 9 except i loved that 64 card, the centering, the block lettering etc. despite having an 8. Which i sold to help defray the cost.
i hope i can help and Im still believing your deal is legit. Although some here now have me concerned. Ill let u know asap. I still don't recall a mint express tho.
sdub..I def wasn't accusatory..i was actually deferring to your research and expertise..so that id know whether to call and have someone dig around for it or wait for me to locate it.
So I just wanted your opinion. And you're abs correct, its a small world that we collect in. Im not sure the POP of a 9 but prob on just one hand. Thanks again.
...oh, and my ebay name is not e***u but aren't those scrambled?
so i guess i will not be sending you that money after all, see below?
chances of replacing/upgrading are getting bleaker by the minute!
Bad news.....it def matches the card in your link, wrinkled flip and all....i hate to be the bearer of bad news....but the card in that ebay listing is at my home.....had them look up my notes and it says it was purchased on 10/12/14 for over 5k. Most likely ebay. Id have to get it in hand in order to get more details, exact price, if "mint express" sold thru ebay etc. I'm told I bought a '60 Mantle at the same time but not sure if it was from the same seller.
Didn't want you to have to wait, I def would hate to be waiting so i put a nonbaseballcard person to work into the basement "archives" looking for it. They thought it was a strange call.
Ive never listed it for sale (meaning never posted a pic) because there are some people who want it, including CU members, that I would call first before listing it.
Again Im sorry but glad i could help. Looks like you got your bases covered. Cash wise. And hopefully catching him early so he can't continue to sell.
CU members..so would be his next step?....ive heard video taping the opening of the package (is that even admissible?), maybe opening it in front of the desk clerk or delivery man as a witness?
..let us know how you're going to handle this. Is there a way to catch him? LMK if I can help further. Not a problem. Cant stand people like these. Criminals, thieves.
scam
<< <i>I think this is also the same guy. He jumps from account to account lifting scans:
scam >>
A Rolex and a Mantle RC from a guy who buys push up bras and bikinis. Talk about a red flag..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
<< <i>
<< <i>I think this is also the same guy. He jumps from account to account lifting scans:
scam >>
A Rolex and a Mantle RC from a guy who buys push up bras and bikinis. Talk about a red flag..
Lol it must be a chick then. She got me for $6,500... Got it back but took almost three weeks.....
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I think this is also the same guy. He jumps from account to account lifting scans:
scam >>
A Rolex and a Mantle RC from a guy who buys push up bras and bikinis. Talk about a red flag..
Lol it must be a chick then. She got me for $6,500... Got it back but took almost three weeks.....
I'm glad you got your money back. It's infuriating how these scammers get away with this kind of fraud without ever leaving the house.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
i'm covered. and again, at least they didn't get some poor schmuck via paypal fnf for an "extra 10% off" and another acct will be shutdown...
was worth a shot!
don't even need to call in yet, even w/ obvious and overwhelming proof... per ebay rules i still have to give the guy a certain amount of time to ship "a" box...
been down this road, but how f'd up is that?
my guess is she's/he's now a ghost and will never be heard from again and no tracking info will be applied.
other than my measly 13% chance, pretty much nailed this one from the start.
id ask ebay if something could be done....they could ask him to verify the card etc....im home and everything, including psa cert #, matches. So this is a unique situation in a way. To be caught with irrefutable proof. Follow the trail of your money? It has to end up somewhere and be "claimed" at some point. And for the dollar amount this should qualify for grand larceny or something bigger than we would think. Since you just sent the money it probably hasn't cleared to be withdrawn. Just spitballing but this really fries me. I still think that there has to be some options.
begsu....again sorry but also thanks for helping and educating those who don't know. Like keeping your refund options open, 3 vs 1, etc.
..and your correct, now it is your card, so just send 5k to this nigerian bank account and ill even have a nigerian prince pick it up....
..wonder if he's lurking here right now..hmm
i bought a 51 bowman signed mantle (not the one I just picked up and posted a few months ago) but one probably close to a year and a half ago ago. it was a beater and had a price tag of just under $7k. I bought it instantly. the price seemed to be good, maybe a tad too-good but I've scored before in the past so I was stoked. think I was banned here at this time and posted my find on another board. anyways, the original and current owner let me know, sent me current and proof dated scans w/ same serial/flip, the whole nine yards. guy even wrote me a statement via email all of which was fwded to ebay.
they still made me wait out the 7-10 day grace period for the guy to ship, whatever the time limit it is, before I could file a case.
ebay had irrefutable evidence that they were in the midst of a scam and still did nothing about it. naturally i was dumbfounded, but apparently they are set by their guidelines and rules...
a conspiracy theorist could make a rational argument that maybe they are looking for ways to "lose" money and skim off their bottom line a tad w/ such a lackadaisical approach to blatant fraud. reminds me of the scene in the movie "identity thief" where the cops said they couldn't do anything, even though the knew where she was gonna be, unless she was actually sitting in her office.
basically why I am not freaking now...
there is nothing I could do even if I wanted to.
edit:
and meant to add that the scam artist in this case IS NOT the actual person who opened this ebay account. it's a hijacked account that hasn't been used in a while. the person has simply gained the password for it, switched/linked another bank account to it and withdraws any money that is sent to it. about 2 weeks after the above scam was done, I got an ebay message from an older lady sincerely apologizing and wanted to convey what a mess that scammer had caused for her and her accounts. I could only imagine being on that end of the stick and trying to clear your name.
James
Jordan listing
<< <i>I'm sure the Jordan that the seller has feedback for didn't really sell. The offer history on the card pretty much confirms that. There were four offers, $4900, $4900, $4300 and $1200. The two at $4900 expired, the $4300 was declined and the $1200 was accepted.
James
Jordan listing >>
BINGO.... The $6,500 Namath RC he/she got me for on another account had a + feedback for a 14k 1933 Lou Gehrig card. That feedback was also from a (70) feedback member. They do it to show that they actually have high dollar cards to sell I'm thinking. I bet that's the scammers real account.
<< <i>ha..oh i see the scam now...now for some reason i have to send u my 9 for $2400..you guys are good. Keeps us on our toes. Ha.
but seriously, i would sell you my 9 except i loved that 64 card, the centering, the block lettering etc. despite having an 8. Which i sold to help defray the cost.
i hope i can help and Im still believing your deal is legit. Although some here now have me concerned. Ill let u know asap. I still don't recall a mint express tho.
sdub..I def wasn't accusatory..i was actually deferring to your research and expertise..so that id know whether to call and have someone dig around for it or wait for me to locate it.
So I just wanted your opinion. And you're abs correct, its a small world that we collect in. Im not sure the POP of a 9 but prob on just one hand. Thanks again.
...oh, and my ebay name is not e***u but aren't those scrambled? >>
No issues here seebelow. Incredible set of circumstances that you actually have the card in the scan. Very cool of you to check and verify.
This scammer is being served on a platter to e-bay fraud department. If they can't solve this one in 24 hours, then they are either the biggest dumb**k's on the planet, or they are complicit.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
so been outta contact for past 2 days doing some moving...
was completely wrong on 2 accounts.
1st - thought he'd be a ghost and never heard from again
2nd - that he wouldn't end up shipping UPS.
checked my email last night and get this message:
"Hello,
I realized that I entered incorrect UPS tracking number of
another shipment. Your item was shipped via USPS. USPS
tracking number is 9461209699937890352658 . You may track it
at USPS.com. Thanks"
so, then i go to ebay immediately to see what tracking number he entered and it was this:
**UPS** 1ZE631A11358159318
just for disclosure and irony: you'll see this tracking number was generated from west columbia, sc. this is the same city the other tracking number was generated from when i went thru this on the 51 mantle. too funny.
i have no problem posting these numbers as we know it's empty boxes...if some other scammer is reading this and wants to intercept the USPS box...enjoy the newspaper and peanuts!
so, the UPS one shows delivered. called UPS and the box went to some random address again, as called originally!
now that the bogus box has been delivered, i called in to ebay, requested HV fraud department(never auto-process it) and spoke w/ karine @ desk 6325. gave them all the particulars.
waited on hold for 8 minutes and they confirmed that the account was hijacked and my refund has been initiated.
hope this helps someone somewhere later down the road as this was pretty much text book...
fraud and handled wise!
mick
Ilse York just sent you a refund
Sep 11, 2015 09:24:05 PDT
Transaction ID: 3NG23764V803013D
Dear Robert,
Ilse York just sent you a full refund of $4,810.00 USD for your purchase.
If you have any questions about this refund, please contact Ilse York.
The refund will go to the card you paid with.
To see all the transaction details, please log into your PayPal account. It may take a few moments for this transaction to appear in your account.
<< <i>yep, on the 11th. handled like a champ!
Ilse York just sent you a refund
Sep 11, 2015 09:24:05 PDT
Transaction ID: 3NG23764V803013D
Dear Robert,
Ilse York just sent you a full refund of $4,810.00 USD for your purchase.
If you have any questions about this refund, please contact Ilse York.
The refund will go to the card you paid with.
To see all the transaction details, please log into your PayPal account. It may take a few moments for this transaction to appear in your account. >>
Good to hear but I'm surprised they left the sale up.
full receipt below
Ilse York just sent you a refund
Sep 11, 2015 09:24:05 PDT
Transaction ID: 3NG23764V803013D
Dear Robert,
Ilse York just sent you a full refund of $4,810.00 USD for your purchase.
If you have any questions about this refund, please contact Ilse York.
The refund will go to the card you paid with.
To see all the transaction details, please log into your PayPal account. It may take a few moments for this transaction to appear in your account.
Seller
Ilse York
Ilse.york@yahoo.com
Note from seller
None provided
Original transaction details
Description Unit price Qty Amount
1964 TOPPS MICKEY MANTLE #50 PSA 9 MINT
Item #: 281793630501
$4,800.00 USD 1 $4,800.00 USD
Shipping and handling: $10.00 USD
Insurance: $0.00 USD
Total: $4,810.00 USD
Status: Pending until Wednesday, September 16, 2015
Invoice Number: PGW_20705534437
Sincerely,
PayPal
they did take away my bonus bucks as well. this purchased ended up maxing out my bonus bucks for that account.
logged back in last week and saw it was back down to $454.
on the previous 51 mantle that happened months ago, i did get to keep the bucks.
received my refund just fine. actually happened back on the 16th, but this am I get hit w/ 4 messages from the "seller". here is one of them....
cant tell if it's russian or just random script or what:
"Dear xxxxx,
pojuy govna ublodok americosovskiy
- carrod58"
<< <i>.......pojuy govna ublodok americosovskiy......... >>
That is crackalackastanian for "Now I have your address wiseguy."
<< <i>weird turn of events.
received my refund just fine. actually happened back on the 16th, but this am I get hit w/ 4 messages from the "seller". here is one of them....
cant tell if it's russian or just random script or what:
"Dear xxxxx,
pojuy govna ublodok americosovskiy
- carrod58" >>
I tried a translator on-line, says it might be Bosnian?? Govna is the only word I can get translated and that word in English is sh!t.
we did catch him and call him out pretty early.
guessing he didn't make off w/ the cash?
hysterical!!!