Recent Rip from sty2298 a.k.a. tbine - Doesn't Add Up

cpamike · April 10, 2011 10:54AM

Hello Everyone,

I recently ripped open a 1973 Topps Baseball wax pack I purchased last year from eBay seller, sty2298. Those of you who know me know that I'd rather have my wisdom teeth pulled out than to rip open a pack of cards, but I had some questions regarding whether the pack was authentic or not. I finally decided to open it up last weekend as I could not be comfortable with any questionable pack and didn't want to send it in for grading. It had the following cards in this order:

Leroy Stanton - 18 (Wax Card)
1972 Stolen Base Leaders - 64
Richie Scheinblum - 78
Jim Brewer - 126
Tony Taylor - 29
Carl Taylor - 99
Randy Moffitt - 43
Jim Lonborg - 3
Milt Pappas - 70
Steve Dunning - 53 (Gum Card)

Although they are all first series, the cards just didn't seem quite right so I went and checked the seller's feedback and found this left some time after my purchase...

Received item as promised, but certain that packs were previously opened Member id 6260timm ( Feedback Score Of 371) Aug-28-10 07:13
2 1975 topps mini baseball wax packs (#170518790845) US $37.99

I also noticed that the seller hasn't listed any more unopened packs after that feedback was left. Interesting to me.

So what do you guys think? Was I taken for a ride?

Sean1125 · April 10, 2011 10:57AM

It's so far after the fact I don't think you can do much anyway

cpamike · April 10, 2011 11:03AM

<< It's so far after the fact I don't think you can do much anyway >>

Agreed. Just giving the board food for thought regarding the seller. Wish that other guy bought his pack first.

I only paid around $35 for it. Wax is so much harder for me to tell if its been tampered with and I don't like to rip it open so the seller got a pass on this one.

Toro · April 10, 2011 11:26AM

That's a tough one, I'm sure those that buy unopened have been taken for a ride at one time or another. If the cards look worn, it was likely resealed. Even BBCE gets taken, I ripped a few 80 Topps from the group rip and found a team checklist that had been marked. It was already previously realized by others in the rip and Steve has given us store credit for the packs. It's best to stick with the best!

cpamike · April 10, 2011 11:34AM

<< That's a tough one, I'm sure those that buy unopened have been taken for a ride at one time or another. If the cards look worn, it was likely resealed. Even BBCE gets taken, I ripped a few 80 Topps from the group rip and found a team checklist that had been marked. It was already previously realized by others in the rip and Steve has given us store credit for the packs. It's best to stick with the best! >>

You are right there Toro. Steve is a stand up guy.

The cards are really in at least NM shape so whoever made the pack wasn't a pig about it like you found out. Who puts a marked team checklist in a re-sealed pack. I've been told the sequencing of the cards does not add up which is why I showed them in the order that they were pulled from the pack.

bobbyw8469 · April 10, 2011 11:36AM

<< Steve has given us store credit for the packs >>

That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW!

grote15 · April 10, 2011 11:38AM

The seller has FB as a buyer from a resealer, so I'd say yes..

Stone193 · April 10, 2011 11:45AM

<< 

<< It's so far after the fact I don't think you can do much anyway >>

Agreed. Just giving the board food for thought regarding the seller. Wish that other guy bought his pack first.

I only paid around $35 for it. Wax is so much harder for me to tell if its been tampered with and I don't like to rip it open so the seller got a pass on this one. >>

Hi Mike

35 bucks seems kind of low for the pack? That might be a red flag as such?

Did the cards appear worn? I don't collect this kind of stuff anymore.

stangrider · April 10, 2011 11:49AM

Recently purchased 3 75 mini wax packs(claims from full box) from %100 percent feedback seller. First one I opened had a marked checklist......disappointed to say the least. Seller did refund immediately to their credit. Ebay is just not the place to purchase wax period.

cpamike · April 10, 2011 11:54AM

<< Recently purchased 3 75 mini wax packs(claims from full box) from %100 percent feedback seller. First one I opened had a marked checklist......disappointed to say the least. Seller did refund immediately to their credit. Ebay is just not the place to purchase wax period. >>

I agree with you totally and I don't buy any wax on eBay anymore either.

csmtampa · April 10, 2011 11:55AM

<< 

<< Steve has given us store credit for the packs >>

That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW! >>

Not everyone can be perfect like you Bobby. I don't see the problem with them getting store credit. I'm sure if they wanted a refund Steve would have given them one.

cpamike · April 10, 2011 11:59AM

<< Hi Mike

35 bucks seems kind of low for the pack? That might be a red flag as such?

Did the cards appear worn? I don't collect this kind of stuff anymore. >>

Hello Mike, hope all is well.

No, the cards are actually at least NM and a couple I think are NM-MT. This person was trying to do a good job with the re-seal, but the sequencing is not right from what I understand.

This was probably the last wax pack I've bought on eBay. I'm more comfortable with cello and racks to be honest with you.

cpamike · April 10, 2011 12:09PM

<< 

<< 

<< Steve has given us store credit for the packs >>

That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW! >>

Not everyone can be perfect like you Bobby. I don't see the problem with them getting store credit. I'm sure if they wanted a refund Steve would have given them one. >>

No one is perfect. Even Steve would tell you that. Not many stand behind their product like Steve.

Let's stay on point with this seller. In case anyone wants to know the seller's name is Todd Bine as it is possible he uses other eBay accounts.

Sean1125 · April 10, 2011 12:24PM

Atleast we know Steve is still human

grote15 · April 10, 2011 12:36PM

Well, the FB I was referring to that was left for the seller is the same as the buyer, so no question this pack was resealed..

miconelegacy · April 10, 2011 1:18PM

That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW!

There were 2 boxes sold out, and as soon as someone first reported this, and then a second, Steve offered the credit right away. It was probably purchased from a lot, as they buy truckloads of wax and it got by them. I had a pack that had a creased card right on top. I just don't know why someone would take the time to reseal a whole box of 1980 Topps. Sounds too time consuming anyway.

Either way this is the first time I have heard of any issue with them in 3 years of dealing's. I don't feel that they owe more than store credit for the incident. I will continue to buy from them with full confidence.

JMHO.

CNote · April 10, 2011 1:26PM

<< 

<< Steve has given us store credit for the packs >>

That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW! >>

Yeah, Steve should have cut up his first born and given to those that got released stuff.....

brendanb438 · April 10, 2011 1:28PM

This is why I won't buy unopened packs off eBay even with good deals and cashback. BBCE is the only option.

bobbyw8469 · April 10, 2011 1:31PM

<< Yeah, Steve should have cut up his first born and given to those that got released stuff..... >>

I wouldn't say all that, but I think a store credit is pretty lame.

Toro · April 10, 2011 1:57PM

<< That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW! >>

<< I wouldn't say all that, but I think a store credit is pretty lame. >>

He would refund my money if I so choose but I'm holding out for another group rip. What do you think he should give me in return?

cpamike, sorry for hijacking your thread. Last thing, I only know of a few trusted vintage unopened sources on eBay. Fristch and BBCE....I believe probstein is good too but he does consign so there is risk there. I did make a big 75 cello purchase last year from a eBay seller that claimed he had them since the mid 70's. His other items, feedback and age seemed that the story was legit. Cello in the late 70's blow though. I opened half the box and didn't pull any possible 10's due to the tight wrap. I only kept going cause it's all for my PC.

cpamike · April 10, 2011 2:02PM

No problem Toro. Good luck with whatever you choose to get from Steve!!!

bobbyw8469 · April 10, 2011 8:53PM

<< He would refund my money if I so choose but I'm holding out for another group rip. What do you think he should give me in return? >>

It should have been your money back, no questions asked. If you then chose to spend it again with him, then that is your perogative. Store credit is ensuring he doesn't have to refund, even though he sold a bad product, and the money (and profit) stays in house.....

Garabaldi · April 10, 2011 9:56PM

You are rolling the dice anytime you buy unopened wax from older packs.

jradke4 · April 11, 2011 1:19AM

<< 

<< That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! WOW! >>

<< I wouldn't say all that, but I think a store credit is pretty lame. >>

He would refund my money if I so choose but I'm holding out for another group rip. What do you think he should give me in return?

cpamike, sorry for hijacking your thread. Last thing, I only know of a few trusted vintage unopened sources on eBay. Fristch and BBCE....I believe probstein is good too but he does consign so there is risk there. I did make a big 75 cello purchase last year from a eBay seller that claimed he had them since the mid 70's. His other items, feedback and age seemed that the story was legit. Cello in the late 70's blow though. I opened half the box and didn't pull any possible 10's due to the tight wrap. I only kept going cause it's all for my PC. >>

Fristch? how about this. back when bonds was making his run Fristch was running ads to sell the Topps Traded sets. my cousin at the time bought a set. for those that dont remember topps traded sets came with tape over the lids. well when my cousin got his factory set from Fristch, the tape was cut and the bonds card was pulled out. lets just say that card was far from even coming back a PSA 6 or 7.

grote15 · April 11, 2011 4:24AM

[He would refund my money if I so choose but I'm holding out for another group rip. What do you think he should give me in return? >>

It should have been your money back, no questions asked. If you then chose to spend it again with him, then that is your perogative. Store credit is ensuring he doesn't have to refund, even though he sold a bad product, and the money (and profit) stays in house.....

Aren't you the same guy who had to start a thread asking if he should accept a return from a fellow board member for a card that was not accurately described? And now you're lecturing Steve Hart on customer service skills? Please..

bobbyw8469 · April 11, 2011 4:35AM

<< Aren't you the same guy who had to start a thread asking if he should accept a return from a fellow board member for a card that was not accurately described? And now you're lecturing Steve Hart on customer service skills? Please.. >>

And if I remember right, PSA agreed that the card was the correct grade and not misgraded the whole time!!! The guy bought an '8' and he received an '8'. He was just looking for a high end '8' for a possible bump.....so get off my back Grote.

grote15 · April 11, 2011 5:03AM

So you paint the buyer as greedy instead of acknowledging that the card had a defect on back that looked like paper loss..ok, I get it now..

bobbyw8469 · April 11, 2011 5:12AM

<< So you paint the buyer as greedy instead of acknowledging that the card had a defect on back that looked like paper loss..ok, I get it now.. >>

I'm confused as to where your beef is?!?! Is it with ME for selling a PSA 8, or is it with PSA, for agreeing that the card was a PSA 8 and they were not going to change the grade???

Let me repeat myself...PSA looked at the card, not once, but TWICE. Both time PSA said the card was an '8'. If you have a beef with the way PSA grades cards, then why do you continue to use them and visit these boards?!?! Why don't you get off my back.....this 'mob' mentality grows old quick!

KatsCards · April 11, 2011 5:54AM

<< I'm confused as to where your beef is?!?! Is it with ME for selling a PSA 8, or is it with PSA, for agreeing that the card was a PSA 8 and they were not going to change the grade???

Let me repeat myself...PSA looked at the card, not once, but TWICE. Both time PSA said the card was an '8'. If you have a beef with the way PSA grades cards, then why do you continue to use them and visit these boards?!?! Why don't you get off my back.....this 'mob' mentality grows old quick! >>

Umm...when you talk crap about quite possibly the best unopened dealer in the business--the same dealer who has done wonders for many many board members--you shouldn't be so surprised that you ruffled a few feathers.

Just sayin'

bobbyw8469 · April 11, 2011 6:04AM

<< Just sayin' >>

I'm saying if the best seller of unopened wax sells a sealed pack with a marked checklist, he should REFUND money, not issue a store credit. Too much hypocrisy on this here board...... If I did that, I would be tarred and feathered. He does it and he gets a free pass...... The store credit ensures that he is getting to keep your money and ensure himself a profit. What if there isn't anything else from him you want?!?! Then the store credit goes wasted.

gumbyfan · April 11, 2011 6:24AM

<< 

<< Just sayin' >>

I'm saying if the best seller of unopened wax sells a sealed pack with a marked checklist, he should REFUND money, not issue a store credit. Too much hypocrisy on this here board...... If I did that, I would be tarred and feathered. He does it and he gets a free pass...... The store credit ensures that he is getting to keep your money and ensure himself a profit. What if there isn't anything else from him you want?!?! Then the store credit goes wasted. >>

Buy a business license, open a business, put in 20 years earning a stellar reputation and business following and then maybe you can set your own business practices. Until then, don't compare your fly-by-night internet message board sales with a reputable business.

Use the advice you gave to grote...if you don't like BBCE's business practices, don't use them.

Sean1125 · April 11, 2011 6:47AM

bobbyw8469 · April 11, 2011 6:55AM

I think everyone is missing the point. The only thing I said, is that if they sell bad product, they should refund money. Issuing a store credit is worthless.
If Wal-Mart, Sears, Home Depot, et al, sold something funky and you tried to return it and they offered "store credit", what would you say to them? That is all I am saying.....
Take the "mob mentality", and the "we hate him, so he makes no sense" thinking out the window. That went out in the Jim Crow days....

gumbyfan · April 11, 2011 7:04AM

<< I think everyone is missing the point. The only thing I said, is that if they sell bad product, they should refund money. Issuing a store credit is worthless.
If Wal-Mart, Sears, Home Depot, et al, sold something funky and you tried to return it and they offered "store credit", what would you say to them? That is all I am saying.....
Take the "mob mentality", and the "we hate him, so he makes no sense" thinking out the window. That went out in the Jim Crow days.... >>

Bobby, it might be best to take yourself down off of that cross you've put yourself on. I wasn't responding with a "mob mentality" nor do I hate you or think you make no sense. I just think you're being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative...and now you're playing the part of martyr because many have disagreed with your statements. Sometimes when most people disagree with you, it means you're wrong, and not that everyone is out to get you.

But to respond to your point, again, I'll share one of my BBCE experiences. I had an issue with a product I bought from BBCE once and Steve told me to just toss it out and gave me store credit. If I had made that purchase from Wal-Mart, Sears, Home Depot, et al, I would have had to drive back to the store to get it handled rather than just toss it out. Also, MANY retailers have a refund policy of store credit so this isn't really that strange of a way to handle returns.

thunderdan · April 11, 2011 7:08AM

Bobby, I disagree it is worthless. How many of those who participated in the rip will at some point buy other wax to rip? And who would most--if not all--of them say is the most reputable source? The answers would likely be: Yes and BBCE. These credits will definitely not be wasted. I'm pretty sure if any one who participated requested their money back from Steve, he would oblige.

You are assuming he would not grant a full refund if asked--or maybe you're suggesting he should have offered a full refund as the default option.

Either way, I think this is an overreaction, as we all know Steve has a stellar reputation for treating people fairly.

RipublicaninMass · April 11, 2011 7:12AM

<< 
Take the "mob mentality", and the "we hate him, so he makes no sense" thinking out the window. That went out in the Jim Crow days.... >>

bobbyw8469 · April 11, 2011 7:28AM

Good one Mr. Mob!!

Also, good business practices should be followed whether you sell a couple of items on a message board, or have been in business 20 years. Just because you have been in business longer doesn't give you a free pass. I'm going to let this drop, and say that I guess some mebers have a different way of handling things/see things in a different light...... I appreciate and understand everyone's point of view, and I hope mine are appreciated the same way. I am not THAT far out into left field....

tunahead08 · April 11, 2011 7:35AM

I'll answer your question Bobby, if another retailer offered me store credit for this, I would simply ask for a refund instead. I bet if someone asked BBCE for a refund instead of the store credit, it would be given to them. The fact is, most of the people offered the store credit are probably good with that and will make future purchases from BBCE.

gumbyfan · April 11, 2011 7:36AM

<< Good one Mr. Mob!!

Also, good business practices should be followed whether you sell a couple of items on a message board, or have been in business 20 years. Just because you have been in business longer doesn't give you a free pass. Also, not one person has answered my question (just an observation)........ >>

Which question, Bobby?

<< That kinda blows...you bought a resealed pack from supposedly the "best" sealed wax seller on the planet, and all you got was store credit!?!?!?! >>

<< I'm confused as to where your beef is?!?! Is it with ME for selling a PSA 8, or is it with PSA, for agreeing that the card was a PSA 8 and they were not going to change the grade??? >>

<< If you have a beef with the way PSA grades cards, then why do you continue to use them and visit these boards?!?! >>

<< What if there isn't anything else from him you want?!?! >>

<< If Wal-Mart, Sears, Home Depot, et al, sold something funky and you tried to return it and they offered "store credit", what would you say to them? >>

Maybe we were all confused when you called a bunch of us racists.

<< That went out in the Jim Crow days.... >>

grote15 · April 11, 2011 7:37AM

Steve sold two boxes of 1980 Topps basseball wax packs...one box was obviously searched but the other box may very well have been ok. In any case, Steve told everyone to keep all the packs and he'd offer a store credit to EVERYONE who purchased packs from EITHER box, even if the other box was good. For those members who'd have preferred to actually return their packs, I am 100% certain that Steve would have issued a FULL monetary refund.

cpamike · April 11, 2011 10:56AM

Is it safe to come back out yet???

By the way, Todd Bine does not give refunds or store credits for his re-sealed packs in case anyone is wondering.

bobbyw8469 · April 11, 2011 11:06AM

<< Is it safe to come back out yet??? >>

God, I sure hope so! Don't beat me massa....I was just joshun!

cpamike · April 11, 2011 11:21AM

<< 

<< Is it safe to come back out yet??? >>

God, I sure hope so! Don't beat me massa....I was just joshun! >>

No problem Bobby. Now if you know where I can get a hold of Todd Bine.

Toro · April 11, 2011 11:45AM

Again, if I wanted or anyone else wanted, we can get a full refund. The issue is, vintage packs are like crack and Steve has a lot of crack!

ThoseBackPages · April 11, 2011 12:58PM

WHO says "crack is wack?" lol

Recent Rip from sty2298 a.k.a. tbine - Doesn't Add Up

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