Paypal refund return ship question
1989FleerBillRipkencollector
Posts: 4,590
I bought 2 fake (made) football wax trays. Called Paypal, and rec'd my $ back.
I asked about returning items, she said if I want to. ??
You dont have to return items? I was refunded shipping for my 1st one but not my 2nd one, not that that matters. (that that?)
I have no problem sending these back but afraid doing so might make it that much easier for him to scam again.
Seller had the $ taken from him over a week ago and no word from him. Our last conversations were him trying to convince me he had them since 1977 direct from Topps. I told him impossible and was seeking a refund via Paypal.
I asked about returning items, she said if I want to. ??
You dont have to return items? I was refunded shipping for my 1st one but not my 2nd one, not that that matters. (that that?)
I have no problem sending these back but afraid doing so might make it that much easier for him to scam again.
Seller had the $ taken from him over a week ago and no word from him. Our last conversations were him trying to convince me he had them since 1977 direct from Topps. I told him impossible and was seeking a refund via Paypal.
0
Comments
Whatcha wanna know?
I was under the impression that Paypal would not refund $$ until buyer can provide DC that item was returned? Has that changed? If so, that's absolutely ridiculous..
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
I rec'd $205 back from fake wax trays and still have the trays in hand.
They were made/garbage. Should I send them back anyways to avoid a possible reversal of the refund?
I'm only hesitant to return them since seller has not said he wanted them back and if I take the initative to send them anyways, most likely he'll pawn the garbage on some unsuspecting buyer.
<< <i>I was under the impression that Paypal would not refund $$ until buyer can provide DC that item was returned? Has that changed? If so, that's absolutely ridiculous.. >>
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Yup, it's true that folks think it "has changed." Actually, it has been that
way for years.
If the buyer truthfully/fraudulently uses the words "fake," or "counterfeit,"
or "forged," PayPal/EBAY may/will instruct the buyer to either destroy the
item or send it to the RICO-partners in Texas.
.............
Beginning April 8, 2009 the PayPal User Agreement is being amended as follows:
Section 13.4 is being amended to include the following language:
“If you lose a Significantly Not as Described Claim because the item you sold is counterfeit, you will be required to provide a full refund to the buyer and you will not receive the item back (it will be destroyed).”
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This is a sample of the kind of "lots" they can build, with PayPal
supplying a never-ending cache of confiscated/stolen stuff.
A crooked EBAY buyer simply files a fraudulent SNAD-claim and
returns a fake, PayPal removes the money from the seller's account,
PayPal gets paid by the "liquidator."
sample lot
........................
The FEDS are onto the scam, but they are slow to act.
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<< <i>Nothing like selling an item over and over again. >>
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overandoverandoverandover
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The scam has been ongoing for years.
Steal and Cheat Until Caught, Then Lie About It.
EBAY sells the merch through a texas outfit.
...............
When the RICO actions start flying against EvilBAY, I hope
the perps all get life in prison. Just a bunch of gangsters, IMO.
To learn the TRUTH about PayPal, read "The PayPal Wars."
It is free on google in PDF.
...............................
Read the article below, then take a look at this website,
http://forum.purseblog.com/ebay-forum/paypal-wants-the-fake-chanel-309773.html.
Where Do ebay Fakes Go to Die?
http://www.auctionbytes.com/cab/abn/y08/m07/i02/s01
Why does PayPal ask buyers to send counterfeit merchandise purchased on ebay to a warehouse in texas belonging to a liquidator? That's the question some ebay members are asking, and some are questioning whether PayPal is directing the liquidator to resell counterfeit items rather than destroying them.
"The Purse Forum," an online discussion board calling itself a "community for handbag lovers and shoulder fashion fetishists," has an active discussion in which users speculate Liquidity Services is reselling counterfeits on their site on PayPal's behalf. The person who started the thread about PayPal's request for her to send a fake Chanel handbag (in its original condition) to Liquidity Service's address in texas later wrote to say she had filed a complaint with the FBI over the matter.
One buyer who wrote to AuctionBytes had similar concerns. "I became suspicious as to why (PayPal) would want the bags in original condition. Why wouldn't they want me to cut the handles in half or put a big black X on the outside with permanent marker?" she asked.
In response to an inquiry about these claims, Liquidity Services spokesperson Julie Davis told AuctionBytes, "If we receive goods from PayPal that have evidence of or are suspected to be counterfeit, they are destroyed. Liquidation.com would not knowingly sell counterfeit goods in our marketplace."
PayPal explained why it was working with Liquidity Services and how the "Significantly Not as Described" (SNAD) claims process works. Spokesperson Michael Oldenburg said PayPal works with the liquidation firm in a very limited number of cases in Buyer Protection claims where the buyer has filed a Significantly Not as Described claim, and the buyer and seller cannot work it out. "We usually encourage the buyer to return the merchandise to the seller," Oldenburg said.
In cases where they buyer doesn't want to return the merchandise to the seller, or the seller doesn't want the merchandise back, PayPal compensates both parties, he said. In those cases, PayPal asks the buyer to send the merchandise to Liquidity Services.
Liquidity Services does not act as an authenticator, Oldenburg said, and what happens to the item in texas then depends on the type of SNAD claim. If there is an accusation that the item was counterfeit, PayPal says it directs Liquidity Services to destroy the item. Otherwise, Liquidity Services liquidates the item on its own marketplace. "That helps us recover some of our losses because, as I mentioned before, we've already paid out both the buyer and the seller."
However, claims are handled differently if the buyer initiates a chargeback with their credit card company.
"PayPal agents work with sellers, and we advocate on their behalf," Oldenburg said. If the seller can prove the item is authentic, they can give that proof to PayPal who will give it to the credit card company. But if the credit card company sides with the buyer, PayPal complies and withdraws the money from the seller's account.
However, Oldenburg said, sellers in that case can request that PayPal return the item to them if the buyer sends the item to Liquidity Services. "If the situation is a credit card chargeback, the credit card company works with the buyer to have him or her return the merchandise either directly to the seller or to PayPal via Liquidity Services. The buyer is usually required by his or her credit card company to provide proof that the item has been returned." The exception is if the claim is for a counterfeit item, he said.
"We always encourage people to use the online dispute resolution center," Oldenburg said, adding that PayPal tries to facilitate a dialog between the buyer and the seller so they can come to a mutual resolution.
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YIKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They even take PayPal as payment for the "counterfeit" stuff.
YIKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I guess I'll wait a month or so, just in case any problems arise, and I'll destroy/open them up on here.
edited to add **That's scary. I wonder if they even notify the seller. As the buyer I never rec'd any email, just my $ back in my acct.
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I would send them back with SC.
BUT, unless PP insists that you do so, you can keep 'em.
.......
The crooks are soon going to have LOTS of real - and expensive - PSA cards.
They will simply claim the cards are "fake," and if the Texas gang does not want to
sell them, EBAY/PP will tell their partner crooks to "just keep 'em."
The Texas outfit does sell some card lots, so we've gotta figure that they are
getting some of the "confiscated" stuff.
...........
Read "The PayPal Wars," to fully understand what kind of a company you
are actually dealing with.
They made their bones in kiddie-porn, escort svcs, illegal gun sales, dope
sales, money laundering, illegal gaming, and likely helping terrorists receive
money. They have, of course, completely rehabilitated themselves and are
now a sterling outfit.