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ormandh · March 1, 2009 5:22AM

Okay, I sold some New Caledonia notes on Ebay today and they were unc notes. But, I get an email that basically says this...

Dear Dan,
I just bid on all 3 New Caledonia note auctions and won them all. I went to my email and got two emails from ebay users that know my rating and stay in touch and they told me to LOOK CAREFULLY at the scans and enlarge them BECAUSE all the notes I won especially the 2 Fr. Brown and 1 Fr. Purple ALL have a central pressed out vertical fold and are really XF+ graded notes. I could not believe it until NOWE I just enlarged all the scans and I can see ALL the notes do in fact have vertical folds. Can we do something about this Dan? PLEASE help because EF+ notes are only getting 70% at a maximum what a perfect gem UNC note would get. Awaiting your reply Dan.

Now understand, I have the notes in front of me and if you go to my auctions and the pics, not one can you tell has a fold. They do not have folds!! How would you respond?

Post #1 before I get really pissed.

Let me know which ones you bought. I will be glad to give you new scans of said notes. None of these notes have any folds to speak of. If the new scans do not meet your specs, so be it, but if you think that I am going to sell them at a discount you are wrong. I am smart enough to know what a fopld is, so please do not insult my intelligence!!

2nd post After thinking about it for a couple of minutes after the first post:

NONE OF THESE NOTES HAVE BEEN MESSED WITH!! I will be happy to not go throuth the process of selling them to you, but I will not be accused of selling things that I am advertising as such. If you have a problem with this please advise. You will not get these notes for anything but what you paid. Who are you?

3rd post After 10 minutes of stewing:

I will not go through with the deal and will definitely go through ebay to ensure that we all are happy. -Dan

I may get a little bolder as I get more angrier!! What gives? I would like to know how you would respond to this. Is there any recourse, which I could take to insure that I do not get screwed? I do not misrepresent the things I sell. It is beyond me to do so.

theboz11 · March 1, 2009 5:29AM

Did you have an underbidder. Offer him a second chance offer, and file a failed to pay on the first one.

Blackhawk · March 1, 2009 5:34AM

I probably wouldn't use as strong a language as you plan to in the situation, but would let the buyer know that the notes have no folds in them and that it's alright by you if he/she doesn't want to finish the deal. I'm sure that there are fishing schemes like this going on, but the outcome will not be any different whether you try to get a lick in or not...there is a small chance that the guy is legitimate.

ormandh · March 1, 2009 5:38AM

You know, I will have to go back and check. Right now I am beyond words and definitely not thinking straight. It will take me the rest of the night to get over this. I am not usually a violent man, but one of my flaws as a human being is to fight. I guess it has a lot to do with my stature!

Anyhow, I am not too worried about my rating as I am to ensure that the buyer is not able to get the best of me!! Especially, considering the fact that I never have or will misrepresent myself for profit. To accuse me of such is the best way to get me in your face, for I am not scared of anyone(I am sorry to say). -Dan

ormandh · March 1, 2009 5:52AM

<< I probably wouldn't use as strong a language as you plan to in the situation, but would let the buyer know that the notes have no folds in them and that it's alright by you if he/she doesn't want to finish the deal. I'm sure that there are fishing schemes like this going on, but the outcome will not be any different whether you try to get a lick in or not...there is a small chance that the guy is legitimate. >>

I am getting the feeeling that they use that tactic to get what they want for nothing. If they had emailed me before the fact, then I would not have these feelings, but to win the auction and send this email after the fact, plain manipulation. %$#@ 'em. I realize that I may suffer, but I have done nothing wrong and every person has there breaking point! This is mine, plain and simple. If you have something to add to save me from my destiny, then please offer some type of legitmate retort!

theboz11 · March 1, 2009 5:56AM

And no more direct emails from you, Go through ebay dispute from this point on, regardless

Not the one you pay for, just keep it in their system, makes things easier to get your way when you are in the right

.

pheh · March 1, 2009 5:58AM

Well I definitely wouldn't have flipped out on the guy. If you were confident in your grading, and you have the notes in front of you, sell them as you listed them.

Take a look at the images and see if you can see what he says he is seeing.

Finally, email the buyer and tell them you are confident with your grading of the notes. He can better inspect them when he receives them. If he is unhappy with them after receiving them he can request a return for refund.

I had a similar experience not too long ago that resulted in my first negative. The guy was a malicious buyer, plain and simple. I wouldn't cave to his demands for a partial refund and I got negged. I'm not going to get broken up about it though. This guy has to live with himself and probably has a crappy life. I on the other hand will continue to work hard, live by my code of ethics, and do everything within my power to ensure a prosperous future for my family and myself.

mrpotatoheadd · March 1, 2009 6:07AM

edited- apparently, I misunderstood the reason for the initial post.

ormandh · March 1, 2009 6:23AM

Thanks for the "Earth to Dan " posts. I realize that I have to keep things in stride, so to speak. But, I do deal with a lot of people in my life!!!!! I am a contractor presently and have been a manager of a large grocer chain in the past( at 21 years of age), so I really do know how to treat people.

I know that the customer is always right, regardless!! BUT, COMEON. even I, in this type of situation, WILL NOT succumb to this type of manipulation!! Who would?

theboz11 · March 1, 2009 7:05AM

The strongest words I would use , a reminder that it was the bidders responsibility to raise these questions PRIOR to bidding.

mrpotatoheadd · March 1, 2009 7:50AM

edited- apparently, I misunderstood the reason for the initial post.

ormandh · March 1, 2009 8:22AM

<< 

<< BUT, COMEON. even I, in this type of situation, WILL NOT succumb to this type of manipulation!! Who would? >>

In your first post, you said he wrote this: "Can we do something about this Dan?" Do you know what that "something" he wants you to do is? >>

I am only GUESSING that he wants to renegotiate the selling price. However, I am not WILLING, to negotiate anything considering the fact that these notes are CU! So what is your point?

ASUtodd · March 1, 2009 8:24AM

Easy Dan...... just tell him to pay what he bid or you will have to go through Ebay for a resolution...

IloiloKano · March 1, 2009 8:28AM

<< I went to my email and got two emails from ebay users that know my rating and stay in touch and they told me ... >>

I would write back and say,

"I am sorry you did not ask these questions before bidding, but I will not hold you to the bid you placed, and I will proceed with the necessary steps to tell ebay this transaction was terminated by mutual agreement. Unfortunately, that process is to use the "non-paying bidder" method, though ebay assures me it will not negatively impact your ebay rating. You merely need to affirm the agreement to terminate the transaction was mutual. By the way, since ebay now masks the ID's of all bidders, I am curious. How did your friends know that you had bid on that auction, so that they knew to send you an email? Again, I am sorry these questions were not raised prior to your placing your contractual bid, which as I have stated, I will not enforce, since I recognize your concern, and I do not wish to add to the trama you have already endured."

Then I would immediately send a "Second Chance" option to the next highest bidder, followed by initiating a "Non-Paying Bidder", quoting his email, and stating the transaction has been mutually terminated. And if he responds to your email offering a "compromise" solution, simply tell him that you are sorry, but you have already sent the second highest bidder a "Second Chance" offer, as well as already having initiated the "Non-Paying Bidder" process. And then I would say that you are still curious about how your friends knew you bid on my auction, and why they didn't warn you sooner.

The good thing about taking the above route is that it really is the method ebay has set up to mutually terminate a transaction, as I had to follow that procedure, but my scenario involved an honest person. And it bothered me that ebay provided this as the only method to amicably terminate a transaction. My honest customer received an email from ebay, without any of my comments, which described my action as a "dispute", and the only way to see that I was not filing a "dispute" was for the customer to go to ebay and read the details of the "dispute". I contacted ebay about this, and I suggested that there should be another way to handle such a situation, but they simply stated that I could send an email to my customer beforehand, so that there would be no misunderstandings. I doubt that your scammer will follow through, and I also believe he will be less likely to neg you, since he wouldn't want to add evidence for ebay to see regarding this "dispute".

Good luck, and know that many others have also been down the same road.

ormandh · March 1, 2009 8:48AM

Hopefully you get the picture!

lathmach · March 1, 2009 9:58AM

I have looked at all three auctions.
The notes are all crisp uncirculated.
Text
The buyer may be seeing design elements from the other side and think they're folds that have been ironed out.

Ray

ormandh · March 1, 2009 10:12AM

Yeah, I know. But instead of waiting for the notes they were wanting me to renegotiate the purchase price(if you want to read between the lines).

ormandh · March 1, 2009 10:25AM

I am sorry. I did not post the original email I received.

Anyhow, here it is:

Dear Dan,
I just bid on all 3 New Caledonia note auctions and won them all. I went to my email and got two emails from ebay users that know my rating and stay in touch and they told me to LOOK CAREFULLY at the scans and enlarge them BECAUSE all the notes I won especially the 2 Fr. Brown and 1 Fr. Purple ALL have a central pressed out vertical fold and are really XF+ graded notes. I could not believe it until NOWE I just enlarged all the scans and I can see ALL the notes do in fact have vertical folds. Can we do something about this Dan? PLEASE help because EF+ notes are only getting 70% at a maximum what a perfect gem UNC note would get. Awaiting your reply Dan.
Jackie and Dave

Now, I have to admit that I overreacted a bit. I am not used to people second guessing me. I guess maybe I may be a bit arrogant in these situations. Anyhow, we have all agreed not to finish the transaction, so I will have to relist. Hopefully, I can sell these notes now.

But, I amicably allowed them to back out without any repercussion on my part, so all's well that ends well.... I guess.

ajaan · March 1, 2009 10:37AM

Tell him to pay for the notes. After payment is received, send him the notes with a return privilege. If he doesn't like them, tell him to return the notes for a full refund of the closing price.

I bet he keeps the notes.

If he doesn't pay, file a NPB claim with eBay. To me it sounds like he is trying to get a cheaper price on the notes.

mudskippie · March 1, 2009 2:15PM

<< Tell him to pay for the notes. After payment is received, send him the notes with a return privilege. If he doesn't like them, tell him to return the notes for a full refund of the closing price.

I bet he keeps the notes.

If he doesn't pay, file a NPB claim with eBay. To me it sounds like he is trying to get a cheaper price on the notes. >>

I wouldn't tell him to pay for the notes. You should cordially let him know that the notes are uncirculated; you should also mention about your return policy. If he does not want to go through with the sale, then just file a non-sale transaction to get your fees back (you will need his help). Remember to be nice and sincere, it will go a long way

satootoko · March 1, 2009 3:02PM

<< He can better inspect them when he receives them. If he is unhappy with them after receiving them he can request a return for refund. >>

Bad idea!

If you send him the notes, with that offer, chances are you'll get them back folded.

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