Does it bother anyone else ?

Joewoowoo · January 3, 2009 3:25AM

I am talking about game used swatches, bat barrels,ETC... Its nice to have all of these beautiful cards in your collection but does it bother anyone else that all this history is being cut into pieces to satisfy collectors. All this history literally being destroyed before our eyes. share your opinions.

bigwilli · January 3, 2009 3:26AM

No because now i can say , I have a piece of history

bman90278 · January 3, 2009 3:27AM

it doesn't bother me about current players or living players, but I don't like it if someone decides to start cutting up an old Gehrig uniform or something like it.

Brian

lawnmowerman · January 3, 2009 3:28AM

<< No because now i can say , I have a piece of history >>

I agree

daddymc · January 3, 2009 3:29AM

<< it doesn't bother me about current players or living players, but I don't like it if someone decides to start cutting up an old Gehrig uniform or something like it.

Brian >>

Agreed. I don't think it is as much of an issue with the current players, but some of the older historical pieces should not be destroyed.

Karb · January 3, 2009 3:29AM

I'm with Brian. Current players fine. But try to keep the old old bats and uniforms whole

Allen · January 3, 2009 3:37AM

I have no problem because when UD goes under in a couple years and they liquidate their assets they will find all the vintage game used items they have purchased in tact in the safe right next to the 500 rolls of cloth and material.

I have probably owned 10,000+ jersey cards and maybe 5 had any dirt on them.

TheHun · January 3, 2009 3:39AM

This is a tough question.

On one hand I think its great to "share the wealth" with anyone having a chance at owning a piece of history.

On the other hand, as a historian, the possibility to study these artifacts disappears once they have been chopped into pieces.

I have no problem with them chopping modern stuff - the jerseys are switched out every week. But with the older material I would have to say - NO. What are they going to cut up next - the Liberty Bell or the Statue of Liberty ? While I would love to own a piece of such rare history, it would be a crime to do so.

stevek · January 3, 2009 3:40AM

The older "historical pieces" are not destroyed...I absolutely believe that 99.999999999999999% of all those "historical pieces" cut up and offered on cards are pure frauds, probably perpetrated by the estate of the player and willingly accepted by the card company...both of which of course profit from the illusion, and that's all it is...an illusion.

stevek · January 3, 2009 3:42AM

On the other hand the "modern stuff" cutup is basically 100% real, and why not because they can always produce a lot more, a lot more.

IchiroDeported · January 3, 2009 3:42AM

agreed, it's foolish to destroy real memorabilia to make fake ones.

although im fairly certain that 90% of the crap they stick on the cards is bogus or just cut up kitchen chairs and dishrags. they other 10% is the stuff i worry about.

MeteoriteGuy · January 3, 2009 3:42AM

I see no problem in it. The fact is, the sports fields create likely 1000 times more collectibles then any number of US museums could possible want. Further, the attendance to these Museums has been really down the last few years. So since there is a much large supply then demand, and one could even question that demand, why not cut them up and give it to collectors.

rube26105 · January 3, 2009 3:43AM

yeah,what steve said

bigwilli · January 3, 2009 3:44AM

Current players fine. But try to keep the old old bats and uniforms whole

That doesnt make any sense....So you are saying its fine to cut up Ken Griffey and Frank Thomas and Greg Maddux
jersey and bats but dont touch Ruth , Mays and Aaron jersey and bats.

A HOFer is a HOFer regardless of when they played . I believe cutting up jerseys and bats is a way for collectors to own
a piece of history that otherwise we would never have . I do think that they flooded the hobby with these kinds of things.
It used to be exciting to pull these out of packs . Now some companies put these in every other pack . Not exciting anymore

nightcrawler · January 3, 2009 3:45AM

My opinion is on the fence. It bothers me a bit, but I really like some of them.

rube26105 · January 3, 2009 3:50AM

<Not exciting anymore >

especially when ya get the guys that end up working at a gas staion like frank zapa said,thats who i always get

Allen · January 3, 2009 4:02AM

A lot of the vintage material they get is from damaged items that you could not do much else with. They are the Ruth jerseys that got eaten by the moths in the attic or got moisture and mold damage. So they create something cool from it.

frankhardy · January 3, 2009 4:08AM

When you guys speak of the possibility of fake jersey swatches, I think that is one of the reasons why they have gone down in value (along with overproduction) and that autographed cards will always do well. Just my opinion.

Ladder7 · January 3, 2009 4:14AM

Simply brilliant!

divecchia · January 3, 2009 4:17AM

I'm OK with cutting up uniforms of modern players which there are a ton of, but against cutting up vintage uniforms for game used memorabilia cards.

Donato

Boopotts · January 3, 2009 4:23AM

I don't have an ethical problem with it, but I do think that coveting a piece of cardboard that has a piece of another man's shirt embedded in it is more than just a little bit creepy.

fiveniner · January 3, 2009 4:24AM

As most of you know I am Old School and being an Old Goat at 60 and I think that cutting up vintage uniforms and such is a shame.

BunchOBull · January 3, 2009 4:34AM

I've never been a huge fan of 99% of the "game used" cards, but I've recently been gifted a few very beautiful examples that I'm proud to display.

My only hope is that the vintage items being used were so poorly kept before mutilation that, what was once a virtually ruined piece, has become multiple cards for multiple people to cherish.

That being said...I'd take a complete game used Clemente bat over 100 game used bat swatches, any day. Well, unless the sales of said bat swatches would equate to the purchase of a complete bat with money to spare.

I do not understand why people pay 1000s of dollars for some of these GU cards when they could purchase a complete example for the same or less.

However...

I would like to see a series of modern player cards printed completely on slivers of game used bat...much like the cards printed on balsa wood during the middle and late '90s. I'd really like to see Allen & Ginter do a mini set featuring this concept, being that they could create more cards due to the relatively small size.

Allen · January 3, 2009 4:49AM

<< When you guys speak of the possibility of fake jersey swatches, I think that is one of the reasons why they have gone down in value (along with overproduction) and that autographed cards will always do well. Just my opinion. >>

So you are saying autographs have held their value over the past decade despite the massive increase in supply? Check a graph of Michael Jordan autograph card production over the past 15 years and then chart the value of them. I will give you a hint one line goes way up and one line goes way down.

PoppaJ · January 3, 2009 6:16AM

There are many beautifully crafted game-used etc cards out there, from what I've seen lately, and I certainly respect the choices of all collectors, both young and old, but ....

To me, cutting up an authentic Mickey Mantle game-used bat or game-worn jersey, just to create a few bucks and a little excitement, is wrong.

Thank God they started doing this long after the Hall of Fames were already intact. Could you imagine there being no Cooperstown because Upper Deck/Topps etc preferred to cut up bats and jerseys instead of wanting to display them for viewing by future generations of baseball enthusiasts?

Like a few others have already mentioned, I am not completely sold on the idea that all of the so-called "authentic" items are indeed authentic. I'm hoping for history sake that they aren't.

I realize, that by desecrating these special artifacts of history, it enables more collectors to own a sliver of their sports heroes, but as a huge Mantle collector, I personally would prefer to keep all of the Micks memorabilia, whole and in tact.

Maybe I'm too nostalgic or old-fashioned, but comparatively, I also can't fathom the idea of drilling a hole in an 18th or 19th Century coin just to make a necklace out of it.

JMHO,
PoppaJ

WinPitcher · January 3, 2009 6:25AM

Nothing ever bothers me.

Steve

BPorter26 · January 3, 2009 6:47AM

I'm not a huge fan of the jersey/ Bat cards. I've read that the modern player before a game will put on the jersey take it off and give to UD or topps then they can call it game used, when in fact it was never in a game, just tried on.

Just my 2 cents.
Bobby

BassPro77 · January 3, 2009 7:14AM

not at all.

this is probably my favorite card

elsnorto · January 3, 2009 9:09AM

I became disenchanted with the "game used" stuff shortly after 2000 when the manufacturers started mass producing them for every product and getting pretty liberal about what they would cut up (i.e. "event used"). Now they are manufacturing nameplates just to put in cards that were never even seen or touched by the athletes.

Like most hobby innovations of the past, overkill has ruined what was once a pretty cool idea in my opinion.

But back to the OPs specific question, I agree with most who have responded in that modern players gear being sacrificed to the cardboard gods does not bother me nearly as much as scarce vintage memorabilia.

Snorto~

Karb · January 3, 2009 11:03AM

<< That doesnt make any sense....So you are saying its fine to cut up Ken Griffey and Frank Thomas and Greg Maddux
jersey and bats but dont touch Ruth , Mays and Aaron jersey and bats. >>

Yes that is exactly what I am saying. In comparison there is a boat load of Thomas and Griffey items. Where as Ruth's items are increasingly rarer.

fkw · January 3, 2009 11:34AM

I think they should cut up all the garbage.... We need some Liberty Bell cards, Moonrock cards, Spirit of St.Louis cards, and Mona Lisa cards too.

No need for future generations to see these items of the past in their original form.

PoppaJ · January 3, 2009 11:36AM

<< I think they should cut up all the garbage.... We need some Liberty Bell cards, Moonrock cards, Spirit of St.Louis cards, and Mona Lisa cards too.

No need for future generations to see these items of the past in their original form. >>

BassPro77 · January 3, 2009 11:47AM

<< I think they should cut up all the garbage.... We need some Liberty Bell cards, Moonrock cards, Spirit of St.Louis cards, and Mona Lisa cards too.

No need for future generations to see these items of the past in their original form. >>

mona lisa would be nice..... yeah i see that one happening

nightcrawler · January 3, 2009 5:40PM

post says it all.

<< Simply brilliant!

>>

Yes, quite brilliant, agreed.

stevek · January 3, 2009 5:52PM

It has been surmised that enough pieces of wood supposedly to be from the Cross of Jesus Christ, have been sold over the past 2,000 years...that a fleet of ships could be built from the quantity of wood.

nightcrawler · January 3, 2009 6:16PM

the big money these days is in the Virgin Mary image toast.

DeutscherGeist · January 3, 2009 8:15PM

Rare items should not be cut up but kept whole so others can enjoy it. What Allen said might be OK: If a Jersey was so worn and unsightly, perhaps that being cut up would serve a better purpose. But as far as these swatches being fake....well that is criminal on a different level. Nothing suprises me anymore and being cynical is just being real right now.

I do not like them destroying Old Yankee Stadium either.

jswieton · January 3, 2009 8:58PM

The card companys should strart offering redemption cards that give away the auto'ed bat of jersey that was going to be cut up. I think that would be allot cooler then cutting up small pieces of the relic and inserting them in a card.

1989FleerBillRipkencollector · January 4, 2009 12:54AM

<< 

I have probably owned 10,000+ jersey cards and maybe 5 had any dirt on them. >>

Heard they wash them.

bigwilli · January 4, 2009 1:08AM

First of all , what makes you think a Ruth jersey is rare??? Its just more expensive and older
so its more likely to be in private collections that never come up for sale . Can you afford
100 grand for a Ruth jersey . Im sure you are more likely to be able to afford a box that just
might have a piece of Ruth jersey .

On the other hand they have satuated to market thus making these cards less exciting . I remember
my girlfriend and i opening a couple case of cards and she pulled a Chipper Jones bat piece . You
could have sworn she just pulled the card of the century....

These cards are neat in respect and i still enjoy pulling them out of packs

itzagoner · January 4, 2009 1:12AM

i'd enjoy owning a piece of geography.....when will UD insert the deed to the Hawaiian Islands?

Does it bother anyone else ?

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