How do you return something to an ebay seller who may not deliver on promise of a refund?

DeutscherGeist · October 10, 2008 9:45PM

I bought something on ebay. I asked a lot of questions before purchasing mind you. Item was not as described. I immediately wrote to him stating it. He came up with a lame excuse but told me to send the item back and he will refund my money including shipping. The feedback time period ran out. I am worried if I send it back, he may not make good on his promise since I have no recourse. Can I send something CASH ON DELIVERY? Or he may not trust what I packaged is really his item, therefore be leary about CODS.

OAKESY25 · October 10, 2008 10:16PM

THE FEEDBACK PERIOD RAN OUT??
how old is this item?
and why is it taking so long for the return?

DeutscherGeist · October 10, 2008 10:36PM

The item is well past 90 days old. I could not ship it back within the 90 days because I got so distracted with more pressing issues I care not elaborate on except to say that I am the goto guy in the family.

I guess one lesson you may want to drive home to me would be to get things done fast--I had a lot to juggle and this took a back seat.

Blackborder · October 10, 2008 10:40PM

<< <i>The item is well past 90 days old. I could not ship it back within the 90 days because I got so distracted with more pressing issues I care not elaborate on except to say that I am the goto guy in the family.

I guess one lesson you may want to drive home to me would be to get things done fast--I had a lot to juggle and this took a back seat. >>

Not trying to pick on you but why should the seller have to take responsibility for your problems? He said to send it back, and you didn't. I'd forget about it and move on.

Leiascards · October 10, 2008 10:52PM

If I were the seller after 90 days I would tell you to KMA.

However if you want a refund you are going to have to send the item back first. Paypal makes you do this. If Paypal was used for the item originally if I were the sellers there would be no way in HE77 I would refund you through COD. I don't care how long it has been

I cannot think of any retail store right off that will honor a refund after 90 days though.

GoDodgersFan · October 10, 2008 10:55PM

Wow. You are pass 90 days and had your chance. Nothing personal here, but the seller is no longer
responsible for this item. Anyway, good luck and just move on.

lsutigers1973 · October 10, 2008 11:30PM

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't there only a 45 day period to file a Paypal claim?

MeteoriteGuy · October 10, 2008 11:41PM

If he told you to return it for a refund, in the last few days, I would go ahead and do that. If that was not the response you wanted, you should not even be contacting the seller.

Could he rip you off, yes. But most people are honest and lets face it, buyers hold almost all the cards in the norm transaction. It sounds like you are in panic because you do not hold the cards....because of time. If the seller feedback is terrible however, then I would just keep the item, if you do not want it, list it back on eBay.

Anyway, I understand being the family goto guy, and hope everything works out for you.

Clear Skies,
Mark

Leiascards · October 11, 2008 3:07AM

<< <i>Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't there only a 45 day period to file a Paypal claim? >>

Yes it is 60 days under normal conditions, but there are reports of buyers getting refunds for transactions that occured several years back. I recently had a bank inquiry on an item that was 4 months old. I did not have a DC to cover my butt, but luckily I got ahold of the right Paypal rep who listened to the problem and fixed it. If they paid with a CC through paypal there is no limit on time it is up to the CC company. So if a seller were to pay COD for a return and then the buyer turns around and files a claim with their CC they are subject to lose that and have to refund again.

DeutscherGeist · October 11, 2008 7:02PM

Thank you for those of you who are educating me on the ways of ebay. I am leary about the seller because I specifically asked him for any flaws in this item and it comes with rust on all the metal parts--it was the battery terminals, so it is a severe misrepresentation.

Should I go ahead and forward everything to Paypal and see what they say? I kept all emails and if the CC says its OK, then I should go for it and send it back. For a seller to basically be dishonest in item description, how can I even trust him to follow through on anything? I guess keeping the item is the option, but is so bad I really do not want it. I cannot sell something like this on ebay because I would have to disclose the rust issue and say it does not function.

His feedback was above 99%, but I think anything below 100% is going to cause problems. I did not think a few negs mattered, but it did in this case.

Leiascards · October 11, 2008 11:20PM

<< <i>Thank you for those of you who are educating me on the ways of ebay. I am leary about the seller because I specifically asked him for any flaws in this item and it comes with rust on all the metal parts--it was the battery terminals, so it is a severe misrepresentation.

Should I go ahead and forward everything to Paypal and see what they say? I kept all emails and if the CC says its OK, then I should go for it and send it back. For a seller to basically be dishonest in item description, how can I even trust him to follow through on anything? I guess keeping the item is the option, but is so bad I really do not want it. I cannot sell something like this on ebay because I would have to disclose the rust issue and say it does not function.

His feedback was above 99%, but I think anything below 100% is going to cause problems. I did not think a few negs mattered, but it did in this case. >>

In todays Ebay there will not be any sellers who 100% before long. Ebay is making sellers get more and more rude and abrasive to buyers due to the crap they are allowing sellers to endure

I just got a neg from the idiot who bid on my item despite having buyers with no Paypal accounts blocked and clearly stating Paypal only. Ebay says I was in the wrong for not accepting his check and will not remove the neg. He violated Ebay rules when he placed his bid according to Ebay and Ebay Trust and Safety, but they will not do anything about his neg.

Fact is it is past 90 days Paypal most likely will not get involved due to the time lapsed you only have 60 days to file a complaint through Paypal.

WinPitcher · October 12, 2008 12:16AM

Andre when did the seller say it was ok to return it? last week? or when this situation first happened?

If it was last week I'd do what he says, if it was 3 months ago I'd just eat it.

At thi point PP will not help.

Steve

Leiascards · October 12, 2008 2:48AM

I immediately wrote to him stating it. He came up with a lame excuse but told me to send the item back and he will refund my money including shipping.

From this statement I am assuming the seller was contacted 3 months ago and agreed to the refund at that time. If that is the case if I were the seller I would tell you where to stick the item if you returned it now.

You need to live up to your end of the agreement in a reasonable amount of time. 90 days is not a reasonabale amount of time.

KbKards · October 12, 2008 2:51AM

It looks like he contacted the seller 3 months ago, right after he received the item. The seller told him to return it and he'd refund the money including shipping. Had he done so at that time there would be no drama now. Now he's worried that the seller will not honor the refund offer if he returns the item 3 months after the offer was made. Have you contacted the seller since the offer was made 3 months ago, or did you just want to surprise him 3 months later with package he forgot all about. Personally I would take responsibility for my screwup, sell the item, and take the hit for the loss.

After you didn't return the item 3 months ago, from a seller's perspective it looks like you were just trying to shake him down for some money after the sale. Now after 3 months it makes the reason for you wanting to return it look more like you're done with it, broke it, couldn't sell it, left it out in the rain, bad economy, etc. But who knows, maybe you contact the guy and he'll bend over backwards for you and tell you once again to send it back for a refund. And you're the guy worried that you can't trust him.

Leiascards · October 12, 2008 3:54AM

What retailer is going to take an item back after 90 days? There are not any that will give a refund after that long. And very few that will even exchange.

MeteoriteGuy · October 12, 2008 4:41AM

"... but I think anything below 100% is going to cause problems."

That is just crazy thinking.

Leiascards · October 12, 2008 4:44AM

<< <i>"... but I think anything below 100% is going to cause problems."

That is just crazy thinking. >>

Especially in todays Ebay. "Neg: Item took 4 days to get to me." That is an actual neg I have

DeutscherGeist · October 12, 2008 4:54AM

"What retailer is going to take an item back after 90 days?"

Nordstrom will as of right now. Sears has done it in the past, but they changed recently. There are other places as well that I don't know about because I do not shop much.

"...maybe you contact the guy and he'll bend over backwards for you and tell you once again to send it back for a refund. And you're the guy worried that you can't trust him."

He outright misrepresented his item for sale and I called him on it within a day or two of receiving the package. I was that fast to respond. Returning something is risky because he has already proven that he is dishonest and plays games. I just wanted to know if there is any protection in returning something and I think everyone here says that paypal would protect me on a return as a long as I have delivery confirmation and do it within specified time frame (45 or 90 days). If a seller does not refund, I simply show paypal the delivery confirmation and they will take it out of his account. This is how I understand it. What is wrong with learning something new, everyone seems to be so tense about a transaction where I was stuck with a very dishonest seller. Now that I think about it, he should have credited me cash for the diminished value of the item immediately since he very well admitted he knew of the flaw but did not tell me because he thought I would not mind (wouldn't mind? I asked him specifically for flaws on the item). I think he was worried I would not buy it if he told me about the flaw. Get on his case. He drew first blood.

DeutscherGeist · October 12, 2008 5:02AM

"I just got a neg from the idiot who bid on my item despite having buyers with no Paypal accounts blocked and clearly stating Paypal only. Ebay says I was in the wrong for not accepting his check and will not remove the neg. He violated Ebay rules when he placed his bid according to Ebay and Ebay Trust and Safety, but they will not do anything about his neg."

Leiascards,

I understand what you say and Ebay is wrong on this and I am surprised no one from customer service is helping you. Perhaps write or call again and get a different person on the line (it has helped me in the past with other companies I dealt with). Also, I think this buyer knows about your policy but is purposely giving you a hard time. I think this buyer was a former customer of yours and felt really mistreated or something. So, I think its a case of revenge, not strictly some illiterate customer who could not understand your terms. This person is deliberately giving you a hard time because it is the only he knows how to get back at you, in my opinion.

DeutscherGeist · October 12, 2008 5:14AM

"Neg: Item took 4 days to get to me." That is an actual neg I have

As a buyer, I never do anything this petty because the mail might be slow or the seller only ships certain days. I completely understand this and never gave a seller a hard time with shipping time. I just want the item described accurately, that's all. I would politely email a seller after two weeks of sending payment just to see what was going on and would not hold something like shipping time against them because I totally understand the amount of circumstances that could be involved. To be honest, this could have been a former customer that simply wanted revenge. It could some crazy buyer, but I would not rule out a former dissatisfied customer.

Keep in mind, there was a time on ebay where a buyer does his part in paying for the item, but the seller sends something that was not described properly. A buyer could not neg without retaliation. Was that fair?

DeutscherGeist · October 12, 2008 5:23AM

MeteoriteGuy, you sound like a sensible person. Its not really crazy thinking to only go for 100% feedback sellers. I really can't think of any time I had a problem with those kinds of sellers. They even respond to questions about the item before I bid and they tell me if they feel the condition is not all that so they would not mislead me. This is my experience and it just has not worked with sellers that have 99.9% or below. I do look at individual negatives and if I notice its from an unreasonable person, I do give the seller a chance, but its rare I find such situations. Even if the neg is unwarranted because of something like shipping took a week, I look at the seller's reply. If it is rude, then I stay away. Its a red flag. If its simply like "received payment 10/14, sent item 10/15 ...." It shows the seller tried and was professional enough not to stoop to such a low level as a buyer and I would bid on that seller's items in confidence.

edit for syntax error

Leiascards · October 12, 2008 5:23AM

In order for Paypal to protect you it is not a matter of simply showing Paypal you sent the item back. According to Paypal you have 60 days to file a SNAD complaint. You file they then instruct you to return the item. When you prove the other party recieved the item Paypal will usually refund you. Since it is 90 days Paypal will not do anything for you.

If you sold an item and the buyer wanted to return it then 90 days later return it what would you do?

Leiascards · October 12, 2008 5:30AM

The old feedback system was 10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times better than it is now.

They should have just gone back to the old system where you could just leave feedback for anyone you wanted.

I imagine within the year there will be NO sellers with 100% Positive. Many of my worse experiences have been with 100% sellers. The seller who decided I did not pay enough for shipping and refused to send the item until I sent him the extra 2.00 was one. He will not be 100% for long, basically told me the 2.00 was more important to him than keeping one customer happy.

DeutscherGeist · October 12, 2008 5:54AM

"If you sold an item and the buyer wanted to return it then 90 days later return it what would you do?"

Are you seriously asking me this? I would inspect the item upon receipt to see if its in the same condition and if all is well, I just simply refund him the money. I sleep better at night knowing that I did not unwillingly take someone's money. My brother and I sold a BMW radio to a customer in Uruguay one time. We told him to make sure the part number matches his car and if there would be no code issues in installing the radio to his car. He wanted the radio and paid for it. Upon receipt of the radio, he emails his quickly saying that he could not get the radio to work because of code issues and the BMW dealer in his country couldn't help. We urged him to mail the item back even though we told him to be careful what he is buying and should make sure it matches his car. Anyway, he never sent the radio back nor contacted us ever again. No neg either. However, my brother and I feel bad because the radio is probably sitting on a shelf in his garage doing nothing. Months later, my brother and I still talk about it saying he should send it back--it really does not make us feel good that he could not use it. We decided that we will refund his money even if several more months pass and then next time only sell the radio locally--perhaps the radio was only good for US models, or BMW provides better assistance in California and a local buyer could benefit from it. There are going to be very few customers that would want a refund if there is a good item description. THose that do are so few, that it really is no sweat off my back to accomodate them. I asked 100% sellers how they do it and they say that they make sure their items and terms are spelled out clearly and are simple to understand, leave feedback as soon as payment comes in and then make sure the customer is happy. The few customers that complain or want a refund are made whole because it is minimal in the overall scheme of building a solid customer base and getting good overall revenue.

edit for spelling

MeteoriteGuy · October 12, 2008 6:00AM

"MeteoriteGuy, you sound like a sensible person. Its not really crazy thinking to only go for 100% feedback sellers."

No that would not be crazy thinking. You would however miss out on a lot of great deals, but it would not be crazy. However that is not what you said, you said "I think anything below 100% is going to cause problems."

Even before the new feedback system 99.5 was good. That meant out of 1000 transactions, 995 went well. That is not bad. Very few businesses, possibly none, could claim such a happy customer rate. With the new system, I think 99 is the new 99.5. So yes, I do think to assume that if someone with a 99.5 rating "is going to cause problems" is crazy thinking.

The buyer, if he followed all the guidelines, was protected before. In your example, that buyer could have simply returned the box with nothing and forced a refund through Pay Pal. (Not all pay through Pay Pal...but at least 80% do). This has happened to me a few times....but not because I sent an empty box. In the old system the buyer could still buy a card and return an empty box for a refund. There were and will always be ways for a dishonest person to screw the other guy. The only way around this would be an escrow service, which simply would not work through eBay.

Personally I have more of a problem with the new rating system...rather the feedback, which I do not agree with. Buyers are to leave a 4 for being satisfied and for having the item shipped promply, yet the system wants you to keep a 4.7. I have never heard of penalizing a seller for a having a satisfied customer....until now.

A lot of buyers before did complain about feedback hostage, but really does it matter to a buyer? Have you ever heard of anyone refusing a sale because the buyer had 90% feedback? Really as a buyer it was not easy to even get a 90% feedback rating.

eBay has been good to me over the years, overall I really can't complain. I have been screwed as a buyer and a seller 100s of times, but I have had 1000's of great transactions and they outweigh the minority problems. I just don't know how much longer I will be a part of it, as it is quite clear they do not want me.

Anyway, as I noted, I completely understand being the family go-to-guy. I have worked for myself for the last 10 years or so, so my family always assumes I have free time. I have also taken in my father and try my best, but it is over welling at times, so I do understand.

Mark

Leiascards · October 12, 2008 6:12AM

Maybe you would refund after 90 days but not me. And I can sleep at night knowing that the seller agreed to refund when you emailed him right away, you should have found away to send it within a few days. I don't care how busy you are where there is a will there is a way.

After 90 days there is many things that can happen. The seller has probaly done forgotten about the item. Paypal will not help you in any way. You best bet is to try to sell it as-is or just try to fix the problem. To expect the seller to honor a refund after 90 days is unreasonable IMHO.

mtcards · October 12, 2008 7:57AM

The old feedback system was why I have two ebay accounts. One for buying and one for selling.

As a buyer, I got tired of these nutbags waiting for me to give them feedback after i paid 30 seconds after auction end because they knew there was a potential problem with the item they sold. With a second account, I could neg at any time the seller deserved it since fb doesnt matter to buyers, although I dont have to now in any case

WinPitcher · October 12, 2008 9:07AM

Andre it is hard to get on his case when he said to return it for a refund plus shipping.
(90 days ago)

Also, have you even re emailed him as of late?

Steve

How do you return something to an ebay seller who may not deliver on promise of a refund?

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