Settle an argument: What do vintage collectors use to price cards at shows?

CDsNuts · August 25, 2008 1:30AM

I hate polls, so I'm just gonna ask the question and you all can answer. Say you're set up at a card show selling vintage. What are most of your customers using as a guide to determine what they are willing to pay for a card?

1) SMR
2) Beckett
3) They know the prices by heart
4) Something else really cool that I don't even know about

Edit- We are talking about raw cards here.

magellan · August 25, 2008 1:32AM

It's been a while since I did shows but the standard was always Beckett then with Tuff Stuff a distant second.

VitoCo1972 · August 25, 2008 1:32AM

Most of the shows I go to (except the rare Hollywood Park show - there is good stuff there) have dealers that still use Beckett. It's usually VG-EX - EX cards that dealers are looking for half of high book on - and they think that cutting half of the near mint price off is really helping me out.

RipublicaninMass · August 25, 2008 1:47AM

Customers, not sure, but dealers actually contact NASA, or the more savvy ones use this

HP 12c

Indy78 · August 25, 2008 2:07AM

I can tell you what I do as a buyer of raw 70's baseball. If the card is priced under about $20, I don't bother looking through a price guide and simply buy the card or not buy it based on what I see and based on my experience with collecting a particular set. Over about $20, I might look at a Beckett graded card investor price guide that I carry with me to ballpark what the raw card might be worth if graded and then make my decision based on the card I see, my experience, and what other dealers are charging at the show. I use the Beckett graded card investor because I've found it to be pretty accurate.

Morgoth · August 25, 2008 2:28AM

Most raw set collectors that I have sold to who don't care about grading and Ebay use Beckett for pricing.

In fact alot of dealers make money on these guys because they can take say a T206 Johnson PSA 1-2 with a good front and back damage, pop it and use Becketts price of lets say 1200 to start negotiations. Since these guys don't grade and it looks good on the front they might give 400 or 500 for it when it might only bring 200 to 250 on the bay.

More advanced collectors use a combination of what Ebay brings and SMR for whatever condition they think it might grade to base buying decisions on mostly hoping to get the card at a price 1 full grade below what they expect it too grade.

This is my philosphy in buying raw, I will pay up to one grade below what I think it might grade. Grading is a crap shoot so I am hoping to be right 50% of the time and it will work out.

At most shows I go to today and set up most of the action is on 25 and 50 cent boxes where people are trying to find cards to flip for 1 to 3 bucks on Ebay or trying to fill in sets.

I had a box like that and another box with pricing on the cards and it seemed 1 out 2 people would bring me a bunch of 50s and 60s EX condition HOFers and think they were 50 cents apiece (2 bucks for a EXMT condition 66 Stargell, your crazy!).

Also, don't try and sell NM or better commons at small shows, you will make alot of people mad. I was selling 69 BB and 71 FB, as I had alot of NM or better duplicate commons from my sets, and had at least 2 guys throw down their cards and tell me I was a moron for trying to get 2 to 4 bucks a card on them.

Allen · August 25, 2008 2:34AM

I think Morgoth is pretty much right on. I rarely find good vintage at shows, most everything is VG range and they want waaaay too much for them. There is the occasional EX-MT card that someone thinks will grade a 9 haha.

rexvos · August 25, 2008 2:44AM

<< <i>I think Morgoth is pretty much right on. I rarely find good vintage at shows, most everything is VG range and they want waaaay too much for them. There is the occasional EX-MT card that someone thinks will grade a 9 haha. >>

that is true. I do find stuff already graded that people have no clue on though.

RipublicaninMass · August 25, 2008 3:22AM

I have heard stories of finding deceased players in autograph boxes for short money. It takes ALOT of work to find decent vintage worth grading and flipping, though Con40 and packcollector seem to be very very good at it. (we go to the same shows and they literally have STACKS of vintage for submissions..sorry to out you guys

) I focus on the sets I am working on, and use VCP sales from my blackberry, or some figures in my head from recent ebay sales. like anything if you knew every tough lo pop, from every set, and had all the time in the world, you could make some decent coin. Other than that I use VCP, I cant be of any help

fkw · August 25, 2008 3:43AM

If your talking Vintage 1868-1941....

Past Knowledge is the most accurate. Everything else is a "guide"

I can go back 25 years and know the scarcity, demand, and value of most every type of card (especially the rarer "type cards"), you cant get that info from some book, at least not one Ive seen.

If your a newbie, then Auction Catalogs is the #1 way to learn.

Allen · August 25, 2008 3:56AM

<< <i>If your talking Vintage 1868-1941.... >>

Yeah I always have trouble determining the value of all the 1868 cards I find at shows.

frankhardy · August 25, 2008 4:02AM

I am finding that pre war vintage are using the SCD Standard. I have a 2007 version and will never, ever be without one.

Stone193 · August 25, 2008 4:06AM

I don't go to shows anymore.

But, I'm willing to guess most are still using Beckett or the Standard Catalog.

I don't have the patience to wade thru bins looking for a diamond up a goat's ass - but for those who do? Sometimes ya get real lucky - but the time it takes, way outweighs the benefit for the most part for me.

I think people pretty much people hit the nail on the head: it's not the guide they use but rather the OVERGRADING they're doing with respect to the reference tome of their choice which is the most disconcerting.

mike

WinPitcher · August 25, 2008 5:16AM

I can't tell you.

Steve

Morgoth · August 25, 2008 5:35AM

Some people really enjoy finding hot cards in the quarter bin and flip them for a couple of bucks on the bay. I don't have the time or patience to read up on all the potential hot RCs, find out which are their true RCs then spend 5 hrs looking through mostly 91 UD cards trying to find a single card worthwhile. Most of the time you find 2nd and 3rd tier RCs (topps, topps traded, regular bowmans for example), you won't find many auto RCs in those quarter boxes.

I found maybe 1 in 10 guys use a standard catalog for pricing but it is so big I don't see many guys carrying it around as much as dealers do.

PSA has really hurt the junk vintage dealers as people can really see the difference between old NM and a PSA 7 card.

mtcards · August 25, 2008 6:51AM

Its been a while (5 years) since I was doing shows, but just about everyone, including dealers were using Beckett to determine starting price/trade price of cards. As pointed out earlier, do not try to get premiums for older commons. I had some 68 Topps Hi #s, that I was selling for $3 each (I think an 8 or 9 grade), had people show me some PSA5 gradeable cards that they bought from someone else for a buck, thought I was trying to screw them. Many people dont realize the importance and value of condition on older sets.

lsutigers1973 · August 25, 2008 6:58AM

What's a card show?

msassin · August 25, 2008 8:16AM

From what I see at my table for raw cards

Post-war vintage...Beckett by far
Pre-war vintage...Nothing stands out more than another (Bekcett, annual SCD, SMR, prices memorized, etc.)

dizzle · August 25, 2008 8:22AM

I Just use one of those magical 8 balls, If I see a card I like I'll ask the 8 ball and shake it.... if it says yes I go for it, If it says no I pass.... Hope this helps Lee.

onegaucho · August 25, 2008 9:12AM

personally, i'd do a check of VCP for the cards that i was interested in and get an idea of the prices by grade. i use that as a barometer for cards i'm buying raw off of ebay - dont see why i wouldnt do it if i were to go to the national or other major show.

JackWESQ · August 25, 2008 10:29AM

Dear RipublicaninMass,

HP 12C?! You must be truly old school. Back in my day, we were using the HP 48 Series. If you didn't have one, you were left out in the cold. These ran about $200.00 to $300.00. The joke among my friends was that the 48 Series had so much memory, you could store an entire essay in there. Students, when permitted, were bringing them into the English finals.

/s/ JackWESQ

fattymacs · August 25, 2008 10:56AM

I use VCP to get an idea of what grades 5-8 fetch for the cards I'm looking for, then write it down on a note pad. I've found that most raw show cards are in the 5-7 range, so I offer accordingly.

Morgoth · August 26, 2008 1:58AM

They are 5-7 range with a ton of the stars having major issues that are hard to see in those poorly lit rooms. It is very hard to see back creases in good lighting.

Settle an argument: What do vintage collectors use to price cards at shows?

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