Wanting to get back in the hobby......

00bolt · June 13, 2008 6:39AM

hey guys, I used to be a big collector of baseball/basketball/football cards back in the late 80s, early 90s. Then after I turned about 16 other things became more important to me (cars, girls, money, etc). So I sold most of my cards and quit collecting cards all together. I collected only rookie cards of guys I liked. The only card I kept worth anything is my 1986 Fleer Michael Jordan.

Over the past couple months I have been looking around on ebay at some of the old cards I used to have and I have noticed a few things different..

1. most cards arent worth crap if they arent highly graded
2. new day cards have completely changed. Seems like everything is autographed or gameworn and there are like 100 different types of cards per year. I had enough problem with just the basic Upper Deck, Topps, Bowman, Fleer, etc
3. obviously the internet must have hurt the hobby. No more shows, card shops, etc

so all that being said, I now have a 7 year old son and I thought it would be a cool thing to do together. So we have gotten a few packs here and there of some cheap cards. And he is starting to enjoy it, but still might be a little young to really appreciate it. BUT.... dad is getting that desire back and having fun with it. I want to start collecting again for myself. Not really for an investment, but for a collection and one day hand down to my son.

Heres thing I need some advice/help on. I like to collect rookie cards only. I dont really wanna get into collecting $5,000 Jay Bruce rookie cards. I like to collect HOF rookie cards. So cards I would like to get most are Joe Dimaggio, Stan Musial, etc.... Pretty much all the cards on top of my list are pre 1960... then Id move onto the 60s/70s/80s... not sure I really ever even wanna get past the 80s to be honest...

so heres my question: how should I do it? since cards are graded now, i cannot afford a 1933 Goudey card that is graded PSA 9 or something. Heck, that might cost as much as my car. So Im thinking of 2 options

1. not graded cards at all
2. graded like PSA, but low 2s,3s,4s and maybe 5s on some cards

what do you think? What would you do if you were starting over and in same boat I am? I dont mind paying a few hundred dollars per card, and I realize some of them might cost $1000 or more... but thats about my limit per card. In perfect world Id like to stay under $500 per card, but some just arent going to happen. So thats where it puts me in these 2 categories (not graded or lowly graded). But Im a real weird person and like uniform. Whatever I do, Id like to stick with it throughout my entire collection...

looking for all advice, tips, suggestions, critiques, etc...

MeteoriteGuy · June 13, 2008 6:43AM

1. Collect what you like. The players you remember, that you like watching now, et al.

2. Ignore the guides.

3. Buy all my extra Steve Young cards from me.

yawie99 · June 13, 2008 6:52AM

It's all different now, that's for sure. For the better, I think.

Anyway, we're neurotic by nature so I can kinda relate to your desire for consistency. If I were going to start what you're doing, I'd probably set a target grade for each era or decade instead of a blanket grade goal for my collection. Something like 3's or 4's for the post-WWII/pre-Topps era but go for a higher level as you move toward the present and accept 1's or 2's if you plan on going farther back.

00bolt · June 13, 2008 6:55AM

thats a good idea. Since I have never owned a graded card. What would be acceptable for the T206, 1933 Goudeys, etc.... as of right now the highest I want to get to is late 50s like Roger Maris, Bob Gibson, etc... Again, money is a factor, so what would be a "nice" card grade for these older cards?

btw, i was born in St. Louis and Im a Cards/Blues/Rams fan also!!! whoooot

EDIT: after quick (very quick) searching on ebay, how does something like this sound:

pre WWII - PSA 1,2,3
late 40s/50s - PSA 4,5

then once I get to later cards it can go up

nam812 · June 13, 2008 6:58AM

Welcome to the message boards. There are a lot of good guys here with plenty of information about the hobby.

lsutigers1973 · June 13, 2008 7:03AM

Just thought I would throw in my .02 I have recently started collecting PSA graded t206's. You can usually get PSA 4's of common players for around $50. Even bought a PSA 5 recently for about the same price. On a different note, I also have a young son who I am trying to get into collecting. Thanks to some guys on this board, his interest has increased. I can tell you that kids seem to like the newer shiny stuff. If your son likes basketball, I have quite a few ungraded shiny rookies that he can have. I do not collect bball and have not been able to sell them on ebay.

RipublicaninMass · June 13, 2008 7:07AM

NOTHING wrong with low grade rookies at all! I am working a a few sets where even a PSA 1 is ok!

BTW

yawie99 · June 13, 2008 7:07AM

No kiddin'? Small world, as they say.

Anyway, I collect pre-1920s stuff but have been thinking of picking up a few favorites from the '40s and '50s. I always try to balance cost with eye appeal. My favorite grade from that era is probably 2. Not all 2's mind you, since the variability within a grade is much wider the lower down the scale you go, but a 2 that looks really nice except for some grade-killing flaw. I love cards that are really crisp but that maybe have a spot of minor paper loss or that have a crease that doesn't run through the central image.

I haven't yet picked up any post-war stuff yet, but I've been looking at anything from 3's to 7's, depending on the card. I've been kinda sorta looking for Musial and Gibson rookies myself. On the former, I'd probably go for a 3 or 4; on the latter, a well-centered 6 or 7. They're not going to explode in value or anything, but I think 6's and 7's from the '50s offer great value. Some are only a hair behind 8's in terms of condition, yet they go for so much less because of the lack of Registry competition.

clydecoolidge · June 13, 2008 7:52AM

Welcome to the boards!!!!

I can tell you this; if you're going to buy raw, do so from a reputable seller. Do your research. I sell raw pre-60's on ebay and am extremely detailed in my descriptions. If you see a bad scan of a high dollar raw card and the description is short and vaugue, than it's probably not in the condition that the seller is claiming. Be careful when buying raw!!! Good sellers are out there however.

As far as graded cards go, I won't say the highly over used phrase in this case, but don't just blindly buy a card with a particular grade on it. Study the card itself and judge it with your own opinion of eye appeal.

good luck!!!

NickM · June 13, 2008 7:57AM

If you're buying expensive cards on the internet, grading is the best way to ensure that you aren't being sold a bill of goods (not a counterfeit or altered card, and not misrepresented as to condition by the seller). It also protects you to a significant degree against some sellers' complete inability to package items properly - graded slabs can get broken in shipping, but the chances of an ungraded card being damaged in the mail are a lot higher.

Go with what you are willing to spend on a particular card. Sports Market Report and Beckett's new magazine are guides - sometimes fairly accurate, sometimes not. Vintage Card Prices is actual transaction information.

If this is a long haul endeavor for you, figure out whether you want to pick off a bunch of the easy ones first or start saving up right away for the biggies. A PSA 7 of Aparicio, Mazeroski, or Bunning will run you less than $100, but you can't touch a Cobb or Ruth for less than $200 even if it looks thrashed (i.e., an ugly PSA 1, as opposed to a card with a nice front but back damage).

Be forewarned that the definition of rookie card is rather flexible for players with cards before WWII (e.g., DiMaggio had an OPC card in 1937 and appeared on R312 and other premiums in 1936, but many people still regard his 1939 Play Ball as his rookie).

As far as grading companies go, there are only a few worth considering - most of the others should be deemed warning signs that there's something wrong with the card. IMO PSA and SGC will be fine for you, as should BGS/BVG (though stay away from BCCG) and GAI. Pricewise, PSA commands higher prices than the others for post-WWII cards, and is definitely higher than BGS/BVG and GAI for pre-WWII (it's a mixed bag for whether PSA commands higher prices for pre-WWII, especially for pre-WWI cards).

Ask lots of questions. You'll find that many of the people here are happy to help.

Nick

parkerj · June 13, 2008 10:44AM

Welcome to the boards and back to the hobby. Great advice so far by all the above. Beware of ebay scammers with raw cards - the cards are typically overgraded by 1-2 grades (except for the fine members here). If you factor in the overgrading, you'll be ok. As for prewar, lots of fakes out there which helps drive people towards the plastic-entombed cards. Many folks buy graded for the piece of mind, then break out the cards from the plastic. I'm not promoting grading or raw, to each his own. One thing that I hear quite a bit among Topps Heritage collectors is that it is the one modern set that has brought them back to the hobby. Its discovery is what brought me back, and my story is far from unique. Although they are typically not rookie-card-infested sets, consider it might be a way for you to have some todays players that maybe your son would enjoy, but at the same time they are cards that have the nostalgic look and feel of the great 50's era topps sets.

jrinck · June 13, 2008 10:55AM

To my way of thinking, a PSA 1 Goudey Ruth has much more history than a PSA 9. The PSA 9 probably sat it a box in an attice for 70+ years, while the PSA 1 was at one time highly enjoyed by someone. If the cards could talk, I'd be much more interested in what the PSA 1 would have to say (other than "Ouch, quit crumpling me!" )

lawnmowerman · June 13, 2008 11:11AM

That avatar freaks me out.

ndfan1 · June 13, 2008 11:24AM

"so all that being said, I now have a 7 year old son and I thought it would be a cool thing to do together. "

It seems like one of the main reasons for getting back into the hobby is to spend some quality time with your son doing something you enjoyed doing when you were younger. If it were me I would ask my son what he would like to collect; favorite team, player, sport etc. then go from there. He may not have a lot of interest right now in vintage cards. Grab the interest now then build on it in the future.

This is obviously my $0.02

--adam

fattymacs · June 13, 2008 11:45AM

My 7 year old brought me back early this year and I'm obsessed all over again. I still had all my vintage stuff I bought back in the 80's (as well as all my unopened stuff and sets from the 80's). I've made some nice buys here on the BST forum, I did a set of 08 Heritage with the trades and help from the folks here as well. Alot of the members are knowledgeable, helpful, and nice (there are a few who can get surly on occasion, but they're still ok). Put on your thick skin and jump in and post your thoughts/opinions and enjoy the ride. Raw card Saturday is tomorrow, open up that thread and see some nice stuff, and check out the Mail call thread and see everyone's latest slabbed and raw stuff. There are some amazing collections here and some that are pleasantly unique and inexpensive as well, collect what you want in the condition you are comfortable with (appearance and price-wise). Welcome and we hope to see you stick around.

donrus · June 13, 2008 11:45AM

i can help anyone looking for pete rose cards!! i have many!! but if you are a hater, thats the only cards i have.. don

aro13 · June 13, 2008 12:06PM

Some good advice. I agree with Yawie99 in particular.

The idea to collect Pre-War cards in a 1 or 2 grade is realistic, and 4's and 5's from the 50's. One problem you might have from the 50's is that for the non-big name Hall of Famers it will not be that easy to buy mid-grade cards. You might have to buy them raw and submit them yourself.

00bolt · June 13, 2008 12:08PM

thanks guys for all your help. I have about $500 in my paypal account right now burning a hole. Ready to buy my first card.... keep posted

rise2it · June 13, 2008 12:13PM

00bolt - some other points to consider

If you're not into the 'money' aspect (and that shouldn't be a factor for your son at his age...probably wasn't for you at that age - before the BOOM), you can buy virtually anything you had in your era dirt cheap.

Buy boxes = build sets. Most of the late 80's/early 90's stuff is now referred to as 'junk wax' due to mass overproduction. Even the nicer stuff (Stadium Club, Upper Deck) from that era can be found for $5-$10 a box.

The best advice I've seen given is 'collect what you like'.

I'd rather have a well centered PSA 6 or 7 than a PSA 9 with problems, if it's a card I'm keeping for the long haul - my own enjoyment, oddball players I liked, etc.

The main thing is to get ENJOYMENT out of it - GREED is what destroys hobbies, and when you base everything on it's dollar value, it's no longer a hobby - it's a business, and as I've found out the hard way with hobbies (bands, card collecting), THAT can suck all the fun right out of it.

hofautos · June 13, 2008 12:31PM

Buy these - pay a little premium when necessary but get 50/50 centering, look for clean cards where only the corners bring down the grade
T206 ty cobb (psa3)
T206 cy Young (psa3)
T206 walter Johnson (psa3)
T206 Christy Matthewson
1933 ruth (your choice)(psa 2 or psa3)
1934 gehrig (psa2)
1940 or 1950bowman ted williams
1948 jackie robinson (psa5)
1952 topps mays psa3
1951 bowman mantle (psa2)
1952 bowman musial (psa 7) would prefer that to his rookie in low grade
1955 koufax psa 6
1964 rose (prefer 2nd year cards when rookie are multiplayer)
1966 morgan ""
1969 nolan ""
1969 bench ""
1970 munson

Take a look at this website just to give you some ideas of what you can do. you may want to deviate from me though, because i collect modern and vintage.

MIKES CARDS

anything after 1970 get autographed rookies like this card

a few more auto 80s style
a few more auto 80s style
a few more auto 80s style
a few more auto 80s style
a few more auto 80s style
a few more auto 80s style
a few more auto 80s style

Beardown · June 14, 2008 11:04PM

I would agree with alot of what was said here. I collect mid grade cards and find them to be excellent examples and a tremendous value compared to higher grades that really don't do that much more for me. I think a solid (4) is a great value card and will always be collectible and enjoyable to show and appreciate for yourself as well as to share with others.

Tvac897 · June 15, 2008 1:54AM

<< <i>1. Collect what you like. The players you remember, that you like watching now, et al.

2. Ignore the guides.

3. Buy all my extra Steve Young cards from me. >>

Wonderful advice...

Wanting to get back in the hobby......

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