Could this card really have got lost in the mail?

ghostie · June 12, 2008 12:45AM

This particular topic has probably been on the Board before, but I’d appreciate some input on my particular case. This doesn’t involve a lot of money, but I need to get a better understanding of what may be happening. Is this a legit claim? This involves a $30 card I sold on eBay on June 2; payment made thru PayPal June 3; card mailed first class June 4. Buyer is eBayer “euelk”. Here’s a chronology of events:

June 9 – buyer sends e-amail to seller (me), notifying me that the card hasn’t arrived yet
June 9-10 – seller sends e-mails asking buyer to keep me apprised; suggesting maybe we might have some protection coverage from PP (don’t really know the PP system too well)
June 11, 6:59 PM – seller receives PP “dispute” from buyer
June 11, 7:00 PM – seller receives PP “claim” from buyer
June 11, 9:50 PM – seller researches PP “resolution” process to better understand my options; apparently the only option is to contest the claim or refund cost to buyer; e-mails buyer (outside the PP system) with offer to send replacement card (same card, same grade, different S/N)
June 11, 10:30 PM – buyer says he (she?) had to buy another card like this cause it was a birthday card for her dad; do I have any other replacement cards from this set?
June 12 - seller sends optional replacement card possibilities

This is where the issue is at right now.

While all the above is going on I am researching the “euelk” buyer feedback history and find four emotional sounding negs from sellers from May 13, 2008. Suspicions are raised (unfairly?). So the question is - is there any real reason for me to be suspicious about being scammed for a two bit purchase? Did this card really get lost in the mail?

I know stuff gets lost in the mail, but I have had a small rental business for 13 years where I have, over these years, mailed or received thru the mail, more than 500 checks and/or property keys. I think maybe there was one time when there may have been a mail delivery problem – maybe not. So now I get on eBay selling my baseball cards for 3 months and already I have a “lost” article. Just doesn’t sit right.

I am interested in the opinions of the Board members and whether anyone has had any dealings, good or bad, with this eBayer. Is my only future protection with delivery confirmation?

Thanks for your input -Mike

Leiascards · June 12, 2008 12:52AM

Its really still to early to be thinking the card is lost or anything. I have had priority mail take 3 weeks recently to travel 150 miles. If the card was shipped on the 4th, it has only 6 actual mailing days(don't count day sent or Sunday). The USPS does not consider a package lost for 21 days.

NM I beleive you are the seller here.. The buyer will probaly find his way on to many BBLs here.

otwcards · June 12, 2008 12:55AM

Sounds like the buyer is running you through the wringer. They were awfully quick to suggest that the card was "lost." Then claiming that they "bought" a replacement as a gift in a matter of days is more condemning. The final straw is that they asked about other cards from the set.

Seems very fishy to me, but unfortunately, PayPal will side with them and you will be refunding the money even though they probably received the item. You're out the card and the revenue received. Make certain to follow eBay and PayPal protocol to at least receover the final value credit.

craig19 · June 12, 2008 12:56AM

Delivery Confirmation is the answer...it is cheap...everyone should use it!

Leiascards · June 12, 2008 12:57AM

I would just refund and not send anything else at this point. The buyer has the card you sent and is wanting more from the same set. They will get the refund plus the extra cards through Paypal.

CDsNuts · June 12, 2008 1:00AM

Do you have the USPS receipt? It should at least prove that you sent something to the buyer's zip code. Not that it's proof of anything, but it might convince the buyer to wait a little longer.

ghostie · June 12, 2008 1:15AM

<< Seems very fishy to me, but unfortunately, PayPal will side with them and you will be refunding the money even though they probably received the item. You're out the card and the revenue received. Make certain to follow eBay and PayPal protocol to at least receover the final value credit. >>

By "recovering the final value credit" do you mean that there is a possibilty that the seller (me) can also recover the value of the card, after having given the buyer a refund?

thenarcissus01 · June 12, 2008 1:21AM

<< Seems very fishy to me, but unfortunately, PayPal will side with them and you will be refunding the money even though they probably received the item. You're out the card and the revenue received. Make certain to follow eBay and PayPal protocol to at least receover the final value credit. >>

By "recovering the final value credit" do you mean that there is a possibilty that the seller (me) can also recover the value of the card, after having given the buyer a refund?

No

Leiascards · June 12, 2008 1:23AM

If you refund you can file a UPI on the buyer for the Final Value Fees you paid Ebay. This is not recommended though Ebay has been known to revoke sellers rights to file FVFs for filing such claims.

Leiascards · June 12, 2008 1:25AM

<< Do you have the USPS receipt? It should at least prove that you sent something to the buyer's zip code. Not that it's proof of anything, but it might convince the buyer to wait a little longer. >>

Does not matter the buyer most likely already has the card in hand and is just running a scam on the seller thanks to the new feedback system. Sellers add this buyer to your BBL now.

BobaFett72 · June 12, 2008 1:35AM

sounds like this person is huffing and puffing awfully early for something thats only been a few days.

I just had some ass clown send me a nasty email because he only received ONE email from me confirming has payment, and it was a computer generated email and it didnt specify his tracking number etc (it didnt ship out tillt he next day) naturally i apologized for my oversight. this new ebay system SUCKS for sellers.

rajah424 · June 12, 2008 2:01AM

Leo,

If you will sell your entire collection to me for $100, i promise that not only will i not be an ass clown but i will not send you any nasty e-mails. Knock $5 off the price and i will even leave you a nice compliment on the feedback thread.

clayshooter22 · June 12, 2008 2:18AM

Did you use delivery confirmation as required by Paypal?

If not, yer hosed. The buyer knows it and will get a full refund from Paypal and you will lose 100% of the money. Sellers cannot do business on eBay without DC'ing every item under $250. Period. Buyers know they will keep your card and get 100% refund when they receive a package w/o DC. Fair, no, but .14 is cheap insurance against a very high prob that you will get a chargeback.

If you used DC, and if it shows received, Paypal will not chargeback on you.

The thing is, people are going to play "the game" and you have to protect yourself. Getting screwed on a $30 card is not a huge deal if it saves you hundreds in the future. Just learn the lesson the first time.

Mike

larryallen73 · June 12, 2008 2:43AM

You have to use delivery confirmation.

You are screwed. I would NOT send another card. Refund, probably get a neg anyway, and move on.

storm888 · June 12, 2008 2:59AM

"Buyers know they will keep your card and get 100% refund when they receive a package w/o DC."

////////////////////////////////////////////

OP is scammed.

Issue refund.

Tell her you're sorry the card got lost.

Put the buyer on your BBL.

.........

You really need to read and understand how EBAY and PayPal work
before you get too deep in the mix.

EBAY is a hotbed of criminals, who know how the system works. They
will steal all of your cards/money, if you do not know what you are doing.

If you don't know how to do something, ask for help BEFORE you do it.

............

NEVER send anything w/o DC. If the item is expensive, use SC; over
$250, you MUST use SC.

The buyer is ALWAYS right. PayPal is their partner in fraud/crime.

ghostie · June 12, 2008 4:22AM

One part that puzzles me is, if this is a scam, wouldn't you think PP and eBay could identify the offenders pretty easily, by virtue of multiple claims being filed by the same person. Would a person bother doing this for $30 and infrequently enough not to draw attention to himself? Why bother? Something doesn't make sense about this.

nightcrawler729 · June 12, 2008 4:38AM

Just wondering - which card did you sell to ths buyer? Want to just see if he really bought another replacement card...

Grumpy Buyer

storm888 · June 12, 2008 4:41AM

"...Would a person bother doing this for $30 and infrequently enough not to draw attention to himself? Why bother? Something doesn't make sense about this. "

/////////////////////////////////////////////////

Crimes of Convenient Opportunity.

Absence of DC-sticker = Invitation To Steal.

People are mostly good, except for the ones that are bad.

................

I didn't do it.
Nobody saw me do it.
You can't prove I did it.
And, when you're not looking, I'll do it again.

ghostie · June 12, 2008 4:49AM

<< Just wondering - which card did you sell to ths buyer? Want to just see if he really bought another replacement card...

Grumpy Buyer >>

He bought a 1964 #21 Yogi Berra card, PSA 7 S/N 15290838. Said he bought a replacement at a card shop near Wentzville, MO 63385 called Rookies and Stars. So it wasn't on eBay.

nightcrawler729 · June 12, 2008 4:55AM

What is the auction number - I don't see it in his bidding history?

ghostie · June 12, 2008 5:04AM

<< What is the auction number - I don't see it in his bidding history? >>

item 110257245271, sold June 2

unitas · June 12, 2008 5:06AM

Hi, I had similar case awhile back and paypal gives you no options but to return money or show delivery confirmation since then everything I ship has delivery confirmation on it, it's saves you alot of hassle when this happens. jmo

1989FleerBillRipkencollector · June 12, 2008 5:31AM

<< Delivery Confirmation is the answer...it is cheap...everyone should use it! >>

+1

Tvac897 · June 12, 2008 6:34AM

sounds like a scam.

vintagechris · June 12, 2008 6:39AM

If they filed a claim that quickly, I would think they are scamming.

DerekD · June 12, 2008 7:16AM

I agree. I can't believe some sellers don't protect themselves more. I just got a $450 card in the mail today that had nothing on it, no dc or signature confirmation. I paid with Paypal and the seller recommended I pay $7 for insurance, which I passed. His policy is inviting people to steal from him.

If you accept Paypal, always cover yourself.

<< 
/////////////////////////////////////////////////

Crimes of Convenient Opportunity.

Absence of DC-sticker = Invitation To Steal.

People are mostly good, except for the ones that are bad.

>>

clayshooter22 · June 12, 2008 7:43AM

<< One part that puzzles me is, if this is a scam, wouldn't you think PP and eBay could identify the offenders pretty easily, by virtue of multiple claims being filed by the same person. Would a person bother doing this for $30 and infrequently enough not to draw attention to himself? Why bother? Something doesn't make sense about this. >>

Paypal/eBay does not care what really is happening....it is all about what you can prove. In this case you cannot prove delivery and the buyer can prove they paid. How does that look? Smells like a refund 100%. Some buyer have this figured out and will dispute every single transaction where they rec a package w/o DC. Sad, but true.

Mike

Leiascards · June 12, 2008 7:51AM

As far as DC goes I very rarely use it myself, but in one category the odds of a scam are very very low and if so the odds of being scammed for big money are almost non existant. In another category I sell in most of my buyers are repeat customers so I rarely worry about it. Only time I use it is when the buyer either gives me an indication of a problem or the item is over 25.00

storm888 · June 12, 2008 8:25AM

When you issue the refund, tell your "buyer" that you have
filed this form and that the postal inspector will be in touch
to get his/her statement.

Often, "lost" items magically appear when a CROOK knows the postal cops are watching.

Fixed Lost Mail-Theft

mexisar · June 12, 2008 8:37AM

Have the card registered in the PSA registry, if some one wants to add it, PSA will contact you.

Tabe · June 12, 2008 8:44AM

<< 

He bought a 1964 #21 Yogi Berra card, PSA 7 S/N 15290838. Said he bought a replacement at a card shop near Wentzville, MO 63385 called Rookies and Stars. So it wasn't on eBay. >>

Perhaps a phone call to that store is in order...

Tabe

ghostie · June 12, 2008 8:56AM

<< 

<< 

He bought a 1964 #21 Yogi Berra card, PSA 7 S/N 15290838. Said he bought a replacement at a card shop near Wentzville, MO 63385 called Rookies and Stars. So it wasn't on eBay. >>

Perhaps a phone call to that store is in order...

Tabe >>

I actually searched for them on the Internet unsuccessfully. They may be out there but I couldn't locate.

ghostie · June 12, 2008 8:58AM

<< When you issue the refund, tell your "buyer" that you have
filed this form and that the postal inspector will be in touch
to get his/her statement.

Often, "lost" items magically appear when a CROOK knows the postal cops are watching.

Fixed Lost Mail-Theft >>

I think I'll try this one.

Thanks - Mike

ghostie · June 12, 2008 9:01AM

<< Have the card registered in the PSA registry, if some one wants to add it, PSA will contact you. >>

I'll look into this. Is this an involved process?

mexisar · June 12, 2008 9:56AM

<< 

<< Have the card registered in the PSA registry, if some one wants to add it, PSA will contact you. >>

I'll look into this. Is this an involved process? >>

They will only work if the Buyer uses the PSA registry
http://www.psacard.com/setregistry/
Add it like if you still owned the card.

only one person can have a card registered in the registry, so if someone tries to add it, you would get an email asking you if you sold it,etc
so that you can remove it. But with this info you will know if someone has it, and maybe PSA can tell who is trying to add it to their sets.

Could this card really have got lost in the mail?

Comments