1952 Mantle PSA 6 v. AROD SGC 100

JackWESQ · August 11, 2007 4:19PM

With the AROD SGC 100 currently at $22.3K and ending tomorrow (Sunday) night, I was wondering, what would you rather have? As a collector? For investment purposes? A 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle PSA 6 or the AROD SGC 100, both around $22K. Which has the greater potential for increase in value? Let's say AROD does hit another 300 home runs over the next seven (7) to ten (10) years and ends up with over 800+. Could the AROD increase by another $5,000.00+? I really can't see the Mickey increasing, by say, $10,000.00+. But what about the AROD? For me, I'd take the Mantle without hesitation, but then again, I have a deep aversion to risk.

/s/ JackWESQ

grote15 · August 11, 2007 4:24PM

Mantle hands down, without a doubt! I'd even take a PSA 5!

stitzen · August 11, 2007 4:28PM

I'd have to think the Mantle has the greater upside as terms of investment potential...does that card in any grade ever lose value?

EagleEyeKid · August 11, 2007 4:38PM

mantle

JackWESQ · August 11, 2007 4:40PM

Dear Stitzen,

And that was the thought that I had while making this post. Does the 1952 Mantle EVER lose value ... in any grade. I don't think so. The pictured Mantle sold for $12,650.00 back in March 2005. Here's the link:

1952 Topps Mickey Mantle PSA 6 for $12,650.00 on Mastro Auctions

So with that in mind and if you can afford it, why aren't more people out there buying the Mantle. Is this the closest thing to a guaranteed risk investment?

/s/ JackWESQ

nightcrawler · August 11, 2007 4:44PM

The Mantle for sure.

stitzen · August 11, 2007 4:46PM

Perhaps its because Arod just broke 500, was the youngest to do so, and people see him as a direct threat to Barry's HR title (which there are many people upset with). I think it's the perfect storm of speculation on perfect grade Arod rookies.

I'd bet in a year you wouldn't be able to garner 22k for that Arod card.

baseballjeff · August 11, 2007 6:13PM

How can this even be a question?! The Mantle of course!

Allen · August 11, 2007 6:41PM

The Arod is much more scarce. I would rather have the Mantle card, but that Arod will always be the top card for him. You have to look at all the Yankee Fans, all the Arod fans, all the I hope he beats Barry fans, etc. They will only get one shot at the Arod. If you have the cash it is not hard to find a PSA 6 Mantle.

thehallmark · August 11, 2007 8:31PM

Mantle.

The Mick has the edge because he won't be accused of using steroids.

bri2327 · August 11, 2007 8:56PM

Silly question. Almost too silly to respond to.

Arod could end up with 1000 HR's at the end of his career, but by that time there will be 100 more of that card graded as high bringing the value down considerably while the Mantle at worst will hold its value.

fur72 · August 11, 2007 9:34PM

Mantle hands down, he is, the most collected player with out a doubt. Granted arod has a ways to go but Mantle will always be in great demand.

Bigslick · August 11, 2007 10:01PM

I don't think this is as easy a choice as it seems.
My fondest childhood recollection is going to NY with my Father to see the Yankees play in 1961. What happens when us Baby Boomers start dying? Will Mantle be as revered as he is now? Will he be considered overrated? We knew then he wasn't the best of his generation. His popularity was based on several things. Being a Yankee, race, injuries and most of all, no teams in the South. The Yankees were about the only games on TV.
I had my first card graded in 1992. I look at some of my cards from the 60s, they wouldn't grade as high now, as they did then.
I would take the Mantle, but 30 years from now, if there is still a hobby, it might be a poor choice.

bifff257 · August 11, 2007 10:17PM

Mantle and I did not even have to think about it!!!!!!!!!

Downtown1974 · August 11, 2007 11:29PM

Without a doubt, Mantle.

Leiascards · August 11, 2007 11:36PM

but by that time there will be 100 more of that card graded as high bringing the value down considerably while the Mantle at worst will hold its value

I doubt there are many more ungraded ones out there that will grade as high. I don't think I have never seen one come out of a pack that would grade higher than a 7. That Arod card is just hard to find in good shape period.

That said the Mantle would be the better choice. A-Rod has yet to face the steroid questions, but the hints and innuendos are out there so it is just a matter of time before he does start getting targeted.

Bosox1976 · August 11, 2007 11:39PM

I think Mantle is way more beloved than ARod (do you think people in Seattle, Texas, or NY love him?), I think that the difference between an SGC 100 and an SGC 98 or PSA 10 is negligible, and I think that the 52 Topps Mantle is always a sought after card by those collectors with $. Mantle by a mile.

stown · August 11, 2007 11:41PM

I would take a '52 Mantle in ANY condition over A-Rod.

Especially considering Canseco is coming out with a tell-all book about him.

Regardless if you like Canseco or not, not one person has yet to disprove his allegations.

So if it's anything like his first, expect a mass clearance sale of A-Rod memorabilia.

Ladder7 · August 11, 2007 11:44PM

I'd take the Mantle if it was a PSA 1

Good luck

Morgoth · August 11, 2007 11:54PM

I think in the future people will realize how silly a SGC 100 or PSA 10 grade is and the premiums won't be as high. The Mantle card in the picture presents very well. If you were to pop both cards out of their holders which would bring closest to 20K? That should answer this question.

chaz43 · August 12, 2007 12:20AM

Mick. End of story. chaz

nam812 · August 12, 2007 12:29AM

Look at it this way. If the big grading companies ever get caught (stressing caught) doing something wrong/illegal, and everyone has to crack out their cards because the grade means nothing anymore, which would you rather be holding unslabbed?

lostdart58 · August 12, 2007 12:43AM

it seems you are comparing apples and oranges ......

Lets compare a PSA 10 Mantle to a SGC AROD in 30 years.....

or a PSA 6 Mantle to a PSA 6 AROD in 30 years...??

Jakt · August 12, 2007 12:50AM

<< What happens when us Baby Boomers start dying? Will Mantle be as revered as he is now? >>

How many of us saw Ty Cobb, Walter Johnson, Cy Young, or Cap Anson play?

Mickey Mantle is a timeless player. His cards will ALWAYS have a high demand.

sayheykid54 · August 12, 2007 12:51AM

The Mickey Mantle without question. The A-Rod is way overpriced and will come down in value over time.

Griffins · August 12, 2007 1:18AM

Mantle in a PSA 1. Better question- 200 shares of Enron or the a modern 10 graded by a defunct (SG rather than SGC) company ? tougher decision.

BobaFett72 · August 12, 2007 1:34AM

"I think in the future people will realize how silly a SGC 100 or PSA 10 grade is and the premiums won't be as high."

well said!

far too much premium is placed on modern cards in plastic.

Bigslick · August 12, 2007 2:01AM

<< 

<< What happens when us Baby Boomers start dying? Will Mantle be as revered as he is now? >>

How many of us saw Ty Cobb, Walter Johnson, Cy Young, or Cap Anson play?

Mickey Mantle is a timeless player. His cards will ALWAYS have a high demand. >>

Personally, I hope your right. I collect Mantle, my son loves Mantle, my Grandsons, not so much. They collect Griffey and Bagwell.
The three men you sight were the best of their generation, or close. Years from now when people look at cold stats. how will they feel about the cost of Mantle cards?

ALWAYS is a dangerous concept. Thirty years ago it was said that Equity Funding must be the cornerstone of any successful fund. Within 5 years all those guys were in Brazil.

PasadenaMudSlide · August 12, 2007 2:21AM

The Mick. Hand down.

Who bids on these "scarce" modern cards, anyway?

Find yourself ten "perfect" examples and keep resubmitting. It will be worth the effort.

Absolutely crazy money for the A-Rod.

RipublicaninMass · August 12, 2007 4:11AM

<< 

<< What happens when us Baby Boomers start dying? Will Mantle be as revered as he is now? >>

How many of us saw Ty Cobb, Walter Johnson, Cy Young, or Cap Anson play?

Mickey Mantle is a timeless player. His cards will ALWAYS have a high demand. >>

phew!!!! Good point...I was worried there for a while!

Morgoth · August 12, 2007 5:39AM

One thing about these cards is that rarity in any condition is what drives Prewar and will eventually drive the 52 Mick. You can still open packs of 94 SP and pull out an A-Rod (guy who posted that only 7's come out of packs, where did the SGC 100 come out of?). Just finding a 52 Mantle due to it's popularity is getting tougher every year. You can throw a stone and hit an Arod SP card. Prewar cards and 52 Mantles are just hard to find period the only thing propping up this A-Rod card is someones opinion it's a "100" not that the card itself is rare.

schr1st · August 12, 2007 5:41AM

In this case, I'd go with the Arod 100 .

stitzen · August 12, 2007 8:04AM

<< "I think in the future people will realize how silly a SGC 100 or PSA 10 grade is and the premiums won't be as high."

well said!

far too much premium is placed on modern cards in plastic. >>

It's not much modern cards that have ridiculous premiums put on them in high grade.

RonBurgundy · August 12, 2007 8:57AM

Mantle.

There are 50 other vintage cards I'd rather have over any modern card.

Ron

bocaratondefense · August 12, 2007 10:13AM

52 Mantle

The Arod card is in SGC holder so is worth less than a psa 10

rube26105 · August 12, 2007 10:31AM

i think iwould fly it to cali and get it crossed over on the spot so i could watch them , just looking,no touching the a-rod card!

Allen · August 12, 2007 10:44AM

<< The Arod card is in SGC holder so is worth less than a psa 10 >>

I hope you are joking...

JackWESQ · August 12, 2007 11:02AM

The AROD SGC 100 just ended with a high bid of $22,667.68. The winning bidder was drmojoe1122 who has 14 feedback and last received feedback in November 2006. Here's the link:

AROD SGC 100

Now, for that price, there is a 1952 Mantle PSA 6 with a BIN from shaqful1 here:

PSA 6 Mantle

A PSA 10 of the AROD? Probably top out around $3K to $4K. Who knows, maybe drmojoe1122 already has a PSA 6, 7 or 8 of the Mantle. It would be interesting to see if payment is actually sent/received.

/s/ JackWESQ

Leiascards · August 12, 2007 1:24PM

You missed my quote, I said the only copies I have personally seen come out of packs would grade no better than a 7. The issue of the A-rod rookie is very subject to chipping on the edges straight out of the pack. I seriously doubt there are many more of those in packs.

In this case I would take the Mantle, not because I like him as a player he was great but as a person he was worse than Barry.

CDsNuts · August 12, 2007 2:07PM

How do you know this is a long-term investment? What happens when ARod breaks Bonds' record and this is still the only Graded Pristine copy of his best RC? I think someone mentioned that the seller bought it for $17k. So he made $5k in a couple years, and the buyer will probably be able to make $5-10k more if he breaks the record in 7 more years. That's about a 75% increase in 10 years. There's no way you get that kind of inflation on a PSA 6 '52 Mantle.

I'm certainly not saying that the Mantle isn't the better card to have, but for flipping purposes, the Arod is a far better option, although it comes with risks (injury, prolonged, slump, etc...). If the 86 Traded Tiffany Bonds only had 1 copy graded 100 by SGC or Beckett, it would be a $30k-$40k card right now. As a collector I would take the Mantle in a heartbeat, but as a businessman, I would take the Arod.

bjork73 · August 12, 2007 6:41PM

<< How do you know this is a long-term investment? What happens when ARod breaks Bonds' record and this is still the only Graded Pristine copy of his best RC? I think someone mentioned that the seller bought it for $17k. So he made $5k in a couple years, and the buyer will probably be able to make $5-10k more if he breaks the record in 7 more years. That's about a 75% increase in 10 years. There's no way you get that kind of inflation on a PSA 6 '52 Mantle.

I'm certainly not saying that the Mantle isn't the better card to have, but for flipping purposes, the Arod is a far better option, although it comes with risks (injury, prolonged, slump, etc...). If the 86 Traded Tiffany Bonds only had 1 copy graded 100 by SGC or Beckett, it would be a $30k-$40k card right now. As a collector I would take the Mantle in a heartbeat, but as a businessman, I would take the Arod. >>

Amen to that... here's another thing; even though there is not a lot of 52 Topps wax left, if you pulled a Mantle (at least not one from the front or back of the pack), odds are it would be a 6 or better. While the supply of '94 SP is certainly higher, the odds of pulling an ARod in pristine, especially SGC 100 Pristine, is TINY (getting an SGC 100 on ANY card really is a feat, even now). Admittedly, the ARod is riskier, but as a pure business proposition, the potential payoff is significantly greater.

Morgoth · August 12, 2007 10:51PM

An SGC 100 is artificial rarity. Modern collectors look for ways to make abundant cards "rare". Just saying it is the only SGC 100 is enough to make it worth 20K more than an ungraded copy? Someone may want to look up the story on the Tiger woods cards that were bringing that kinda dough before it all fell through. To be able to flip this for more money you have to hope that 1. No more are graded SGC 100, 2. A-rod keeps hitting HRs and doesn't get Griffeyed, 3. When the time comes people still have the same kind of reverence for the grade and for SGC. I am too risk averse to make this kinda bet.

bifff257 · August 12, 2007 11:21PM

<< If you were to pop both cards out of their holders which would bring closest to 20K? That should answer this question. >>

That right there says it all...

CDsNuts · August 12, 2007 11:36PM

Diamonds are an artificial rarity too, but people pay through the nose for them. There's lots of stuff where perception drives its value, but it's not like the marketplace will wise up anytime soon. As long as SGC remains relevant and maintains their standards for a pristine card, and as long as graded cards remain desirable (I don't see this changing anytime soon), the best of the best will always be in demand.

When the seller paid $17k for it, everybody thought he was an idiot and there's no way it'll go up in value. In fact, in the "How high will this card go" thread, people were guessing it would sell at $11k or lower. How many threads have been started on these boards where people are shocked that a modern card brought so much? Clearly, you guys are underestimating the modern buyers.

Morgoth- I think the only realistic risk is that he gets injured, and certainly that is a risk. It's like getting a tip on a stock- sure you're guranteed to make solid money if you invested in a mutual fund, but if the stock takes off you'll make much more money. Without risk, there is no reward.

BobaFett72 · August 13, 2007 12:37AM

"Diamonds are an artificial rarity too, but people pay through the nose for them."

very true. there are a lot of dumb people in the world

perkdog · August 13, 2007 12:45AM

Im not even reading this whole thread. IMO The Mantle HANDS DOWN.

gemint · August 13, 2007 2:34AM

I think the card will actually drop in value if/when AROD approaches the HR record. This is what has happened in the past when people start hoarding cards speculating a player will make the hall or break a significant record. If this card retains this kind of value long term, I'd be shocked. Even Michael Jordan's RCs peaked and have now come back down to earth. Same goes for Tiger Woods. Personally if I really wanted that AROD card, I'd buy a SGC 98/ PSA 10 and save myself thousands of dollars. But I guess there's always someone willing to pay rediculous premiums for a card that's so insignificantly superior that the naked eye can't even percieve the difference.

Stingray · August 13, 2007 2:42AM

I wonder if the person who paid $125,000 for the SI Tiger Woods was thinking that was a good investment??

nightcrawler · August 13, 2007 3:03AM

<< But I guess there's always someone willing to pay rediculous premiums for a card that's so insignificantly superior that the naked eye can't even percieve the difference. >>

Well said.

I think PSA has it right, a GEM 10 is about as mint as I would ever want. Grading under a microscope seems ridiculous.

cravetopps · August 13, 2007 5:24AM

Mantle, hands down.

there is absolutely no question that there are other pristine AROD cards out there and every time one of them pops, the price of this card will drop precipitously regardless of how many modern fanatics are out there.

I agree that perception drives prices but if the perception (of value) is driven by a card's scarcity, then for a modern card it will likely be fleeting.

It will be interesting to check this thread out in another year or two.

bifff257 · August 13, 2007 5:57AM

<< I wonder if the person who paid $125,000 for the SI Tiger Woods was thinking that was a good investment?? >>

I am sure right now he is::

1952 Mantle PSA 6 v. AROD SGC 100

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