Need Help on a few items

Smittys · February 12, 2006 11:36PM

Can you tell me where from, where to look is Krause.
And if you don't mind value. I'm trying to learn Darkside
however I keep getting stumped.
Here they are:
Not sure:

Denmark but can't find in Krause under Denmark??

Is this a small date and if so is it large or small leaves??

Ireland except I can't find 1820 listed

Guessing token of some kind.

kuhli · February 13, 2006 12:01AM

1. Netherlands, 1 cent
2. Danish West Indies (now the US Virgin Islands)
3. I defer to the greyside experts
4. token??
5. an apothecary weight. used by pharmacists to get accurate measurements of powdered "medicinals". don't remember the rates off the top of my head, but there were drams (sometimes spelled drahms) and scruples.

kuhli · February 13, 2006 12:06AM

Did a quick check and sure enough, #4 was a token sent to Lower Canada, known as the "Bust & Harp" tokenss, listed as Breton #1012, found in both brass and copper. My reference is a 1965 Charlton, so the reference # may be different by now.

IlikeZARcoins · February 13, 2006 12:08AM

Number 3 with harp on the back - could it be Irish ?

Sorry but no time to check further.

bosox · February 13, 2006 12:12AM

On the left is SDLL (the scarcest of the three). On the right is LDLL (the most common.)

coinpictures · February 13, 2006 1:32AM

<< <i>Did a quick check and sure enough, #4 was a token sent to Lower Canada, known as the "Bust & Harp" tokenss, listed as Breton #1012, found in both brass and copper. My reference is a 1965 Charlton, so the reference # may be different by now. >>

This helps me considerably, as I believe I have one in brass (low grade). I'd always wondered what it was...

Thanks!

MSD61 · February 13, 2006 1:38AM

The one form Ireland is a Brass halfpenny Bust & Harp token dated 1820 and they are not listed in krause. These were originally made in Dublin, Ireland and later circulated as coinage in Canada, where local copies were made. There is a book on the series titled "The Bust & Harp tokens of Canada" by Gregory Ingram & Branko Marelic. There are over 30 different varieties listed within the book of these brass halfpenny tokens

The Danish 3 cents comes from the Danish West Indies and is .625 silver and is decimal coinage.

The very first one you have pictured is a copper one cent from the Netherlands dated 1872B.

IlikeZARcoins · February 13, 2006 8:35AM

Was in bed reading my 2005 coinyear book - saw a picture of a coin much like the number 3 above with the harp on the back.

If you have the same edition as me - page 271 - look at the prices, my heart skipped a beat so I had to get up and see if this was the same coin. Unfortunately for Smittys it's not the same coin ( although from memory the obverse looks similar ).

1960NYGiants · February 13, 2006 12:05PM

The 1820 piece is known as a Bust & Harp token. It is antedated to evade the 1825 law prohibiting importing tokens into Canada. The one pictured is one of the many "imitation" (contempory counterfeits) issues struck in Canada after 1825. Struck in both copper and brass with the brass issues very common. The originals were struck in 1825 in copper. All copper issues are scarce.

Yours look to be a deeply toned brass piece. Variety would be easier to verify if weight was known but it looks like the 10 string harp Charlton LC-60D2, Breton 1012. I don't have my copy of the Ingram/Marelic to verify the variety. Charlton catalogue value C$20 in VF. Would be EF if not for the scratches on the reverse (harp) side. Still a nice piece.

On the two 1891 Canadian large cents, do you have a pic of the obv?

Gene

Smittys · February 13, 2006 10:34PM

Thanks everyone,
Here's a pic of the obverse of the large cents.
The one on the right is the small date,

Need Help on a few items

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