Beatles Color Topps/OPC???

bobwilley · July 12, 2005 1:38AM

I recently sold this card:
1964 BEATLES Color #18 PSA Mint 9 George Speaking
Ringo, George, John and Paul Mint 9 Rare card
eBay Item number: 6190086760

I had clear pictures of the front and back of the card.
The person got this card and said that I have misrepresented it.
As you can see I am an honest Business person and have over 4000 feedbacks 100% positive. So I take this seriously.
The card on the back clearly is marked: T.C.G. Printed in Canada

T.C.G. stands for Topps, doesn't it?
Topps has used other companies to print items for them, but TCG is still Topps, is what I have been told.
O Pee Chee is marked O.P.C., unless they sold to the US market when it was marked Bubbles.

Can anyone shed any light on this.
I go to great lengths to present things properly, and had pictures of front and back.

P.S. I sold two other Beatles Color cards PSA 8's (not PSA 9 like this one) and got positive feedback on both of these cards.

Cubfan · July 12, 2005 2:32AM

Bob,

Check your PM's.

Unless the pictures are doctored, I find it hard to say something was misrepresented when the picture is there for all to see.

bobwilley · July 12, 2005 2:41AM

What is PM?

MorrellMan · July 12, 2005 4:55AM

PM mean private message. At the top of this page, just under the CU logo is a picture of a lock in a box that tells you if you have new messages. If you do, just click on it, and duck.

ZodiacMindwarp · July 12, 2005 5:33AM

From the November 2003 Heritage Auction:

Beatles - Music Memorabilia, Topps Color Card Set (1964)

I can't see how the buyer thinks you misrepresented the card. I believe the OPC Beatles cards from 1964 were in black & white.

bobwilley · July 12, 2005 5:47AM

This was a COLOR card and I have pictures of the front and the back.
On the back it stated: T.C.G. Printed in Canada

No where on it did it say O.P.C. or O Pee Chee

Here is the auction if you want to look at:

Item name: 1964 BEATLES Color #18 PSA Mint 9 George Speaking
Item number: 6190086760
End date: Jul-04-05 18:10:21 PDT

View item description:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6190086760&sspagename=ADME:B:AAQ:US:1

Cubfan · July 12, 2005 5:49AM

There are, at least, two visual differences between the American and Canadian cards. One is that instead of saying "Printed in U.S.A." on the bottom right of the back of the card, it says "Printed in Canada" (duh).
Both American and Canadian cards say TGC on bottom left (not OPC).

The second is that the background for the wording on the back is more gray than white on the Canadian cards.

Both are fairly obvious, even with blurry scans. There are no differences on the front.

bobwilley · July 12, 2005 9:50AM

I see where people include a picture in this forum...
I had attached my pictures and it required bring them down under 50kb to attach them.

What is the process to include a picture right in the body of the message?
Thanks.

Yes this is off-topic, but.... (I had to ask)

bobwilley · July 12, 2005 9:55AM

Ok, I just went looking around and maybe I figured it out..
Let's see...

bobwilley · July 12, 2005 9:57AM

Here is the front of the card. These are the actual pictures that were with the auction in question...

Thanks.
Bob

WarHoundR69 · July 12, 2005 4:30PM

Not familiar with modern cards but here are examples from 1939 - World In Arms (American) & Canadian Fighting Forces. Made by Gum Inc. One the American verision the other Canadian.

WarHoundR69 · July 12, 2005 4:35PM

Bob if you ever come across any Canadian Fighting Forces cards, please let me know. I would love to buy them.

WinPitcher · July 13, 2005 2:53PM

Im not sure if I understand what happened but I can say this, the card you sold is an OPC card. What exactly is the problem? The buyer wanted the Topps version?

what confuses me is psa did not cert it as an OPC.

Its late and I am tired but i think that is what happened?

You surly did not misrepresent anything though

sd

edited to add perhaps the OPC set and the american version are numbered the same and thus the only diference in this case is where the set was printed.

or.....psa missed it

Cubfan · July 13, 2005 3:43PM

Steve,

PSA has not labeled any of the Canadian Beatles color cards as OPC. There is no telling what percentage of those graded are actually US or Canadian.

As such, the only way to tell the difference is visually. And that is the beef of the winning bidder. However, the visual differences were noted in the posting of the pictures with the auction and apparently, no questions were asked.

The Canadian and US versions are identical with, at least, the two exceptions noted above.

WinPitcher · July 13, 2005 11:50PM

Kieth I wonder why the customs people did not stamp the back of these cards? i have some canadian space cards and they were stamped upon entry into the US market. I always thought that back then if a card was printed in canada and was sold in the US market it would get that stamping. in this case the card has no stamp and that leads me to believe that it was printed and sold in canada.

sd

Cubfan · July 14, 2005 12:25AM

Steve - It very well may be the case that the cards that were printed in Canada were sold in Canada.

My point was that for PSA grading and PSA Set Registry (SM

) purposes, the US and Canadian cards have never been separated or marked as OPC/Canada or whatever. The #1 registry set could contain 0% or 100% US cards or anywhere in between. Thats just the way it is and its too late to change now I would believe as too many cards have been graded.

The purchaser of BW's card seems to prefer the US version, which is fine. But he failed to see the Canada marking on the reverse of the card and thinks it was misrepresented. However, NONE of the Canadian cards have been marked as such on the PSA label, so, if its that important to the buyer, it should be up to him to actually look at the pictures in the auction or ask the question if there are no pictures. And as the cards themselves are not marked with an OPC but rather a TGC, even if Canadian, there is probably no way that someone just obtaining their first card from that set would even know.

WinPitcher · July 14, 2005 2:53AM

I agree Kieth

the card sold clearly showed it was printed in canada.

since psa does not differentiate I see np problem (as far as the set regestry is concerned) if this buyer wants only those printed in the USA then he damn better look at the back or at the least email the seller and ask.

my take is that this buyer had no idea that these cards were also printed in casnada and that PSA does not differentiate between them.

In any case the seller did nothing wrong IMO

Beatles Color Topps/OPC???

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