Random observations from 1st show focusing on foreign coins
MEJ7070
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I spent this morning at the Annandale, VA coin show, which is about 15 minutes from my house. It’s generally a popular show in this area (around 60-80 tables). Today was nuts. I arrived at Northern VA community college at around 950 (doors open a 10), and found a line of at least 100 people in front of me. $60 silver makes coin shows the place to be i guess. The more the merrier as far as im concerned.
My daughter was off making gingerbread houses with her cousins, so I was by myself. Since I’d finished my 7070 type set earlier this fall. I decided to focus on Dark Side material, since I pretty much know all of the US dealers and much of their inventories at this show, anyways. Of course my eyes would be peeled for nice US coins, but you get the point.
I was there for around 2.5 hours. Some random musings/observations……..
-Overall the pickings were very slim. I expected to be able to see more inventory. I counted 6 dealers there who were focused on non US material…..2 of those were ancient guys, which aren’t really my thing.
I don’t know what I really expected, but Northern VA is a very densely populated area, so I guess I anticipated a bit more selection at this particular show, since it’s really our hallmark show of the year (Baltimore is in MD so doesn’t count).
-A LOT of shipwreck coins. I mean a lot. Shipwreck coins are definitely cool but I have a tough time embracing damaged coins in my collection (even if the encompassing history is fascinating). I looked at a 1/2R from the El Cazador that had developed some nice edge toning after being recovered, but ultimately passed since the corrosion was just too much for my eyes. I definitely respect the shipwreck niche, but I need to learn more before making any purchases.
-Almost nothing good in PCGS holders…..and very little in NGC either really. One dealer had a bunch of gem NG. graded modern Canadian stuff, but it was all blast white and not for me. Not a single Latin American coin could be found in a PCGS holder at this show. I went to every table.
-There was a fair amount of raw material there, but almost nothing nice. One of the 2 purchases I ended up making was a nice 1892 Durango 8R that will be sent off to our hosts soon enough. I will not disgrace the coin by trying to photograph it raw.
-I was really hoping to see a few nice Brazilian 960R in some form or another…….couldnt locate a single example of the type anywhere. That surprised me. Maybe it shouldn’t have…..
-One dealer who I do know a bit specializes in Irish material. Stopped by his table and ended up with a 1789 Irish Miners 1/2p token in an NGC 58BN holder. My pics are awful, but the surfaces are pristine. I don’t know what the dark streaks are in the pic. My 7 year old takes better pics.
My family is of Irish descent and we have a lot of mining in our history so I was really happy to find and add this particular token to my collection.
Overall was a fun morning. I was hoping to get to see more coins that would fit in my collection, but was good to have a new focus and talk to some dealers I hadn’t met before.
Comments
I went to a coin show today for the first time in 5+ years.
Much of the experience sounds similar to yours. More cars in the parking lot than I expected, ~80 tables, only 4-5 selling world or ancient coins that were worth stopping at for more than a minute or two. I guess in some ways that's a good thing, if I were interested in circulated morgan dollars I could have been there all day. There were another few non-US tables specializing in medals or Canadian or paper money.
I don't pay close attention to 8R or slabbed coins but bet for every one in a slab there were 10-20 raw. I did not see any 960R coins either.
I began by selling a small amount of junk silver coins for a relatively large amount of cash to finance the outing. I ended up only buying 4-5 coins but it was enjoyable.
I agree with your assessment. Very little “good” collectible material on the floor anywhere. Because of that, most of what’s available is damaged material (shipwreck and chopmarked). And it seems to be appearing in vast quantities. Even cleaned coins are selling like hotcakes.
Yes, I understand these coins have historic importance, but until recently, they weren’t collected all that much because most coin collectors consider them damaged.
Due to the current high prices, even collector-grade coins (ie: XF pillars or XF cap & rays) go to auction. (Maybe that will change with the new, higher BP?)
The Annandale show is generally a US coin show and somewhat the antithesis of the Vienna show. Even though they are practically next to each other, the Vienna show tends to have more foreign/ancient dealers than US dealers. There were a few foreign dealers that I thought would be there today who were not.
https://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistry/collectors-showcase/world-coins/one-coin-per-year-1600-2017/2422
It depends upon a collector's area of interest, but I wouldn't expect to see much quality variety at a show of that size. I've mostly been to the ANA, but it hasn't been the World's Fair of Money for a long time. Been to Baltimore and Long Beach once each.
Most of my shows, I was still collecting South Africa Union primarily and for the last 15 years, pillar minors (not Mexico) covering the last three shows I've attended. Nothing or virtually nothing I wanted to buy in either case.
The only coinage I'd expect to see quality wise in any volume is Europe (maybe late 18th century forward) and from the 20th century generally but not from everywhere. That's if you are a generalist.
For anyone mostly or only interested in a specific series, if you look at the TPG pops or what's on eBay, what I am describing is evident. Most of the pop counts for 19th century and earlier Latin coinage are low or really low, at least for it to show up at any coin show when any buyer happens to be there.
As another example, I have a saved eBay search for Mexico 8R covering 1732-1771 for pillar dollars.
How many Mexico pillar dollars likely exist? 1MM+?
How many in my search results at any given time?
About 300, almost entirely low-quality junk and some of it cobs.
@WCC all good points and well taken. I didnt think this show was going to be brimming with world material, but I did expect to at least see some raw coins in decent condition.
Also, our area is densely populated and extremely diverse, so I figured there would be some dark side demand amongst the million + people residing in my county alone. I was wrong.
Almost all the LA material there was badly cleaned, heavily corroded, or shipwreck salvaged. I say “almost” because I did find the Durango 8R I mentioned above. That was from a primarily US dealer I’ve done lots of business with before. He likes to feature lots of esoteric items and though he doesn’t usually have many world coins, he tends to have very eye appealing stuff.
@MEJ7070 are you a member of the Fairfax Coin Club? I had a few 8 reales in our auction last Tuesday.
I live in the ATL metro area which has a population of over 6MM now. I assume there are more collectors within the same geographic area where you live, but I doubt a single person collects what I do now or at any time since 1998, at least anyone I'd compete with for the same coins.
I keep a spreadsheet of my pillar collection with one view a running list of my acquisitions by year. This year and the last few have been far above average. Some of it is finding a few additional sources I missed previously but mostly, I think it's the luck of the draw, collectors just deciding to sell when they did. One more to compete for between now and the end of the year but nothing in the upcoming Stacks or Heritage sales.
I think I'm getting really close to where I'll have to go the private sale route using dealers. Of the 14 I bought this year, most are upgrades or duplicates and those that aren't are mostly or entirely coins I would like to upgrade later. (I was outbid on three coins this year too, both duplicates to those I already own.)
That's pretty much what is available on eBay all the time, and mostly on dealer websites and auctions for my primary interest too. At the last two ANA conventions, a few holed coins but nothing better.
Actually no. I was talking with one of the board members about joining at the last Vienna show.
The only reason I haven’t (yet) is because my business basically makes Tuesday evening meetings impossible. I am pretty much always working. I’d love to go, though tbh.