eBay hijinks?
bgr
Posts: 2,625 ✭✭✭✭✭
I sold a card to a buyer on eBay recently. He spent some time trying to purchase it directly, but when I wouldn't budge on that he purchased it through eBay. The card was sold under authenticity guarantee and I sent it to PSA for authentication. The card arrived and passed authentication and was shipped onto the buyer.
The buyer opened a return saying he received only the blue "envelope" and no card. I reached out to eBay to see what would happen here and the buyer has a few weeks to return the "nothing" to PSA, at which point he doesn't know what they'll do. What I thought was odd is that eBay holds my $$$ until this process is completed, but they know the card was there at PSA already and they have pictures of the entire process. Because this is between PSA and the buyer now I can't dispute the return and eBay told me (and I had them put it in an email also) that I would not have to refund the buyer, but that they cannot release the funds until the dispute is completed. He returned it as "parts missing". Anyways. Not a big deal but certainly an odd process.
I reached out to the buyer through eBay and he said he was "really shocked" and "never expected this" and "he's been in law enforcement for 25 years"... sounds like a bunch of posturing, but I was curious whether anyone has experienced an empty blue card case from eBay/PSA through Auth Guarantee before. Anyone?
Comments
Law enforcement?
What was the tone of the outside of Ebay emails (and how did he know how to contact you)?
While it could just be a coincidence, something smells pretty bad on his end.
Good luck.
That's what he said, but I didn't even bother to look up his name to confirm. I don't know if profession is statistically significant here.
He seemed like a collector who was trying to haggle more than anything. Exchanged number via image and negotiated via text. I said I would only do PayPal F&F and gave him my references. I said I would only ship fully-insured FedEx Express direct-signature required. The card wasn't huge, but it was around $4K. The difference in price was the difference in eBay fees. In the end he chose to buy it in eBay.
I didn't really sense any red flags here.
it's odd for sure.
Thanks.
Obvious scammer. If Mr. Law Enforcement was willing to break policy trying to buy the card outside of ebay, he is willing to scam the system.
Pretty sure freezing funds when a case is opened is automated.
It doesn't take individual details of the case into consideration.
I was already paid the funds from a card sale, then weeks later the buyer opened a case saying he never got the card.
My ebay account funds turned from $0 to negative while the case was open.
The buyer ended up letting the case time out and ebay closed the case. My account was then returned to $0.
Please post his eBay ID so I can block him. Thanks.
His id is vito1017. I'm not quite to the point that I'm certain of anything here, but I find it unlikely that PSA packaged up an empty box and sent it on. While people make mistakes and people are dishonest I'm assuming there's a chain of custody in the auth guarantee process.
Blocked. Thank you.
What about the possibility that it was stolen in transit?
You were not a part of the process that he "claims" went wrong, so yo just have to wait it out and collect your $$.
ETA - Had you dealt with him outside of eBay I fear that he would have made the same "claim" and you would have been SOL.
I'm not certain. I didn't carry on talking to him about it. Here was the conversation.
Me:
Did you really get an empty package? I contacted eBay when I saw this and they have pictures of the card at PSA where they review them.
Him:
I did and I can't believe it! Ive worked in law enforcement for 25 years and have heard of this happening
Me:
I’ve never had an issue with cards going through PSA so forgive me if it seems suspect to me.
Him:
I'm sorry you feel this way but I don't have the money or the card.
Me:
Fair enough. In case you weren’t aware the card went through the authenticity guarantee program. Which means I ship the card to PSA and they verify it’s what was in the listing and legit etc. then they send it on to you. PSA does the validation and they have pictures of this card in their possession. Then they package it in their little blue box and send onto you. I purchased full shipping insurance for the card but that doesn’t do anything for after it’s in PSAs hands.
Have to wait and see I guess.
The law enforcement claim is 100% bogus and a feeble attempt on his part to establish credibility and to also coerce you into accepting his claim. To my knowledge, once the card passes the ebay authentication process and is shipped to the buyer, your responsibility ends there.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
I am fairly certain a $4k card requires a signature pick-up/delivery. A tampered package would be obvious. They meticulously tape the bottom and then put the mailing label over top.
So theft appears to be ruled out as that should have been detected before or at delivery.
What is left is that (i) it's still at PSA undiscovered; (ii) the person putting together that package stole it; or (iii) the guy's a scammer.
I think we all know which is most likely. I suppose there may not be any downside risk beyond having the claim denied. Although, assuming he is a scammer, perhaps there's a trail of this in the past.
This is where my mind went too, especially if he was trying to get it for less outside ebay and then bought it for listed price plus sales tax (assuming he's not in a zero sales tax state).
I hope it works out for you!
If I remember correctly he’s in Maryland. He “made an offer” and I accepted.
Seems like a bit of a moth in the machine if you can return a card as “parts missing” when it’s been authenticated by eBay between the buyer and seller. Something like this should be between the buyer and eBay and I should never hear about it.
Doesn’t Authentication insure the card??
Sounds suspicious to me.
I’m not sure I know what you mean and I don’t know what eBay’s agreement here with PSA is. No idea. I paid for full insurance on shipping incase it was damaged or lost on the way to PSA.
Once it's in the hand of the authenticator and assuming it passes authentication, that's it. You are paid and any subsequent issues are between the buyer and ebay. That's the way the program is designed to work.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
I suspect that > @grote15 said:
That was my understanding but I have had 2 cases - this is one of them - where there was a return allowed under the money back guarantee.
My first one was a couple years ago and they wanted to return it under ebay money back guarantee. Item not as described. There was a pretty superficial crack on the slab and they wanted me to give them $500 outside of ebay because they said PSA would not reholder. Fast forward they did. eBay gave them $200 but I was paid in full. That guy was a specimen.
Then this one. Money back guarantee again but this one was parts missing.
I might have said it before but the eBay dude told me that they couldn’t do anything and it was automatically placed on hold even though the return won’t come to me. It will go back to PSA. Definitely weird and clumsy process.
Law Enforcement could mean meter maid. I have worked with many ex-law enforcement and they usually refer to the actual job they had - LAPD, FBI, Military police, etc.
I sell on eBay so I don’t have to engage with buyers. And I don’t, and would have ignored him, only talked to eBay and let it play out.
You will get your fund, you delivered on your side of the bargain. Shipping from PSA to the buyer is on their own contract.
Anybody want to chime in on this one?
Bought a card on ebay and the price point was high enough to require authentication.
Anyone that follows the authentication process knows there is a timeline posted on the Order Details screen.
Well this card made it thru "Shipped to A (Authenticator)" but never "Received by A."
Waited weeks and finally reached out to EBAY - they opened a case.
Told them I wanted the card, not a refund...
Well 8-10 days later they issued a refund. I was pissed...
I wrote the seller to see if he posted the refund or did EBAY
His response was that EBAY tried to charge him but he appealed and won (still have his original reply)
At that point I assumed he still had the money I sent him and EBAY covered the loss.
I was skeptical the whole way thru this process, so without card in hand - I logged the CERT into my set.
Figured if the card was stolen or seller was pulling some monkey business I could always appeal to PSA or EBAY that I had rightful ownership if someone tried to register it on the Registry or try to sell it again.
Yesterday the original seller posted the card for sale on EBAY - Cert # was a match.
When I wrote him to question him that I thought he was "double dipping"
Somehow managed to retrieve the card and then trying to sell it again -
I told him that I was the rightful owner of the card and it should be mine - I would deal with the $$ surrounding the refund with EBAY.
He wrote back and said EBAY didn't issue to refund - He did ... Yeah right
He wouldn't have replied the way he did if.
I have a call into EBAY Customer Service and hoping for a chance to plead my "rightful ownership" case.
Sorry for the wordy post...
Anything like this happed to anyone else?
Am i wrong?
Steve
sjjs28@comcast.net
Collector of Baseball Hall of Famer's and Stars, 1965 Embossed, 1968 Topps Game and 1969 Topps Decals
Registered Sets: 1965 Embossed, 1968 Topps Game, 1969 Topps Decals
No you are not
Once you received a full refund, your claim of "rightful ownership" ended.
The situation definitely sucks, and who knows if it was an honest mistake or there was monkey business and the seller got away with something, but that's between the seller and ebay.
Did the tracking ever it was actually shipped? Showing steps along the way to the Authenticator? Or just Label created?
You probably shouldn't have accused the seller of double dipping since you don't really know.
And you could have tried to buy the card again, if you really wanted/needed it, maybe this time for less.
Seems like a seller to stay far far away from!
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Sounds like it> @sjjs28 said:
Sorry, but you might be wrong. If an eBay item stops tracking in transit, the seller would be forced to refund the buyer. At that point it's an issue between the seller and the carrier, to either get his package back or collect on insurance.
Did he post it for more than you bought it for the first time? Why not buy it again? Contacting eBay is probably a good idea too. If you got a refund the first time you're likely not the rightful owner. If eBay covered the refund they are likely the rightful owner. Same as if an insurance company pays you for a claim. If the seller refunded you the seller is likely the rightful owner.
The whole binding contract thing on eBay is kind of a joke generally. Often eBay has no way to enforce short of banning accounts. Which I think they hardly ever do.