2 PWCC auctions with the same shill bid ending ......
MLBdays
Posts: 1,359 ✭✭✭✭✭
Auction 1~ 1960 Roger Maris PSA 9 ~ sold 2 months ago for "3500.00" to a shill bidder...... and then PWCC sold it again a few days ago for a much better price of 2k........
2 month old auction with last shill bidder with zero feedback~~~
https://www.ebay.com/itm/352712102510
Same Maris card sells for 2k couple months later~~~
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1960-Topps-Roger-Maris-377-PSA-9-MINT-PWCC-/143372113313?nma=true&si=OahCrX5xQyPpNrPd9fbLM97gFb8%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
Auction 2 ~Last night a 1962 Roberto Clemente PSA 9 card sells for around 16k with another zero feedback bidder jacking the price up at auction close........ this card will be up for sale via PWCC just like the Maris was likely in a couple months or so as well....https://www.ebay.com/itm/1962-Topps-Roberto-Clemente-10-PSA-9-MINT-PWCC-A-/352779209788?nma=true&si=OahCrX5xQyPpNrPd9fbLM97gFb8%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
I just happen to run into these examples as a half-assed observer.....I'm no detective by any means... be leery gents !!
Comments
Confused on the first part. The Maris sold 2 months ago for $3500 then sold again recently for only $2k. Almost have the original "shilled" sale two months ago?
Also, on the Clemente, is it just me or does that seem short top to bottom in that holder?
I consider anything sold by PWCC to be a suspect card so take any pricing with a grain of salt. If it sells low, others may be avoiding them like I am and the fear of the card being trimmed deflated the price. If it sells high it may be bid on by the consignor as requested by PWCC as was the case with the DiMaggio. I discard all PWCC sales when I try to figure out what I should pay for a card. Too many irregularities so I completely disregard them.
You should consider anything sold by ANYONE as suspect, graded or raw.
You should NEVER bid/spend more than you think a card is worth. If you snipe, your bid is what you are willing to pay.
If you don't snipe and put in another bid that's higher on ebay, that can be figured out by the seller.
You should buy the card not the holder.
You should realize that altered cards get past the TPG's.
You (sadly) probably have altered cards in your collection, both raw and graded.
Finally, you should never bid on any high grade Killebrew cards I might be interested in.
Thank you for your attention.
Try to enjoy collecting.
Looks a bit short to me.
Just wanted to see these side by side.
Is it just me, or does MLBdays' Clemente have more wood grain on BOTH the top and bottom borders.
Also, we don't say "half-assed" around here. We prefer "one-bunned".
I would say there is a touch more black showing from the top of the card to the bottom of the lip inside that slab on the bottom card.
If I see card is being sold by PWCC, 95% of the time, I run. Seems like every card sells for 20% more than you can buy a "buy it now" for. PLus the other things discussed above.
I'm just asking, but do you have any reason to believe either auction was shilled, that is besides the fact that the winning bidder had zero feedback? Most auctions, at least of popular items, have the price "jacked up at the auction close". I'd say there is a very low correlation from the price with one minute to go and the final price. Of course this all applies only to eBay. I reserve the right to comment on other auction platforms.
Alex Relyea
That Clemente is short and shilled. Nice.
What evidence do you have for any of this? I'll bet it isn't unusual for a winning bidder to think he got such a good price that he decided to flip it. Also, not all NPBs are shills, as many of us know to our detriment. A ludicrous price paid can mean many things. Consider two people really wanting the card so they both put in crazy snipes. The "winner" never believed that the card would go for so much and decides not to pay. This hypothetical fits all the facts as well. I'm not suggesting it is correct, only that you have no evidence besides your suspicion that there was any shilling involved.
100%
Wouldn’t make sense to pay 1.5 times market value and then attempt to flip. So pretty safe to say this is a NPB, likely the owner of the card.
welcome to the forum
PWCC....shocker
I got shilled once. Back in the day, I always seemed to get outbid on ebay by minndc. He was after a lot of the same "oddball" Harmon Killebrew items I was.
Seeing a J.D. McCarthy postcard I wanted, I decided to put in a stupid bid of $75.00 on something I felt was worth no more than $25.00. Figuring he was going to outbid me, he would have to pay WAY to much for it.
Just before the auction ended, I got an outbid notice (by this time I was happy that I wasn't going to win it) but wait, the bidder, (not minndc by the way) who had bid multiple times in 5 and then 2 dollar increments before finally outbidding me, retracted his bid, claiming he bid too high by mistake. WHAT? Now I was declared the winner.
I complained to the seller, who knew the other bidder, but claimed he didn't know anything about any shilling. I paid for the item. SURPRISE! PSA rejected it as "questionable authenticity"
After this fiasco I decided to never get shilled again. I decide on a price I would be OK with for an item and never put in a stupid bid or snipe. If I get it great, if not I wait for another to come along.
My new opinion on shilling is; go ahead and play your games, it won't effect me again.
There simply is no evidence. The "observation" could be correct, and there could be a perfectly reasonable (see above) explanation for the price jumps on some cards. Two bidders putting in foolish snipes could easily explain things. If the winner refuses to pay for the item, it gets auctioned off at a later date.
Many people have become (or already were) jaded over the problems in the hobby.
Anyone remember the old SCD auctions? Now those were a joke!!!!
I am sure unscrupulous sellers get together in an attempt to inflate prices. It won't work if you ignore the foolishness and stick to a bidding plan. You don't NEED baseball cards.
If you are suggesting that one should be leery of the half-assed observations, then I agree.
Really - how effective or useful can your heads up be when the auctions had already ended beforehand. The intentions and processes of the sellers and the buyers may be of the highest order, and short cards can exist without alteration. These cards belong/belonged to someone and who are we to call them out based on, in your words, half-assed observations. IMO.
Video reveals.................nothing.
Not trying to start a battle with you.
In other news, I haven't lost an Ebay auction when I have a mustache. My wife keeps asking why I haven't been shaving my mustache. She hates the mustache. I don't know how much longer I can keep up the lies, but as long as I'm winning Ebay auctions, I'm not shaving the mustache. She can just deal with it.
There could be ways to convince her that facial hair is a GOOD thing ;-)
Just sayin'
I grow a pretty thick mustache. I think she worries about getting poked in the eye when she leans in to give me some sugar.
Hard to see how these are “9’s”, looks like some light edge and corner touches.
Apparently a lot of people are not running from their auctions.
Hobby has certainly attracted a few snakes. LOOK OUT. One seller on eBay you might be familiar with (not mentioning names) has taken over the sport cards on eBay BIN. His prices are absolutely unrealistic.It will be a cold day in hell before I buy from him.
Deans? 777? makes PWCC auction results seem reasonable actually.
CU Ancient Members badge member.
Collection: https://flickr.com/photos/185200668@N06/albums
The card has been a real hot potato. Sold 10/16/15, 9/12/18, 9/15/19 and yesterday. A few of these sellers took a bath.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
Fixed.
Agreed 100%