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Yikes and GADZOOKS !!! Generic 20's are jumpin'
topstuf
Posts: 14,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
Yow!
I got 20 of em a month or so ago with gold only nominally lower.
Figgered they were TOO CHEAP (for what they really are and what they WILL be when gold takes its ...RUN)
And now they are poppin' 10 bucks a day even when gold is only creeping slightly up. AND.... I want another 15-20 and boo hoo hoo.
Sooooo, thinks me..... I'll go back to plaiin ole BULLION fer my stackin'
YOWP! Hunnert bucks (almost) over spot.
I think I may have to fall into the "PHYSICAL SHORTAGE" mob purty dang soon.
Sooo.... what's the purpose of this post?
Darn good question. Chalk up to venting I guess.
I got 20 of em a month or so ago with gold only nominally lower.
Figgered they were TOO CHEAP (for what they really are and what they WILL be when gold takes its ...RUN)
And now they are poppin' 10 bucks a day even when gold is only creeping slightly up. AND.... I want another 15-20 and boo hoo hoo.
Sooooo, thinks me..... I'll go back to plaiin ole BULLION fer my stackin'
YOWP! Hunnert bucks (almost) over spot.
I think I may have to fall into the "PHYSICAL SHORTAGE" mob purty dang soon.
Sooo.... what's the purpose of this post?
Darn good question. Chalk up to venting I guess.
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BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
<< <i>Im slightly confused as to what you bought.
Lol, as usual or a constant state of being???...$20 gold pieces...
<< <i>Not just any gold $20's, but generic ones!
Yes, Generic graded gold. Available from Heritage and many other sources.
You're only buying plastic, but there's a coin inside and these pups are NOT in local coin shops.
Not in quantity anyhow.
<< <i>
<< <i>Im slightly confused as to what you bought.
Lol, as usual or a constant state of being???...$20 gold pieces... >>
Def constant state of being. Taking care of an infant solo for a week and working with 3-4 hours of broken sleep a night for the past 5 nights has been rough.
Maybe it was the entire post that just wasnt clickin, i dno.
BST Transactions (as the seller): Collectall, GRANDAM, epcjimi1, wondercoin, jmski52, wheathoarder, jay1187, jdsueu, grote15, airplanenut, bigole
What are the dates and mintmarks? What grades are they in? Do any have attractive toning or interesting die features? How about some pictures of your collection?
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
I'm not trying to belittle in any way, shape or fashion, just putting in context.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>Ain't numismatics great? Collectors of historic and/or beautiful and/or rare forms of metal, including coins and nuggets, will pay more than the "melt" in order to own the objects for a while. >>
Sure....but what % of melt? That makes all the difference. When I was buying MS64 Saints in spring of 2004 they were $635 each or around, about a 65% premium to spot. In Nov 2009 they got to >80% over spot. And during the crash of the past 2-3 years they have been as low as 20-35% over spot. Today they are at +37% to spot.
The proof 1 oz AGE's are probably rarer than MS64's and arguably much more impressive and artistic looking. They have typically sold for more than MS64 Saints. That apparently has changed recently. Proof AGE's are 24% over spot....and in my mind a better value than MS64 Saints. While the US mint is still striking proof AGE....the big gold buyers like Heritage, Rarcoa, etc. are still getting fresh piles of $20 Saints from overseas and slabbing them. Who knows if or when that supply ever runs out? That's essentially "minting" them because fresh slabs increase market supply. US mint or PCGS....it's still minting.
When you make these same comparisons to MS63 to MS65 generic Morgan silver dollars the percentages to spot start at +378%. Only a factor of 10X difference from a MS64 Saint.
<< <i>Stupid me that likes to put everything into a relative sense, so I'm hearing something priced at $12.50 went to $12.60 the next day.
I'm not trying to belittle in any way, shape or fashion, just putting in context. >>
The real context is that MS65 Saints (and the 63/64 grades as well) are up some 10% in the past couple of months.... not 1% in a day. While not a big gain, it's still a gain. And a gain while gold was making fresh bull market lows and continuing its decline.....an interesting divergence. Maybe it's just a simple promotion by the bigger coin dealers? Heritage has posted some buying ads the past month or two on types of generic gold. They are looking for quantities of MS64 $5 Indians and MS65 $5 Libs. I've always compared the subsidiary action of gold miners vs. bullion gold as much the same way as generic gold vs. bullion gold. Both of them peaked well before gold did, and in many cases years before gold did.
These are simply more bulk bullion that is unlikely to attract gov't attention or become ruled persona non grata by dumb bank safe deposit policies.
They are just GOLD!
I just stack em in the shipping box with the invoice.
Yep, I look at em to confirm that they WILL match criteria for grade, but nothing more.
Nope, they ain't toned or especially purdee. Don't want em to be.
They are just ANOTHER way of holding bullion and they go in the box with the plain bullion coins and I have no idea why I keep stacking as the box is not liftable any more anyhow.
I is a goldbug.
sigline has some of my COLLECTION gold. Nowhwere near completely what I have in numis but you can get the idea that I don't just buy bulk saints.
And why am I explaining MY strategies? They are correct and will prove good in the long run. So there.
Who's to say that gov.com won't decide that $20 Libertys or Saints are fair game someday? And why wouldn't gov.com consider the Modern "collectible bullion" that it sells at a healthy premium now - to be exempt from some future confiscation order because they are already defined by gov.com as a "collectible"? Nobody has a guarantee, it's all speculation.
Getting back to the OP's musing about physical shortages, has anyone experienced a higher premium on regular issue AGEs lately, or are the higher premiums only on slabbed Saints at this point?
I knew it would happen.
Nobody.
But stepping on COLLECTOR toes isn't a a good path to election.
And all halfass US gold "sorta" stacking coins would be affecting mom n pop folks instead of filthy fed up bullion SPECULATORS! Booo.....
I just think they won't bother because there ain't enough gold in US form to amount to hill of beans.
compared to AGEs, mapes, phillies, etc.
or not.
"Premium" is whatever number over melt that a willing buyer and seller will conduct a transaction for.
And call it whatever pleases you, obviously! Some call it "rescuing dollars", some call it "insurance against wall street and the Fed", some call it an investment in an asset class, my wife calls it, "oh, lookie! you bought another shiny little coin for your coin collection! that's not nerdy, oh no!"
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>Who's to say the legislation won't touch saints and libs?
Nobody.
But stepping on COLLECTOR toes isn't a a good path to election.
And all halfass US gold "sorta" stacking coins would be affecting mom n pop folks instead of filthy fed up bullion SPECULATORS! Booo.....
I just think they won't bother because there ain't enough gold in US form to amount to hill of beans.
compared to AGEs, mapes, phillies, etc.
or not. >>
Lol, there aren't enough collectors to elect a pta member...
<< <i>.....Lol, there aren't enough collectors to elect a pta member... >>
It only took a SINGLE collector back in 1933 to get FDR to exempt pre-1933 gold from the confiscation order (ie collectible gold). And all the big boyz of the 1930's to 1950's bought lots of "collectible" gold for not much over melt.
Who was that lone collector? None other than Secretary of the Treasury William Woodin, one of the foremost US collectors of the early 20th century. He was the guy who back around 1910 traded his $50 Unions to the US Mint/govt for a box load of rare US patterns which included the J-1776, Amazonians in gold, etc. Smart guy. He also owned a 1933 $20 Saint at one time. Don't know if he was ever a PTA member though.
Saved here for posterity.
Why wouldn't they? They have no qualms about raising every other tax.
I knew it would happen.
Low premiums and beautiful coins. Very liquid and a chance for the premium to increase.
<< <i>"Gov.com" will never, ever, ever, ever, ever (ever) confiscate everyone's gold.
Saved here for posterity.
Why wouldn't they? They have no qualms about raising every other tax. >>
Of course they never will, they will get jmski's though... Lol...
Couldn't stop booze, couldn't stop any drug, won't stop pm's...