Talers straight from China

worldcoinguy · May 9, 2013 11:05PM

This should be enough to ruin your coffee and donut this morning. The most concerning aspect of it is the manufactured wear.

Aliexpress listings

spoon · May 10, 2013 2:39AM

Wow.. I'm especially impressed by this listing, but there are a bunch that look passable.

Welcome to my coins Store!
I am a Chinese coin collectors,I have a factory of production coin.
I could provide the best coins and best service for you.

Product Description
All the pictures are taken ourselves. For most coins we sell, we have more than one. After we sold one coin, we relist the same listing and use the same/ So you may not receive the same coin as in the picture, however the coin you’ll receive will be in the same condition or even better in condition as the coin in the picture. The coa No or the coin No will be randomly selected if it is not declared clearly in the description.

spoon · May 10, 2013 2:45AM

Also.. they're wise to fixing the casting lines... all taken from different listings:

agentjim007 · May 10, 2013 3:05AM

Am I missing something? Says copy, $2-$3 and free shipping. Doesn't seem worth the money to sell these.
OK I'm guessing you guys are concerned about resale, coin doesn't say copy.

LochNESS · May 10, 2013 3:32AM

<< <i>... The coa No or the coin No will be randomly selected if it is not declared clearly in the description... >>

Every part of that screams "RUN" to me.

spoon · May 10, 2013 4:48AM

Yeah.. the scary part isn't so much how someone is selling these, it's how good the fakes are getting and the immense quantity.

If this is the forgers' mass produced souvenir junk, I'd hate to imagine what they're capable of when they take their time to make something to pass in a real auction.

I kind of wonder if any of them are stepping up from casting to using 3D scanners to create dies?

spoon · May 10, 2013 4:58AM

Here's another example compared against Zohar's pic from the CV thread (there are a ton of this type at that site in varying degrees of wear/quality, this is just the first I clicked)
It is easier to spot the differences when a real one is at hand! Still.. these are good, and this isn't the best example.

Zohar · May 10, 2013 6:11AM

spoon thanks for sharing - this is probably the most forged coin. These float on ebay and should be purchased with caution raw.

LochNESS · May 10, 2013 6:05PM

Stuff like this makes me feel sorry for all the good, honest Chinese people. It must suck having a homeland that is synonymous with forgeries.

duki · May 10, 2013 9:03PM

I have read aRticles about how Chinese culture has a different understanding about what "genuine"means. They feel if something is created in the spirit of or as good as it is then equal to the original. That's how the Chinese government defends sending newly made terra cotta warriors to museums in place of ones actually dug up. I wish I could remember where I read this, but it was long ago, perhaps in the economist magazine.

duki · May 10, 2013 9:25PM

To continue, perhaps that line of thinking is b.s. inscrutability meant to deceive or apologize for keeping the best for them selves and or just screwing others but really I think most Chinese people in china have been brought up in a cruel society where one does anything to survive. Maybe with their new found wealth and collecting habits/ desires, their ideas will change, but I doubt it as the new wealth is highly concentrated and leaves the majority of people still out in the cold.

Blah blah blah.

MacCrimmon · May 10, 2013 10:41PM

<< <i>To continue, perhaps that line of thinking is b.s. inscrutability meant to deceive or apologize for keeping the best for them selves and or just screwing others but really I think most Chinese people in china have been brought up in a cruel society where one does anything to survive. Maybe with their new found wealth and collecting habits/ desires, their ideas will change, but I doubt it as the new wealth is highly concentrated and leaves the majority of people still out in the cold.

Blah blah blah. >>

As an interesting side note from Bloomberg TV a few weeks ago:

The wealthy and upper middle class Chinese were no longer inclined to purchase luxury goods such as Gucci, Tiffany, Coach, etal. in Mainland China, or even Hong Kong anymore, opting instead to purchase them in London, Paris, New York, Dubai, etc. The reason? They feel they're less likely to be duped into purchasing FAKES !!!!

Now that's TOO RICH!

harasha · May 10, 2013 11:04PM

They feel if something is created in the spirit of or as good as it is then equal to the original.

That issue has appeared even in the world of mineral collecting. Mineral specimens from China need to be carefully examined for crystals that have been repaired. The article that I read about this also mentioned that part about spirit.
See this example, at the top right. At first, what looks like a small fracture or flaw turned out, upon closer inspection, a completely snapped off point carefully glued back into place.

sumnom · May 26, 2013 3:07AM

Coins have been counterfeited in China for as long there have been coins in China. The same can be said for art. Moreover, the sorts of conversations we have on this forum have also been going on in China for centuries at least, if not longer.

But really, historically this is not a new problem, nor is it a uniquely Chinese problem. We may think of it that way now but people having been passing off fake goods as real throughout human history.

Lynch · May 26, 2013 9:28AM

Early American paper money often bore the warning "Death to Counterfeit" and it was no joke. Additionally, special paper such as notes containing mica flecks was used to try to discourage such activity. An example is this ebay offering.

Or see this.

sumnom · May 26, 2013 11:14PM

I like the wheat sheaf. It looks like one of the propose reverses for the current US cent.

Lynch · May 27, 2013 5:48AM

The vignettes on early paper money do indeed have their charms.

But for sheer beauty, it's hard to beat the Educational series.

lordmarcovan · May 27, 2013 10:11PM

one troy onuce .999 silver cald iron cross coin

Huh? Whazzat you say?

Talers straight from China

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