How to polietly ask a dealer if a coin has been cleaned

Shoedog

I call a well known national dealer who has been spoken well of here.AU-58 coin a little under 4 figures

Said dealer uses a rating system and this coin gets his top ranking.

When I call I ask him about the coin.His reply is basically-well its a 5 star coin.

Ok I say I'll send a check.I get the coin and it has faint hairlines in the obverse fields.No they are die polish lines.Back it goes.I have wasted my time and his.Not only was this not a 5 star coin or whatever,but I can't see how it made it into an NGC 58 holder.I don't want to disclose too much as I not want to bash this dealer,only learn from my experience.

So how do all of you handle this?Any secrets to getting a honest description of coins you are interested in?Any way to ask trenchant questions without hurting anyones feelings?
Thanks!

longtimecollector

The only honest description is the one you give to coins you own and don't intend to sell........

Thats what a "return policy" is for !!!!!!!

If you ask me, the only thing you can trade sight unseen is bullion

Murphy

If you want honest descriptions, you should deal only with those
who have earned your trust and know exactly what you look for in coins.
To expect someone to be open an completely honest with you upon first
meeting or transaction seems a little naive, even if referred to by a trusted
friend. But that's just me. I wouldn't buy a fish from my mother unless I
smelt it first.

cmanbb

Typically I get coins sent to me on approval. I usually return a check for their postage,
explaining why I did not like the coin, without bashing the coin.
This way they have a better undestanding of what I am looking for, (next time),
and they continue to send me coins on approval. My return rate is not very high, but it does happen.
I probably would leave "the cleaning" out of it, and tell them not enough luster for an AU58..............or something like that

DesertRat

How to polietly ask a dealer if a coin has been cleaned

"Hey pal!!! You use a Dremel on this or what??"

what??? Doesn't that work??

RYK

"Is it original?"

"Are there hairlines?"

"Any signs of conservation?"

"Is it scrubbed, buffed, wiped, whizzed and/or polished?"

"Is it NCS'ed?"

Tonelover

It really shouldn't hurt anyone's feelings if you ask however you like. Saying something along the linest of you wanting only original coins is one way to be tactful about it.

Problem is that many dealers, including some of the big ones, are simply not able to tell the difference in many cases. I've had dealers look me straight in the eye while telling me that the grading services don't slab cleaned coins. Whether they were lying or believed it I don't know.

So asking upfront might save some time and trouble without hurting anyone's feelings but when it comes down to it you will often just have to see the coin yourself to make that determination. It never hurts to have a better grasp on that concept than the dealer which sometimes isn't as hard as one might think.

Reece

Ditto Murphy---I just had a national dealer call me re an expensive gold coin, I collect New Orleans gold, he described the coin and really didnt hit it on the head-so I asked him if the coin was totally origional, not processed, surfaces not stripped, and generally not washed out looking, and he said maybe he shouldnt send me the coin!! You are the buyer with all the money, you need to feel FREE to ask ANY question about the coin you want to.!! It just saves me and the dealer alot of time.

tmot99

I have found "What is this P O S?" to be quite effective.

If they have a return policy, just say you don't like the look of the coin. You can say that you don't like the lines on it. Tell him if he finds one without the lines, you would be highly interested.

Fairlaneman

Just a question. Were the faint hairlines the only problem with the coin ? If so what did you expect for a AU58 ? Sounds like minor circulation to me which would account for some hairlining and the AU58 grade.

Ken

thebeav

<< <i>"Is it original?"

"Are there hairlines?"

"Any signs of conservation?"

"Is it scrubbed, buffed, wiped, whizzed and/or polished?"

"Is it NCS'ed?" >>



Hey, these are good....
Personally, I don't think that asking any of these things, in a sight un-seen deal, can be construed as 'offensive'....
Paul

stman

<< <i>How to polietly ask a dealer if a coin has been cleaned >>



Bottom line you need to get your point across. Believe me when I say if it is indeed a cleaned coin
the dealer will deposit your check in a very "Polite" way knowing you accepted a cleaned POS.
IF it was actually cleaned. The faint hairlines could have been from light circulation, hence, the AU58 grade.

Ryana

ER

Star-rating system? Sounds like DLRC.
They do have a no-question return policy. Get it in your hand and decide for yourself.

Dog97

Shoedog was obviously expecting a PQ coin. i.e. one that was basically a 64 or 64 but had subtle signs of wear or rub instead of obvious hairlines. After all it was 5 Star Coin*****
5*****means the best of the best like a 5**** hotel or a 5***** restaurant.
5***** is not the Denny’s buffet @ the Days Inn.
Next time ask the dealer why it's graded 58-what signs of wear does it show.
A seller is not going to bash his own item so you have to drag it out of them. Before you call you need to know what's acceptable to you and what's not acceptable and make this clear to the dealer as to not waste both of your valuable time.

coinguy1

Shoedog, I think you've already received good advice regarding how to ask what you need/want to.

However, nothing you mentioned necessarily indicated that the coin in question had been cleaned, as hairlines are not always due to a cleaning, especially on circulated coins. Thus it appears that even asking if the coin had been cleaned might not have provided you with all of the information you were actually seeking.

Also, I don't know if you wanted the forum to know the identity of the dealer in question or not. But, if you didn't, you could have been a bit more discrete.

Boom

Nice/ polite? My eye. It's YOUR money and if a dealer (I don't care who he or she may be) tries to jack you and has lied about the condition of a coin then you tell that person that you are very disappointed in both him and the coin and that you don't want or pay for a POS.

Shoedog

For the record,this coin did not come from DLRC.I pulled the 5 star designation out of the air.

For the record I have bought 1 coin from DLRC and am quite happy with it.

The point of my question,How to get an honest description,seemed to get lost in some peoples reply.

Mark,
I thought I was being discreet but now I see using the star rating would lead some to speculate I was naming DLRC.DLRC is on my favorites list and I check thier inventory daily.I would buy from them without hesitation.

coinkat

Shoedog:

Try and attend some major coin shows and meet some of the dealers that you buy from by mail. Show them an example of a coin you like and that may help them understand what you expect in a coin. Seeing the coin is worth more than 1000 words... even to an experienced dealer.

silverpop

i just Bluntly Ask if The Coin Is Cleaned or not Works For me A Lot Of Times Saved Me From Some Bad Mistakes

dorkkarl

if you want an honest description, GRADE THE COIN YOURSELF.

K S

aem4162

it was easy for me. i was at my local shop one day and asked about it. the owner knew i was back into the hobby and i explained that even with what i'd read in my books about cleaned coins, i was still having a problem making sure of what i was seeing. i showed him the book i was reading, showed him the pix that confused me, and he explained it to me using examples from the display case and junk box. i feel a heck of a lot more comfy and he has a customer for life.

dthigpen

I generally ask very bluntly, but politely, "To your knowledge, has this coin been cleaned in the past?". I've had a few dealers act turned off by it, put on their bifocals and give me the whole "Well, I suppose it could have been, but it was probably decades ago so it doesn't really matter", which often prompts me into leaving their store. On the other hand, I've had some dealers completely on the up&up about it and respond honestly and open about it and even make a point to then point out some uncleaned examples of the same type.

UncleJoe

I think coinguy1 hit it on the head.

Your question may not get the info you desired. I assume you believe that the coin sent to you was cleaned. But that may only be your opinion. If you asked the dealer if the coin was cleaned, he may have said no.

It appears that your question needs to be expanded to read: Has this coin been cleaned and/or have hairlines? (and as stated previosly by others, hairlines don't necessarily mean that the coin has been cleaned)

Be specific as to what you want when asking your questions and you should be able to limit the number of returns.

Joe.

Steve27

You sound way too picky to be buying coins sight-unseen.