I am very pleased with the new patriotic designs on the new Platinum Eagles. See inside.

wingedliberty

Darkhorse

An eagle on one side and miss Liberty on the other? What's going on here? I don't see a dead president or an outline of a state anywhere on that coin.

kranky

I like 'em!

wingedliberty

It seems that the designs are getting better and more patriotic after 9/11.

wingedliberty

ttt

Yousri

Very nice design. When this design started. I can hardly see the date. I need my glasses.

ER

Definitely better, Brian.

ER

Isn' t the new $10 the one that has Lady Liberty on both sides? Strange.

Aethelred

The eagle leaves me a little cold, but I do like the Liberty.

ConstellatioCollector

That's how coins should be designed. No dead presidents!

wingedliberty

Maybe they finally got the message. Maybe Director Fore actually read some of our threads.

magikbilly

Hi,
IMHO, platinum content aside - they look like something that should be in the paper for 3 easy payments of $29.99 and made by the Franklin Mint or whatever. I think they are hideous - both the "hard" representation of liberty and the eagles. Liberty seems to be suffering from glandular or hormonal problems - as least on my screen.

Best,
Billy

wingedliberty

The depiction of Liberty is Greco-Roman in style, combined with a blend of Britannia , and accented with a unique American intensity. This is true numismatic artistry. I very strongly dissagree with you.

magikbilly

<< <i>The depiction of Liberty is Greco-Roman in stile, combined with a blend of Britannia , and accented with a unique American intensity. This is true numismatic artistry. I very strongly dissagree with you. >>



I can see the "stile" - I have seen it before you know....

Billy

wingedliberty

Well, at least you chose really well for your icon. Gorgeous Merc!

MacCrimmon

Hopefully next year's issue will show a closeup of the eagle's head with OBL's ripped off head in his mighty beak.

Change Liberty to a "Walker" style with an full-auto HK in her upraised right hand. I'd buy a roll of those.

magikbilly

<< <i>Well, at least you chose really well for your icon. Gorgeous Merc! >>



Hi,
I must agree with you Yours is very nice as well - I have always loved this design, especially in colorful Proof. I have owned that coin for 6 months and it is still giving me thrills.

Best,
Billy

Baley

neat design, I'd like to get one of those. where's the date?

wingedliberty

the other side.

Baley

what, the edge? looks reeded in the illustrations. Am I missing something??

edit: are those both reverses, and the obverse is still going to be the Statue of Lib head (and the date)?

Aethelred

On further reflection I'll say I was wrong. Both of those designs lack the delicate and subtile refinement that we have seen on American and European coins from ages past. There is a cartoonish look to them (as there is with most current American coins).

wingedliberty

"cartoonish" would be the absolute last word I would even come close to describing these gorgeous designs.

Aethelred

In my opinion the just lack something. I am no art critic by a long shot, but they just don't have the same subtile feel to them that coins made 100 years ago do.

wingedliberty

I agree there upon your clarification, but manufacturing methods are far different today. Relief elevation is also lower.

magikbilly

Hi,
I am no coin symbolism-design historian - I know this basic imagery has been around for centuries. How many precedents are there for having an "eagle" at the feet of "liberty" as seen on the first of these designs? Thanks.

Best,
Billy

ConstellatioCollector

I can honestly say it's better than the Special Olympics Commemorative!!!

cladking

The first looks great. The second might look good in hand.

magikbilly

Hi again.
I don't think you can compare this design to the figure depicted in the beautiful icon of Darkhorse (the first responder in this thread) - that figure is rendered with such delicacy and so well composed - just compare the arms and hands on our right on both coins. I see a big difference - due to methods of manufacture I don't know - but the icon design is ambitious in conception, judicious in execution and very well composed - a different league. The seated liberty on the platinum coin is brutish IMHO and crude in comparison.

Best,
Billy

Aethelred

<< <i>I can honestly say it's better than the Special Olympics Commemorative!!! >>



On that we can all agree!

sliderider

<< <i>An eagle on one side and miss Liberty on the other? What's going on here? I don't see a dead president or an outline of a state anywhere on that coin. >>

MacCrimmon

The 'problem' you perceive is the total lack of engravers at the U.S. Mint. The other, as WL stated, is the relief. There is only so much you can do with sculpture in low relief.

DH's coin design and engraving is first rate but it is also much higher relief and it is from an era that produced many talented medallic engravers. Full-on renderings are difficult enough as it is, too.

I think the eagle with the flag in the background works quite well.


Here's Pistrucci from the golden age of medals.

Aethelred

Ah Pistrucci, in my opinion one of the greatest engravers who ever lived!

Neptune

neither one gives me big thrills.

cosmicdebris

I like 'em

Darkhorse

My main problem with the depiction of Miss Liberty in this coin is the perspective in which it is viewed. It seems as though we are looking upward at her (whom is also looking upward); while this could be construed as a position of power it doesn't engage the viewer and can seem slightly domineering. Previous depictions of Liberty, and women in general in 'Greco-Roman' Classical, Neoclassical or Romantic style always are at eye level or look slightly downward.

Flowing hair liberties look slightly upwards but then again I don't really like flowing hair Liberties that much. One could see her exposed neck as a symbol of defiance or vulnerability, it's up to interpretation. Probably defiance given the context.

Her legs; I have no idea what's going on with them. Her left leg... I don't even know if there IS a left leg! Look at it, where could it possibly be? It's not in front. The only possibility is that her legs are spread wide open and the left leg is stretched to the side.

The drapery. Poorly done. Big and shapeless that, don't even subtly, highlight the curves of the body. And having that torch next to the corn stalks is clearly an accident waiting to happen.

The eagle on the other side is okay, he's just minding his own business, floating in space, little else. The flag is a bit too much but that's just my opinion.

I'm not a big fan of full front faces on coins given the flatness of the medium, there are few examples of when they're actually effective. Hence side profiles tend to look better in my opinion. Here's the best example of a front I've seen but it's of an owl and their faces are flat to begin with.

Thanks for the comments regarding my sig picture.



I like this design a lot but it's not without its small faults, the medalist (Oertel) may or may not have contrived the head position to make room for the legend and her right hand could've been executed a little better but these are minor quibbles. Yes her nose is kind of big but white people have big noses. The background is pure Germany.

My main problem with modern coins, especially proof coins, is their sterility. They don't seem like they've encountered the touch of the human hand in their production. They seem so flat. Calculated. I'd love to see some more concave fields or fields that look like they've been worked on by a sculptor (ie the 1920 Pilgrim half dollar). Designs that seem to blend in or connect into the fields in one way or another. What we have now is a poor use of negative space.

Darkhorse

As a matter of fact I'm working on a classical-looking [albeit Canadian] coin design right now. :-X

Aethelred

<< <i>They seem so flat. Calculated. I'd love to see some more concave fields or fields that look like they've been worked on by a sculptor (ie the 1920 Pilgrim half dollar). Designs that seem to blend in or connect into the fields in one way or another. What we have now is a poor use of negative space. >>



The Type 1 Buffalo Nickel is another example. Great review Phil!

aem4162

miss liberty looks fantastic on the 2004 pae. she's just too expensive for me. why can't they put those designs on the silvers?

Darkhorse

<< <i>Great review Phil! >>



Have to make use of that art degree somehow.

1907Quarter

you know, I think this is a darn good thread. Fine opinions, excellent topic. This is indeed some of the more refreshing work from the mint in quite some time, but I agree with the vantage point/ sterility issue!

magikbilly

<< <i>My main problem with the depiction of Miss Liberty in this coin is the perspective in which it is viewed. It seems as though we are looking upward at her (whom is also looking upward); while this could be construed as a position of power it doesn't engage the viewer and can seem slightly domineering. Previous depictions of Liberty, and women in general in 'Greco-Roman' Classical, Neoclassical or Romantic style always are at eye level or look slightly downward.

Flowing hair liberties look slightly upwards but then again I don't really like flowing hair Liberties that much. One could see her exposed neck as a symbol of defiance or vulnerability, it's up to interpretation. Probably defiance given the context.

Her legs; I have no idea what's going on with them. Her left leg... I don't even know if there IS a left leg! Look at it, where could it possibly be? It's not in front. The only possibility is that her legs are spread wide open and the left leg is stretched to the side.

The drapery. Poorly done. Big and shapeless that, don't even subtly, highlight the curves of the body. And having that torch next to the corn stalks is clearly an accident waiting to happen.

The eagle on the other side is okay, he's just minding his own business, floating in space, little else. The flag is a bit too much but that's just my opinion.

I'm not a big fan of full front faces on coins given the flatness of the medium, there are few examples of when they're actually effective. Hence side profiles tend to look better in my opinion. Here's the best example of a front I've seen but it's of an owl and their faces are flat to begin with.

Thanks for the comments regarding my sig picture.



I like this design a lot but it's not without its small faults, the medalist (Oertel) may or may not have contrived the head position to make room for the legend and her right hand could've been executed a little better but these are minor quibbles. Yes her nose is kind of big but white people have big noses. The background is pure Germany.

My main problem with modern coins, especially proof coins, is their sterility. They don't seem like they've encountered the touch of the human hand in their production. They seem so flat. Calculated. I'd love to see some more concave fields or fields that look like they've been worked on by a sculptor (ie the 1920 Pilgrim half dollar). Designs that seem to blend in or connect into the fields in one way or another. What we have now is a poor use of negative space. >>



Hi Darkhorse,
thanks. You have voiced my concerns perfectly regarding modern Proof coins, and these 2 designs in particular - the vantage of liberty and the "viewer", the drapery problems, the wasted opportunity in not utilizing the fields to create the "sculpted" feel you describe..or even incorporate them into the design as the example you mentioned did so well.
It is rather ironic that you mention the background of the medal by Oertel is "pure Germany" as the pose of the figure and general composition remind me of 1 or 2 English propaganda posters printed after the Lusitanias torpedoing in 1915. I see what you mean about her right hand in the larger scan of the medal you posted.

Best,
Billy

Darkhorse

Well I see the background of the medal many times, every day on my way to work. The architecture of the houses, the trees etc. That's Germany to me.

magikbilly

<< <i>Well I see the background of the medal many times, every day on my way to work. The architecture of the houses, the trees etc. That's Germany to me. >>



Hi,
the Oertel it is very beautiful indeed. Perhaps you have another favorite medal you'd like to share? I'd be interested to see it

Best,
Billy

291fifth

The eagle/flag design is poor. The seated liberty/eagle design isn't much better, especially considering the size of the coin it graces. They both have the same artistic impact as the typical private mint medals of the 70's...little or none.