How Much for this 1805 Irish 1/2 Penny? Now with Images.

cosmicdebris · February 6, 2004 7:23PM

How much should one of these go for?

Watt 1805 Ireland Half Penny NGC PF66BN (Bronzed Copper) A gorgeous gem CAMEO, but cameo is NOT designated on the holder. This may have been one of the first Watt coins graded in 2002, before NGC started designating "Cameo" on foreign coins.

newbiecollector · February 6, 2004 7:53PM

I wish I knew the answer to that Cos but, of course, I don't. I sounds great and I would to see a photo.

cosmicdebris · February 6, 2004 10:05PM

Anyone got a WAG?

ajaan · February 6, 2004 10:08PM

$350

cosmicdebris · February 6, 2004 10:10PM

So no premium for Watt on the label?

ajaan · February 6, 2004 10:11PM

I don't think the Watt label get a premium.

mongoose · February 6, 2004 10:18PM

How about a picture?

cosmicdebris · February 6, 2004 10:25PM

I am waiting for a picture from the seller.

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 3:21AM

Images:

vrtech99 · February 7, 2004 3:47AM

I like that!!! Do you know what it's worth yet???

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 3:54AM

So far I have Ajaan's WAG and I have the dealer's price. I need some more input to be sure but right now I'd rather buy this coin from Ajaan than the dealer that has it for sale.

1jester · February 7, 2004 3:57AM

I suspect the Watt pedigree will carry a significant premium in the future, if it doesn't already. I believe that because not only was Watt the designer of the machinery and the mint master, but his hoard was kept in the family in immaculate condition for 200 years, and comprises perhaps the best examples of those coins on the face of the earth.

Is Ajaan's also in a sl*b with the Watt name?

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 4:04AM

How much should this premimum be?

spinaker2000 · February 7, 2004 4:05AM

Does it also come with the little tin holder that Watt stored them in?? I know that when NE had some listed they included the holder and some with hand written notations. I would guess that it list for near 400 pds in the new Spink, but I don't have that version for Ireland.

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 4:32AM

So £400 or $739.00 is Spinaker's WAG.

Anyone else? Lloyd? LM? Dead King?

1jester · February 7, 2004 4:41AM

I'm by no means an expert.

However, as a collector, and if I had the money, I'd go 2-5 times the price of Spink if it came with the original silver holder and paperwork. I don't think Spink even has a category to describe MS66-68 coins of that era. Some of Watt's coins were MS/PR68. That's simply amazing, and far above what you'd otherwise expect for coins of that era. Plus, Watt had the ability to cherry-pick the absolute best coins from the line, and surely he did that. So his coins would represent the best possible coins available, even at that time. I think his coin collection represents one of the all-time best opportunities in numismatics.

For what it's worth, the PR-66 coin you show wasn't the best of the lot.

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 4:53AM

2-5 times eh? Dealer wants over $2500.00 for it. It does come with the original shells.

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 6:01AM

Anyone else? I am having a tough time deciding on this one.

trozau · February 7, 2004 6:06AM

I think $2500 is too much for that coin, Watt pedigree or not. $500 maybe but not $2500 or more.

SYRACUSIAN · February 7, 2004 6:12AM

I have no idea , but based on the dealer's price that seems to be in accordance with Jester's convincing post, I'd say it's a lot of money. Gothic crown kind of money.

python · February 7, 2004 11:58AM

Nice coin. I have no idea on value.

MacCrimmon · February 7, 2004 12:33PM

<< <i>For what it's worth, the PR-66 coin you show wasn't the best of the lot. >>

True!

Send a PM to Andy. He was at the Morton sale of these Watt coins, and he may be able to tell you the actual price realized in Nov. 2002. However, keep in mind that this sale didn't get all the "attention" that it might have so many of the extraordinary pieces sold for "a song", and largely these coins sold just before UK material WHITE HOT, WENT NUCLEAR!!!!

And another thing!!!!! Why can't the TPGs properly designate these "bronzes"? Their not BROWN!! IDJITS!!! All 'bronzed' copper is 'brown', is it not?

cosmicdebris · February 7, 2004 8:40PM

Also from the seller:

<< <i>I'm not getting great pics, the bronzes are the toughest to photograph. This coin is similar to the other Watt Bronzes, with bright, hi gloss, reflective fields and cameo devices. This piece comes with the silver lined brass shells that it was housed in for nearly 200 years. >>

I already pmmed Andy and he said "I don't know that market well enough to put a price on the coin"

1jester · February 7, 2004 8:46PM

Cosmic, since the coin is one of the "lesser" examples, why don't you make the seller a counteroffer of, say, $1250?

MSD61 · February 8, 2004 1:19AM

My resource for Irish coin prices do not even list the beautiful piece. So, I did some checking around. I have been seeing this piece going for about $2750.00 USD or 1489.00 púnt (pounds) and 2166.00 Euros. I will call my uncle in Donegal, he may know off hand.

cosmicdebris · February 8, 2004 2:56AM

More history in the November 13 2002 auction of some of the Watt pieces went for anywhere between $350.00 and $1200.00 depending on wether the shells and any paperwork were included with the coin. After which many pieces started selling for much higher prices in the after market. One person spent $35,000.00 for 3 of the 1805 Irish pieces. With this kind of return I think this coin may well be worth the $2500.00, however, I already turned it down. I may regret this choice later.

How Much for this 1805 Irish 1/2 Penny? Now with Images.

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