Counterfeit Opinion

cacheman

Does this Gold $1 piece appear to be counterfeit to anyone? I'll give you the rest of the story after I hear what you have to say. Thanks.

longtimecollector

The letter spacing seems strange, not to mention the "sandblasted" look ....

MrEureka

It looks fake to me.

Veep

I wouldn't buy that one. The surfaces look pourous...as in c-a-s-t.

atomic

Looks cast not die struck to me (e.g., fake).

airplanenut

Too granular to be real...

billiardmaster

The coin is not one you will find counterfit very often, I would have to see the coin up close to be 100%.
PCGS and Akers were not much help. Is that raised metal between a&r in dollar? That would make my
vote phony. If just scratches, genuine. Have never seen one of these that was phony. Can't wait to hear the whole story?
Rusty

Sequitur

Isn't that an 1854 Type 2, with that ugly crown? The posted photo isn't too sharp, and the porosity does look strange, but it could be the photo, too. The lettering, however, looks pretty good to me, but then again parts of the bow look false. Need a better photo. Wouldn't touch it if I saw it online only, but I can't say with certainty it's a fake.

XpipedreamR

Genuine

agentjim007

First the coin doesn't have that unnatural clean look but they tumble these to put marks on them. One thing I don't like from the picture is that it looks like the denticles go right up over the rim. I wouldn't buy it

Sequitur

I compared it with some pics on Heritage. Now, I agree w/ Pipe. I think it's real.

TWQG

I vote fake.. tip of nose looks wrong.

lordmarcovan

The surfaces look suspiciously granular, but not enough to automatically scream "fake!" at me. I am uncertain. I've seen real ones that were baggy and looked sort of like that.

Not sure it's a fake, but it's probably one I'd steer clear of, at any rate.

tgilliams

PR61 real

sinin1

it has a type 2 obverse that by itself looks pretty nice for 1854

it has a type 3 reverse that wasn't made until 1856


they did not have any $1 gold patterns made in 1854
they did not have any proof $1 gold in 1854


obviously a fake with that reverse -

what is the diameter and weight?

cacheman

Breen lists this coin as 6034 with this obverse and reverse.

nwcs

Yes, looks fake. Details are soft for what they should be and the surfaces are odd. On the bright side, might be real gold.

Conder101

I don't really know gold but this coin has many things about it that are just setting off alarm bells. The uneven spacing of the letters on the obverse (Very wide on UNITED and much closer on AMERICA), the letters are not all on the same arc line (Some high some low) and some are rotated. These dies would have been made from hubs so if this is genuine then ALL of the Type 2 dollars would show these same odd placements and I don't think they would have put a hub this messed up into use. The first and last S in STATES do not even look the same. On the reverse the uneven spacing of the letters in dollar, especially the wide gap between the A and R. (Once again because of hubs ALL 1854 gold dollars would show this same feature.) Also in Dollar the D is low and rotated clockwise. Another feature which is common to most type 2 dollars is that the date, especially the middle two digits, are usually weak. On this coin they are very bold.

darktone

I treat all raw $1 gold as if they were fake! Just too many counterfeits out there in this series to judge from an internet picture but I suspect your coin to be fake. mike

atomic

Here are pics of a few slabbed 1854 coins at AU55, FV35 and AU58 respectively:





And an unslabbed AU:



Even the worn coins don't have that pitted, soft look of the coin you're looking at. Really does look cast to me.

-Atomic

LAWMAN

Yours is a Beiruit Lebanon cast factory special. 12 drachmas on the street.

cacheman

First of all, this is not my coin. I am trying to help my friend who is not a member here get some feedback on this coin that is being returned by a winning bidder that maintains a "private" feedback account. My friend, who is from Sweden by the way, was trying ascertain whether he was being scammed by the buyer. My friend is a world coin collector and he had decided he wanted to get rid of his U.S. coins. This particular coin has been in his collection for about 20 years. I am currently trying to get a larger and better image of the coin but we will have to wait until it is returned to him. I honestly think that what everyone is seeing as granularity is just the over-amped use of the sharpening tool in the image editing software. I may be wrong but it also appears that there is lustre still showing on the obverse.

Here is another of his coins just for comparison....

atomic

cacheman,
You're right. One cannot be 100% certain it's a fake based on this photo. It occurred to me also that the pitted appearance might be the results of a pixilated image due to compression. I also see what looks like bulging on the reverse, but that too may be a result of how the photo was taken. Compared to the other photos I posted, the images of your friend's coin makes it look fake. But then I posted a $5 gold coin here fresh out of the slab and a few folks though it was fake, too. It isn't. I'm starting to think that unless you take several photos from different angles it's really hard to take a serious guess at a grade or at whether a coin is real or counterfeit.
-Atomic