Who do you want to make HAPPY - The Dealer or the Collector
Cameo CC
Posts: 663 ✭
I have read many posts here lately about the grades the grading services issue and appreciate these posts. I will say that I have found many observations with no solutions to those observations.
The bottom line is who does one want to make happy - The Dealer or the Collector?
I remember what a dealer said at the 1999 FUN Show. He said, “If you want to make the dealers happy, then the grading service will make more 70 material. If you want to make the collectors happy, then the grading service will make less 70 material.”
The grading service is in the middle. Like a parent who makes the decision for their two children who have different demands.
As for me, I prefer to make the collector happy.
What about you?
Todd
The bottom line is who does one want to make happy - The Dealer or the Collector?
I remember what a dealer said at the 1999 FUN Show. He said, “If you want to make the dealers happy, then the grading service will make more 70 material. If you want to make the collectors happy, then the grading service will make less 70 material.”
The grading service is in the middle. Like a parent who makes the decision for their two children who have different demands.
As for me, I prefer to make the collector happy.
What about you?
Todd
Todd Abbey
800.954.0270
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Without him/her there is no need for a dealer.
Really grading services shouldn't give a wit who they make happy. Set some standards and judge every coin against those standards. How hard is that?
My Set List
K S
Edited to add: Oops. Just noticed my lengthy diatribe had nothing to do with the original topic. Sorry.
Specializing in 1854 and 1855 large FE patterns
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They should sit as impartial arbitrators of quality, and all that that entails.....not just the technical aspects but also the non-technical aspects.
snake
Todd
800.954.0270
K S
relationship with both collectors and dealers. However in a real world bussines sense,
a company such as PCGS must always take into account the feelings, comments,and
recommendations of all aspects of the coin industry, while maintaining its own objectivity.
Instead of who do you want to make happy, the comment should really read "Keep all
parties of the industry satisfied with the reliability , stability and dependability of the services provided
by the 3rd party grading company." Being happy implies gaining some benefit or advantage beyond
ones expectations. Bear
Camelot
I have stress today and may be a little grumpy. What I am trying to say that legend seems to post numerous posts about PCGS and their grading practices. Yet, I haven’t heard from them respond to this thread.
I just find it curious.
Todd
800.954.0270
when i joined the forum about a year ago, my initial post was in a thread which concerned...........grading by PCGS. i maintained at that time that the services had the advantage of knowing more about grading than we all did and i stick to that opinion. the only comment which has ever made sense contrary to that is that there are certain individual dealers/collectors who know more about a series in particular than a grading company or professional grader may know in general.
with that said, i feel that often a submitter wants a grade for there coin that they realistically know it will not receive and some of the posting you refer to may be an expression of the resulting disappointment. standard fluctuations not withstanding, the pros at PCGS just look at more coins than any of us.
heck, i hear so much about the "10 second rule" that i assume the following to be true; 1 coin in 10 second, 6 coins in a minute, 360 coins in an hour, 2880 coins in a day, 14400 coins in a week and a whopping 748,800 coins per year for 1 grader at PCGS!!! if we cut that in half for bathroom breaks, smoke breaks, lunch breaks and sanity checks, it still comes out in the neighborhood of 375,000 coins viewed a year which is a few more than i reckon any of us look at.
perhaps the "10 second rule" needs to be re-figured!! or perhaps it's just easier to realize that a professional grader's opinion is more accurate and based on more than just the particular coin being graded. in short, as experience grows, subjective opinion changes. with coin grading as with all things. just my take on why we think grading standards shift.
al h.
whether they are happy or not is entirely up to them.
if it refers to pcgs or third party graders in general, what does happy have to do with anything?
what do you mean by the dealers quote,
"remember what a dealer said at the 1999 FUN Show. He said, “If you want to make the dealers happy, then the grading service will make more 70 material. If you want to make the collectors happy, then the grading service will make less 70 material.”
i dont get that either, the TPGs dont "make" the coins 70 or not, they either ARE or they are not 70s, the grading company just puts it on the slab or they put 69 or 68 or whatever the coin is.
when you're dealing with coins that perfect, what's the difference?
if they're the same price, gimme the 70, im happy
if the 70 is too much more and I can get a 69 that looks the same, gimme that,
if, depending on the series/date, the best practical buy is a 64 or a 58 or even a VF-20, then that's the grade to go for, and I'm happy!
the only ones unhappy are people with unreasonable expectations from the system.
and i think it is unreasonable to split hairs when looking at coins, and unreasonable to expect objective results when dealing with something so subjective as "eye appeal"
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
having said that, are you happy!?!?!?!?
al h.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
now it's great is someone catches on & learns to enjoy coins, & i helped out is some way, but hey, it's a hobby, not a charitable event. you wanna be happy? not my problem. barring that i don't rip someone off, happiness is your problem (you the dealer/collector/whatever).
K S
despite your effort to the contrary, i suspect that you're happy and that makes me happy!!! can anybody out there say Kumbaya............
al h.
<< <i>What Anacaonda said......but in layman's terms: I believe that they should give every coin the 70 it deserves, whether it's a dealer OR a collector. The problem, it SEEMS, is that every coin that SOME dealers (DHRC) submit, get's all the 70's, and collectors get the 69's and lower. If I HAD to have the 70, I would have to go to all the DHRC's of the country to get them. That's the unfair thing. If all the collectors got all the 70's....well then they wouldn't NEED all the DHRC's, now would they? This is the vicious cycle.
Homerunhall says he does not submit the coins he sells, he buys them from other dealers who`ve submitted them.
are we talking PCGS MS70's???
so we're talking modern coins here?
coins minted in the past 40 years or so?
what is the oldest MS70 anyone has ever heard of?
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Was only using "homerunhall" as an EXAMPLE. I have nothing against him/them.
Pcgs pretty much is the standard which the others follow and/or are compared to.Pcgs has,according to my observation and every nearly every other classics coin submitter I`ve talked to,tightened their grading standards.This is, to some degree,effecting all the better grading services and those who submit.
Collectors may think this is a good thing, but down the road, when they or their heirs sell, they might just change their mind.Especially if the grading standards CHANGE again, and the ms-65`s (in 64 holders)that they`ll be selling later,may be real bargains in the eyes of the GREEDY dealers
I prefer consistant standards,which don`t seem to be happening lately.
i know of at least one PR70 brilliant 1964 jefferson. it sold on eBay about two years ago for somewhere around $300, more than i was willing to bid at the time. if i'm not mistaken, the seller was somewhat ahead of his time and had amassed some 70's from the early sixties and was selling them off.
al h.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry