How's this for ethics?
MastaHanky
Posts: 933 ✭
I go into a coin store today to pick up a 1924-P Buffalo that I know they have (see the previous thread on the Buffalo nickel article). It's a nice MS65. The price is marked at $593 (greysheet from a month or two ago is 610/645). I go to pay for the coin. The guy looks at it, and asks me to wait a second. He consults his price sheet, see the coin has a big + sign right next to it, and then jacks up the price to $800.
Do I have a right to be pissed off? I sure ain't going there again. GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH. It even ruined the symphony performance I caught tonight because it was bugging me so much.
Do I have a right to be pissed off? I sure ain't going there again. GAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH. It even ruined the symphony performance I caught tonight because it was bugging me so much.
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Not the smartest move to adjust your prices in front of the customer.
Before you came in he had a $593 coin in inventory and now he has an $800 sitting in inventory.
You should go back next month and offer him $550 to help him get rid of his slow moving inventory.
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Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
I would have told him to shove that thing!
Pretty lame tactics on his part.
i always let sellers know i'm serious and want to purchase a coin, just not at the price they want. i tell them when they "get real" we can deal!!!
as to the point of ethics, poor. some dealers are quite greedy with little business acumen past an understanding of dollars and cents/red and black ink. he sounds like he fits in that category. good luck.
al h.
Oh, I didn't. I was way pissed off.
<< ..if the guy has some other nice stuff in his inventory and you really want the buffalo it might be a worthwhile approach to visit him a time or two and see what else he has that interests you. i think it's helpful that he's shown his true colors!!!! if he's had that coin for awhile and knows your interested the price will probably come down, especially if you've purchased from him before. >>
The guy had some REALLY nice stuff in inventory. This was my first visit to the shop. I was excited when I saw all the stuff he had for sale...I thought I'd be making several purchases from him. However, this first (near) sale ruined it for me. I have no plans on going back. I can find what I need elsewhere.
at about 30 raw Liberty $20.00's that a dealer friend spread
out in front of me. I have not bought anything from him in
a while but we used to do a lot of business before that. Some
of the coins were still based on spot gold around $310-320,
now gold hit $350, and they were still marked $360 on
the 2x2's when they should have sold for $400-410. He said
they are marked $365 so if you want them you can have them at
that price. I took them since he offered them to me and I bought
several others from him at good prices. He did not make up for it
with the other coins I bought.
Now that's a dealer who used his head. So actually he ate the
$50 per coin and for three coins that's $150 which is about what
your dealer friend could have done. If it was a major oversight
on a rare coin well that is a different story. This is smart dealer
who knows I'll be doing more business with him in the future. He's
very fair which is why his table at the Baltimore show is always
swamped with customers.
My website
K S
Would you have complained if the coin had been marked at $800 and you told him you wanted it and he quoted you $593?
I agree it is a lousy thing to do and he probably should have handled it a little better, but prices change and it is unreasonable to expect a dealer to go thru his inventory and reprice everything every time a new price sheet comes out.
Did you tell the dealer your feelings? Did you tell him that this changing of the price wasn't making a good first impression on you? It's possible had you made your feelings known to him that he would have worked with you on the price.
bottom line is the dealer can do whatever he wants, but when he baits and switches like that iw ould imagine 95% plus customers are going to walk away.
2 Cam-Slams!
1 Russ POTD!
I hope you flashed him a pleasant " f-you" smile as you sauntered out the door.
The dealer I go to, he checks the GS for every higher grade coin before selling it to me.
He will mark some down, and some up. Never that much though.
***Edit: Fixed Typo***
Eisenhower Dollar, BU
Set Incomplete:
Roosevelt Dime
1900 - Current Type, No Gold
Silver Eagle
The dealer does have the right to change the price, but he should not have done it in front of you like that! Very bad business tactics and piss-poor customer relations. I would never grace his store again after a move like that!
Total Copper Nutcase - African, British Ships, Channel Islands!!!
'Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup'
<< <i>The guy had some REALLY nice stuff in inventory. This was my first visit to the shop. I was excited when I saw all the stuff he had for sale...I thought I'd be making several purchases from him. However, this first (near) sale ruined it for me. I have no plans on going back. I can find what I need elsewhere. >>
Not only a very bad practice to change the price in front of you, but very shortsighted in the long run for reasons stated in MastaHanky's quote above.
1) He had a built in profit at the $593.00 price he could have made instantly.
2) And this is the shortsighted part, he lost any and all future business from MastaHanky and would have likely made more profit off him in the long run as a good, loyal customer.
3) Some dealers just don't get it!
Joe
Jeremy
When I confronted him about the price on the coin, he stammered "That's just kind of a guide to the actual price of the coin."
<< Would you have complained if the coin had been marked at $800 and you told him you wanted it and he quoted you $593? >>
No. But from what I've experienced, it's not uncommon for dealers to drop prices marked on a coin, sometimes without even asking.
Even a small increase I can understand. But a 26% increase in price I find totally unacceptable.
<< 1) He had a built in profit at the $593.00 price he could have made instantly. >>
I wish I had confronted him with this. If he hadn't walked over to the counter...if I had just paid him cash right then and there, he would have never known the difference.
<< 2) And this is the shortsighted part, he lost any and all future business from MastaHanky and would have likely made more profit off him in the long run as a good, loyal customer. >>
And I really wished I had brought this up with him. I spend about $5000 a year on coins. Granted, that's not a whole lot for some dealers, hell, it's probably not even in the top 50% of customers. But that's $5000 that that dealer will no longer be receiving, and I wish I had told him that.
<< Greg- he could save more time doing what my dealer does... don't mark anything- if you want a price, he picks up greysheet and find you a price >>
That's what most dealers around here do, and that's exactly what he should have done. If the coin had no price marked, and he had quoted me $800 after looking it up, I wouldn't have cared.
A local dealer I've used for Morgans doesn't have his price marked on each coin, but he does have a standing price list that he updates every 6 months or so (this is all raw stuff). His "action" relative to the greysheet obviously fluctuates every week...but he's managed to stay in business quite successfully for 25 years.
>>
MastaHanky,
Do what I do, when I feel like I've been treated poorly: write him a polite letter. If you're lucky, he'll receive it the same day a bunch of new bills come in!
BASED ON CURRENT MARKET CONDITIONS
OR BUYERS ATTITUDE.
So why didn't you buy the coin when it was priced at $593?
I am also aware of a shop in your area that has over 5000 coins on display and they are all priced. They are priced accurately when placed on display. They don't have the time to reprice all 5000 coins every week when new sheets arrive. If/when you buy there, you will be charged current market regardless of what the coin is priced. Their statement is that prices "are indications only".
Got quoins?
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
>>>I am also aware of a shop in your area that has over 5000 coins on display and they are all priced. They are priced accurately when placed on display. They don't have the time to reprice all 5000 coins every week when new sheets arrive. If/when you buy there, you will be charged current market regardless of what the coin is priced. Their statement is that prices "are indications only".
the market you speak of is the market according to the grey sheet which is mostly for "dealer to dealer" trading,is it not? If the dealer doesn't have the time to retail reprice everything every week then don't price anything but what will absolutely happen if he does that is "walk-in" customers will decline.By and large,people want to see a declared price on what they are considering buying not a conjured up voodoo number which is claimed by the practitioner to be "the current market price."The current market price is the price on the holder as far as i,as a potential buyer,am concerned.
Really,would all 5000 priced items on display have to be repriced every week? It seems to me that a dealer who is really on top of the current market and knows his inventory will never get into scenarios where he has to quote over a 20% higher price than is marked on the holder of any of his coins on display.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
This firm, with the large inventory, has made the decision to put a price on all coins displayed.
And for the umpteenth time, the Gray Sheet is just a price guide like any other. Granted it purports to be wholesale but don't you think that forms the basis for a final retail price?
Also, what makes you think that a move of more than 20% is not possible in a heated market.
Got quoins?
Bulldog
No good deed will go unpunished.
Free Money Search
Wasn't this coin passed on initially?
Although we could have seen someone gloat that they got a rip on an underpriced coin.
Got quoins?
I didn't have the money at the time when I first saw it (which was only a week and a half ago). It was still priced at $593 when I went to buy it. It jumped to $800 when I asked about it. After he raised the price, he was sure to have it relabeled with the new price.
<< I am also aware of a shop in your area that has over 5000 coins on display and they are all priced. >>
This is probably the same shop...it has the largest display of coins I've seen locally.
<< Their statement is that prices "are indications only". >>
This obviously is the case here. I think they should at least make an effort to make this known to customers. I sure had no clue about it beforehand, and this is the first shop I've run into that prices stuff like this.
<< Also, what makes you think that a move of more than 20% is not possible in a heated market. >>
It's entirely possible. In fact, we've seen moves of over 1000% in some areas in the past few months. I'm not so much upset about the huge price jump as I was the feeling that the guy was trying to weasel another $200 out of me.
Perhaps I'm blowing this out of proportion. I still think the guy could have worked with me a bit though. If I had whipped out the cash before he had a chance to look at his sheet, he still would have made as much profit as he was obviously anticipating when he priced it. Even if he met halfway between the price and sheet, it still would have been better than jumping all the way to the top. Not a great way to treat a first customer.
This isn't exactly the same situation, but could be construed to be by some forum members. I had a dealer ( a long time customer) look at a pile of GSA coins that I brought to today's show. He looked through them (they were priced), bought some, passed on some, and asked if I'd reconsider my pricing on four or five.
After looking at the four or five, I lowered the price on several, kept the price the same on one, and RAISED the price on a couple. After looking at the coins, there were a couple that I liked better today than when I priced them a few weeks ago. And it had nothing to do with the fact that he was interested in them. I really didn't care if he passed on them or not.
Anyway, stuff happens. As long as I wake up every morning, I'm going to have a good day.
GSAGUY
P.S. The guy laughed and still bought more coins from me.
Haha, I was mad about it yesterday, but now it doesn't really bother me (despite what may be inferred from my posts). I have better things to worry about. I just wanted to make sure with everybody that I wasn't way off-base with what I thought was reasonable.
(I told my girlfriend about what happened, and she laughed at me. In fact, she's still laughing at me. I guess that helps.
Sounds like you've got a cool girlfriend.......you're lucky.
It often takes my better half to keep me rooted in reality.
GSAGUY
It is a price guide. For common stuff, it contains prices you could expect to get from a dealer when selling and what you would pay when buying.
Maybe he's just a collector who doesn't sell anything and the coin shop is a decoy so his wife doesn't find out how much he spends on coins?
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since 8/1/6
<< <i>And I really wished I had brought this up with him. I spend about $5000 a year on coins. Granted, that's not a whole lot for some dealers, hell, it's probably not even in the top 50% of customers. But that's $5000 that that dealer will no longer be receiving, and I wish I had told him that. >>
MastaHanky,
It isn't too late. Write him a letter. Tell him what you said here. He should hear it.
Sounds like, regardless of the price he quoted, the mood of the situation was the problem, not totally the price, although $800 for that coin is a heavy premium, unless of course, dancing girls accompanied you to your car after the purchase
To flat out offer advice to never purchase from this dealer again, is a bit harsh in my opinion. When I went to fill some holes in my circulated barber dime album, I picked up about 15 dates from a dealers "stock" tray, and asked for prices. He made a little chuckle, and commented that he's had some of those coins for a LONG time, and that the prices marked on the 2x2's were way out of whack. It would be absurd of me to ask the dealer to offer me the coins for prices that could have been a couple of years old (yeah, stuff like circulated, low grade, common date Barber dimes can hang around that long
I'd give the dealer another shot, but I wouldn't be shy to explain what I didn't like, or appreciate in what transpired the last time I attended the shop. Clear the air about the whole thing, and you may find yourself and the dealer forming a solid business relationship. Maybe not too. It's worth a shot to find out though.
If that coin comes with the dancing girls for the $800, please let us all know the addy of that place
LSCC#1864
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