Lakers miss the playoffs? It isn't so absurd.

KingCobra

Frank Hughes on ESPN.com wrote a very good article about the situation the Lakers are in, and how it is not unreasonable to speculate on them missing the playoffs. At first, I figured it was ludicrous, but look at the numbers:

* The Lakers are 10-15. Last year's 8 seed in the West, Utah, won 44 games, so let's say they need 44 wins to make the Playoffs. They'd have to finish 34-23.

* Since Shaq came back, they have not won more than 2 games in a row.

* Not only would they have to go 34-23, they'd have to do it against the toughest part of their schedule. The combined record of the teams the Lakers have beaten in 103-133. Take away the one win against Dallas, and it's 83-130.

* They'll have to do it against a tougher conference than last year. Phoenix and Houston, 2 non-playoff teams from last year, are playing well, Utah has not totally bombed the way some thought they would, the Clippers are improved (especially when Odom comes back).

* Shaq is already starting to snipe at his teammates.

The Lakers missing the playoffs? Not likely, but no longer unlikely either.

KOBEcollector

hey K.C was that the Lebron James article ? imagine him on the Lakers

JoeBenson

Lebron wouldn't fit with Kobe! It would look like Raptors when they had Vince and T-Mac!

And wasn't everybody bashing me when I said Lakers MAY miss the playoffs!!

KingCobra

JoeBenson, I was among those who mocked you and said the idea was ludicrous, but I have to admit now that I've seen the numbers crunched it isn't such a crazy thought anymore.

The lakers with Lebron, however, is crazy. No team that gets the pick will trade it, and LA will probably have a very low percentage shot at getting it.

2323

Yep KingCobra, I don't think the Lakers are going to do too much this year. There's no unity there at all. How many teams in the past have done anything when they cannot even get along? None I bet! Kobe & Shaq think they are superior to they're teammates. Maybe they are, but you don't go around telling them that. Things are just getting worse by the day. I really don't think they have enought time left in the season to get everyone to respect each other and like each other enough to make the playoffs. Why are Kobe & Shaq always complaining about everybody to the media anyways? At least they have each other. Kevin Garnett pretty much has nobody helping him, but you never hear him complaining. I think Kobe & Shaq should hire Garnett to teach them how to respect they're teammates and how to talk to the media so they do not do any more harm to they're team. KG#1 !!!!!!

JoeBenson

yeah, thats for certain! Lakers may not be what we have been seeing that past few years, but they are still far from the worst team!

KingCobra

Yeah, you have to figure that worst case scenario, they still win 30-35 games.

Funny how most of the Lakers fans are silent on this one

autobilia

<< <i>Yeah, you have to figure that worst case scenario, they still win 30-35 games.

Funny how most of the Lakers fans are silent on this one >>



Hehehe.... they will show up eventually.

autobilia

Looks like the Lakers will lose tonight.

JoeBenson

LOL, Lakers put in the scrubs, and T-Wolves didn't....But Lakers Srubs narrowed the gap from 22 to 18 so far, LOL.....Kobe 13 Points? He needs to step up!! Instead of trying so ahrd to get a few rebounds and assists!

JoeBenson

make that 16

2323

Well, now thats twice this year the T-Wolves have beat the Lakers. Lakers have no answer for KG!

KingCobra

Lakers lose!

Hondo

I am not so much of a Laker fan...but not only will they make the playoffs they will win the Championship.



Thanks


Josh

KOBEcollector

" I think Kobe & Shaq should hire Garnett to teach them how to respect they're teammates and how to talk to the media so they do not do any more harm to they're team. KG#1 !!!!!! "

wasn't it Garnett who had the much publicized blowup with Szczerbiak that was plastered all over the media ?

Lakers need to shake things up. I'd like to see them sign Horace Grant because even at his age he's twice as good as Samaki.

2323

I think Kobe & Shaq should hire Garnett to teach them how to respect they're teammates and how to talk to the media so they do not do any more harm to they're team. KG#1 !!!!!! >>


No, Umm, I think that was someone else.


But the point I'm trying to make is last year all we heard is, Lakers this, Lakers that, Kobe-Kobe-Kobe!

Well, now nobody has anything to say anymore. It's like we didn't even have 10,000 Kobe butt-kissers here last year. Where did they all go? Did they all disappear? Have they moved out of the country? Have they all joined a cult that doesn't allow them to use computers so they don't even KNOW that I am on here saying this and that about the Lakers? Make the playoffs, maybe. Win the Finals, please-don't make me laugh!

KOBEcollector

lol my bad your right it was joe smith who had the beef with Wally

If the Lakers can make the Playoffs that means that they would've played very good to finish up the year which means once in the Playoffs with momentum they would have just as good a chance as any

2323

No, you're right, it's KG that has the beef with Wally, but that's a non-factor now. I'm just gonna come right out and say whats on my mind, and everybody can bash me and have a good laugh at my expense. Here it is.

I really and truly think that when it is all said and done, Kevin Garnett will be thought of as a better all around basketball player than Kobe bryant. He's a leader, he can win with basically no other talent on the team, and he comes out to compete every night.

Kobe has Shaq, two of the best players in the NBA, and they are not even getting it done. They're too busy whining about this teammate and that teammate. Garnett comes out, does his job, and most of the time keeps his mouth shut. O.K., now everybody let me have it!

JoeBenson

There both great players and it's hard to say.......But KG don't have what it takes to put up 40 and 50 point game's like Kobe..........But right now KG IS playing better than Kobe!!! Kobe needs to take charge and shoot the damn ball!!!!!! He shouldnt worry about trying to get a couple more assists and rebounds every night, he should just do what he is good at---Scoring....

KOBEcollector

KG is an awesome player and at 7"1 he's the most versatile player in the game but the problem that many people say about KG is that in the past playoff years he has rarely stepped up in 4th quarters in close games and has been reluctant to shoot the ball late in those games

KOBEcollector

JB i agree what you say about Kobe but i have a strong feeling he's just following Phil's orders

JoeBenson

yep, thats probably a good possibility Phil is trying to spread it out, but if thats the case then he needs to go back to what he was doing the past 3 years!! He is making Kobe look worse than he really is, Kobe has way more potential than he has showed as of late.....He should be the kinda player like Mike, and putting up 40's and 50's more often.....Phil needs to let the man play!

KOBEcollector

lol I just read an article where Phil said kobe was lackluster in the 1st half. I agree, Kobe needs to take the ball and forget about setting up his teamates ( besides shaq ) because no one else is scoring. Just like in the Dallas game in the 4th, Kobe went off but was still able to find guys like shaw when he needed to

Undertaker

<< <i>LOL, Lakers put in the scrubs, and T-Wolves didn't....But Lakers Srubs narrowed the gap from 22 to 18 so far, LOL.....Kobe 13 Points? He needs to step up!! Instead of trying so ahrd to get a few rebounds and assists! >>



blablablaaaaa, who beat your Magic?

on the other hand, I admit the Lakers are playing even worse than when they were under Del Harris, but the season still is long.. if they don't win a title this year, they will realise that they really need a 3rd player who can score & rebound, someone who can do that every night, not like the role players who only come through when the whole team is playing good

KingCobra

2323, I disagree with you on Kevin Garnett, I think if anything he'll join Chris Webber, Ray Allen and Allen Iverson as one of the most overrated players of our time...in 40 years, collectors will look back at his big numbers, and go, "so why have I never heard of him?"

Almost all the scouts agree that Garnett's skills have definitely plateaued, and he still hasn't developed that consistent inside game or led his team to any significant wins. I realize he doesn't have the help that others do, but at some point the excuses do get old.

JoeBenson

Undertaker, they each beat each other once....But in the Lakers win, the game wasn't over at halftime, it was like an 8 point game and only because somebody hit a 3 at the end (Derek Fisher I believe), not to mention 2nd high scorer on Magic at halftime was 6 points!!! If McGrady would have played the second half, it would have been much closer!

2323

Kingcobra- I have to dissagree, Garnett's contract is almost up, and he has told the wolves that he would take considerably less money if they would put some talent around him. If he gets one other good player around him it's on. Imagine him with someone good. O.K. this will never happen, but just picture this scenario.

Kobe and Shaq are on the same team right? Think of how dominate the Lakers would be if it were Garnett & Shaq. Unbeatable! There wouldn't even be anybody who could score a point against them,(except Jordan), because they would just swat it down.

Garnett & Duncan sounds good. Garnett & nowitzky sounds good. Garnett & webber would work too. When he gets someone, it's on.

And when it's all said and done he is going to be the all time rebound leader. and add to that a 20 ppg average. He will not be the next Chris webber!

Garnett & Iverson works for me too.

KingCobra

If Garnett thinks Wally shoots too much, just imagine him playing with Iverson

2323

hehe! that would be funny!

JoeBenson

<< <i>Kingcobra- I have to dissagree, Garnett's contract is almost up, and he has told the wolves that he would take considerably less money if they would put some talent around him. If he gets one other good player around him it's on. Imagine him with someone good. O.K. this will never happen, but just picture this scenario.

Kobe and Shaq are on the same team right? Think of how dominate the Lakers would be if it were Garnett & Shaq. Unbeatable! There wouldn't even be anybody who could score a point against them,(except Jordan), because they would just swat it down.

Garnett & Duncan sounds good. Garnett & nowitzky sounds good. Garnett & webber would work too. When he gets someone, it's on.

And when it's all said and done he is going to be the all time rebound leader. and add to that a 20 ppg average. He will not be the next Chris webber!

Garnett & Iverson works for me too. >>



Still wouldnt make the Lakers unbeatable! They will be missing a much needed guy who can pile on points (Kobe)...Garnett can't do that! Shaq can put up a solid amount every night, but never put up 40's and 50's like Kobe or T-Mac or Iverson could! But Garnett on the Magic and you have a dynasty, Magic suck underneath, and Garnett would be the much needed aggressive big man they need who would Block Shots And Rebound! But most of those scenarios you put him with don't really wouldn't amount to much! Face it, Terrell Brandon is a solid player, and even with him not playing you have Troy Hudson who is probably the teams leading scorer!!! Not to mention Wally when he comes back (an all-star last year), and back in the day when he had Marbury (another good player).........I mean, the talent around him is good, the way you are talking he just needs another superstar! But still it wouldnt amount to a ring! Why are Webber and Nowitzki overrated? ANSWER--->Look at the team's surrounding them, they need all that help and still dont look unbeatable! But Garnett and Duncan would be pretty decent, they would go along way (eh ehm, Western Conference Finals), But that would be it....

Cyphilissb

Garnett is an amazing player, probably the second best PF in the league (duncan), what seperates him from players like webber is that he would be one of the top few centers in the league or he would be one of the top 10 sf's in the league if that were his position. Webber can only play PF. Iverson is an unstopable scorer so i don't know how you can down him, and ray allen is a solid player on a solid team but with nothing outstanding happening to remember him by.

As far as the Lakers go, they will make the playoffs, im not sure why everyone is getting so excited. They are 10-16 right, now what makes it so unlikely for them to come out and win 20 out of 30? then they are 30-31 and in the playoff picture again. That pace will lead to a 44-38 record, and they are in (most likely). I don't see what the fuss is about. Until there many more games played Im not worried.

JoeBenson

Don't listen to people with STD's! It's a Laker thing though But they definately have to get there act together asap if they wanna be part of the postseason! Because msot of the teams they beat so far were garbage, EX: Grizzlies TWICE, plus more

Cyphilissb

If i had an STD my name would be Syphillis SB

KingCobra

Cyphillis, calling Iverson an "unstoppable" scorer is like calling Rob Deer an unstoppable home run hitter...sure, he could do plenty of it, but it doesn't make him a great or even particularly good player. Allen is a decent scorer and little more who vanishes at crunch time, and Garnett, for all his versatility, still has no discernable post up game and doesn't want the ball bad enough in crunch time.

2323

Next time Garnett playes the Lakers, he's gonna jump over shaq and dunk on Kobe all in the same play.

KingCobra

The Lakers are the one team I will root for the Timberwolves to crush

NikeBasketball

I hate to say it but the Lakers will probably squeak into the playoffs by the skin of thier teeth.I dont like their chances at a 4-peat at all though.And personally think the Kings will serve them up a nice slice of humble pie come X-mas day.(Cant wait).Kobes fourth quarter heroics can be summed up easily,He's just maintaining his stats.He can struggle all game long and not give a hoot but come the 4th and he realizes his stats are in jeopardy he turns it on.

And I cant say I blame the 'role players' for not being energized by their arse chewings.Face it I know they're role players,they konw it,you know it and the whole world knows it.But how many times do you have to publicly ram that fact down their throat.Why not say our "team mates" are'nt performing well. How inspired would you be to work if you were constantly being labeled as an un-important part of the team.Blame should be divided equally with everyone taking a bite.Just like they all get rings when they win.They should all feel the heat when they lose.

Cyphilissb

About Iverson: Considering that two years ago he won the MVP, and he has led the league in Scoring 4 times, i would say no one has been able to stop him. So if there is someone out there in the NBA that has such an easy time stopping Iverson, then that players team should have that man guard them because no one else can do it.

About Garnett: Name 10 Players you rather have on your team than Kevin Garnett, if you can't do it that means you think he is one of the top 10 players in the league. I know that he is in my top ten for sure.

KingCobra

You're asking me to defend two arguments that I never made. First of all, I never said Iverson isn't a great scorer, I said he isn't a great or complete player. And his MVP award was a joke.

As far as Garnett, again, I never said he wasn't among the top ten players in the league. However, he's in the bottom half, as I'd take

Shaq
Kobe
Nowitzki
Duncan
Kidd
Pierce
Francis
Ming
McGrady

Over him. So that's nine guys, with Garnett taking the ten spot along with guys like Webber, Payton and Nash.

Cyphilissb

yes, and all i said was that Iverson is "an unstopable scorer" i never said anything about his overall game, although he did lead the league in steals last year. All i said about garnett is that he is one of the top players in the league. I never said anything about crunch time (garnett), or Complete player (iverson).

KingCobra

You were clearly disputing the point I made earlier on this post about Iverson and Garnett being among those players that were overrated. That's what this whole discussion has been about. I think sportswriters and coaches are catching up to both players, and no longer just automatically consider them to be two of the best in the league.

Also, Webber can play C, he did in Golden State (and did it quite well) and in Washington as well.

Cyphilissb

I went back and Re-Read my posts, i think ive been consistent, but back to the point. Naturally disputing wether or not a player is overrated depends on who's ratings your going by. Unless my perception of the general concensus is scewed, then Iverson is "A great scorer, with lighting quick moves. He also plays good defense, and plays with more heart than most of the other players in the league." Again if my perception is correct I think most people would say about garnett "Plays with tremendous heart, he is an outstanding defender, very consistent on offense and is very versitile." With that being the general concensus of how these players are "rated" then i don't see how you can call them overrated because i find these statements to be true.

KingCobra

I certainly wouldn't call Iveron a great defender, he takes a ton of chances which leads to flashy steals totals but also plenty of easy layups or fouls on his frontcourt players.

I agree with your estimation of Garnett, but for years he was considered to be just an absurdly good player, without question one of the top 5 an NBA GM would start a team with, and he has definitely fallen from that perch now.

Cyphilissb

No i wouldn't call Iverson a "great" defender, just a good defender. I don't think he has been on any All NBA Defense teams, but he is capable of guarding just about any player in the league (under 6'2").

two years ago Garnett was probably the third or fourth best player in the league according to most peoples opinions - Shaq, Duncan, Garnett, Carter. Maybe second if you didn't like Duncan or Carter. Now he is probably 7th or 8th - Shaq, Kobe/Mccgrady, Duncan, Kidd/Iverson, whoever im forgetting (nowitzki?), garnett. So i don't think he has fallen that far. Put it this way, Kevin Garnett is a player capable of making ANY team a 50 game winner BY HIMSELF. I would say that makes him still pretty high up there.

KingCobra

See my list above - Garnett is number 10 at best, and I am not counting Iverson as a better player than Garnett (no GM in the league would take Iverson over Garnett).

2323

Garnett is consistent. He's going to come to play every night, he's never hurt, and he's going to give you 20 points and 14 rebounds and a few assists. And he does that every night. Get him a player who can score 25-35 points a night and who's gonna stop the T-Wolves?

Cyphilissb

a player who scored 25+ points a night would probably be one of the best players in the league. Pair any two of the best players in the league and whos gonna stop them? (see shaq and kobe). One reason gm's wouldnt take iverson over garnett is that garnett doesn't have the off the court troubles. Also Garnett is a big man, Gm's love big men. But i think iverson is just as good of a player as garnett, however i also agree not many gm's (1-5) would take iverson over garnett.

2323

Yeah, Garnett's got a very boring personal life. GM's do love that. You're not going to see Garnett running around minneapolis car jacking people and knocking off conveinience stores. And as far as I know he's never made a rap C.D. saying he hated this and that. Here in Minnesota everybody loves him. Nobody ever talks about his contract anymore, at least not here. Iverson can score an insane amount of points, but he's never going to be a fan favorite because of his offcourt antics.

Cyphilissb

I wouldnt say Iverson will never be a fan favorite. Philly loves the little guy to death. they just like to practice their tough love philosophy every now and then. Besides Minnesota already has Randy Moss he already did (or is planning to do) all the stuff you just mentioned in that area. None of it is original any more.

KingCobra

2323, unfortuneately because of Iverson's off court antics, he is a fan favorite many times, at least among the little thugs and criminals in training.

And it's a little oversimplistic to say "Give Garnett a guy who can score 25-35 a game and they'll be unstoppable." LOL that's true of most any NBA star, imagine Duncan with a guy like that.

2323

Yeah, but other guys get hurt, Garnett is never hurt! Therefore they would keep winning. Look what happened to the Lakers this year when Shaq got hurt. They dug themselves a big hole. Kobe couldn't do it himself, but everybody loves him. Garnett is doing it by himself, and nobody ever wants to talk about that.

And as far as Minnesota having Randy Moss as a fan Favorite, guess again! I don't hear too many people here saying anything good about him. Exactly the opposite!