Who's the one buying up all the "MS60's" of the world?

braddick

It's pretty much agreed that the AU58 grade, a coin that is generally NICE, save for a touch of wear, is a better coin than an MS60. I agree. I'd much rather own a "MS64+/rub" AU58 than a banged up MS60.
Now, that being the case, and knowing the coin market is driven by demand, why don't AU58's command more money than the 60's overall?

sinin1

I used to agree with that thought - AU58 is usally better than MS60's - until I started buying some from internet auctions.

The ones I got were MS60's maybe 61's with a little rub - somewhat ugly - I agree with you on MS65+a little rub coin (so AU58) is probably better than MS62/3 but they seem to be priced that way as well.

braddick

If the seller was being accurate he would probably have graded out those MS60's with rub as AU50's, not AU58's.

MadMarty

Where are all the MS60s in the world???

Easy, in AGC MS65 holders....

sinin1

They were PCGS and NGC slabs - which brings up a interesting question - what is an AU58? Is it any coin with a very slight circulation rub - even if it would have been MS60-MS68?

crito

tell me this MS60 isn't pretty! so it's got a little damage from a rolling machine. doesn't bother me at all. not even a trace of wear.

kranky

I agree that AU58s will generally look far nicer than MS60s. Logically, the 58s should actually grade higher than the 60s - because the "63 with rub" (or 64), when weighing all the grading factors, comes out ahead.

But since grading has always been about wear first and foremost, the lack of wear on the 60 wins out. They can't change that, so they started grading the "63 with rub" as a 61 or 62 so market grading can work. Just my opinion.

bohica268

crito, that's a very nice looking Type X.

crito

just wanted to add I think PCGS under utilizes the MS60 grade. Just check the pop reports. They'd likely have given this coin an AU58, despite it having no wear at all. Everyone brings up the rainbow 63's with rub, and they do exist. But there are probably just as many blazer 58's with no rub and minor damage out there. The problem with "market" grading is that the coin market is fickle. changing the standard to suit it just creates a situation where you can never be sure if the grade on your coin today will be relevant tomorrow. heck, doesn't sound like most people even trust it to tell them if the coin is uncirculated or not.

kranky

<< <i>The problem with "market" grading is that the coin market is fickle. changing the standard to suit it just creates a situation where you can never be sure if the grade on your coin today will be relevant tomorrow. heck, doesn't sound like most people even trust it to tell them if the coin is uncirculated or not. >>



And that's a serious problem. Market grading is based on today's preferences (e.g. a little bit of wear hurts the grade a lot more than superior eye appeal, luster, and lack of surface marks) and it could change tomorrow. Thus, AU58s are nicer coins than MS60s for the most part today. It still comes down to the fact that wear, or lack of it, is the overriding consideration in grading coins even though market grading would have it be otherwise. Market grading wants the prices to rise in correlation to the grade, which is why some 63+rub (technical 58) coins get into 61 or 62 holders, because they will sell for a 61 or 62 price.

shirohniichan

I have a coin in an ANACS MS-60 holder that I think would probably go to either AU-58 or MS-62 in a PCGS holder. It has decent luster, a good strike, and overall looks like an MS-63. Strat looked at it with a loupe and said, "I dunno. It looks like it has a little rub. Maybe it's a slider." If great looking AU-58's are no MS-62's, mine should regrade MS-62. Of course, if I crack it out and send it in, it'll come back in a body bag for altered surfaces, tooling, suspicious toning, or something else that doesn't apply.

mr1931S

MS68 except for a little rub? Interesting question...

The coin,technically, cannot be called an MS60...

Mr1874's groups to classify uncirculated and almost uncirculated coins using the language of numismatics .*(s) -see footnotes:

1.gem
2.choice
3.strictly
4.commercial one*
5.commercial two**
6.commercial three***
7.commercial four****
8.commercial five*****
9.commercial six******




*"commercial one" is a coin that,when it was freshly minted and if preserved,would have qualified as an "MS68" under the old system of grading.The simple,single term "commercial one" could be used to describe such a coin as long as it is clearly understood by all that the describing words,
"commercial one," when used to grade classify a coin,does not allow for the coin to have been deemed,when freshly minted (historical), none other than an "MS68" under the old system. A "commercial one" coin does show evidence of "wear," "rub," or having been handled notwithstanding its assessment of having once been,when it was freshy minted (historical),
an "MS68."

**historical,"MS67."
***historical,"MS66."
****historical,"MS65", a minimal historical "gem" coin.
*****historical,"MS63 or MS64, a historical "choice" coin.
******historical,"MS60,"or "MS61," or "MS62," a historical "strictly" uncirculated coin.

jtryka

I just took this MS-60 off the market: 1915

09sVDB

Some time ago I posted a thread on this subject. I for one think most MS60 coins are ugly and some AU58's should be worth more than a MS60 coin.

Geoman

I am guessing that larger companies such as Littleton, Coast to Coast, Home Shopping Network, buys them up, and sells them at MS63's.