Good News, Bad News.

braddick · September 18, 2002 5:02AM

Well, the good news- I won (and posted here, I was so proud!) an NGC MS66 1965 Kennedy (regular issue) off of eBay with a quick BIN of $20.00. More good news, the coin arrived safe and sound. The Seller did his job.
Now, the bad news (can you guess?):

-------------------------> Sure enough. It's an SMS, not a business strike. I was suspicious NGC wouldn't get this one right (as SMS's probably out number MS coins 1,000+ to one in grades of MS66).

nwcs · September 18, 2002 5:04AM

It's MS-63? Color not what was photographed? The IRS is after you?

DHeath · September 18, 2002 5:04AM

Tough break Pat, but at least you knew what to look for. Wanna trade a 1971 ICG PR69 Cam for it?

petertdavis · September 18, 2002 5:04AM

What's NGC policy when they've made a booboo?

Not that it's a big loss, though disapointing.

braddick · September 18, 2002 5:09AM

<< <i>What's NGC policy when they've made a booboo? Not that it's a big loss, though disapointing. >>

Just like PCGS's: To tell you, "No- we stand by our findings, it's NOT an SMS".

gmarguli · September 18, 2002 5:13AM

Show it to NGC at Long Beach. They'll probably give you the $20 out of their pocket.

keithdagen · September 18, 2002 5:17AM

What gave it away to you?

Even Rick's answer to the question posed in the Q&A didn't really answer how they figure it out.

braddick · September 18, 2002 5:19AM

<< <i>Show it to NGC at Long Beach. They'll probably give you the $20 out of their pocket. >>

I agree, they are pretty good people. I still remember how wonderfully David Lange was with me and my wife looking over a small grouping of Ike dollars a couple of LB shows ago. I wasn't even aware of who he was until I saw his name on his glass.

I'll be keeping this one though. For a twenty spot, I like the light, gold rim toning.

coinhead1 · September 18, 2002 5:20AM

Be interested in that myself, how to tell?

braddick · September 18, 2002 5:36AM

<< <i>Be interested in that myself, how to tell? >>

It takes a strong glass (and a bit of patience, having looked at hundreds):
The fields will be glassy (on the SMS), not glossy and there will be NO "roughness" to the devices, unlike the SMS, the MS will not curve up (deep dish appearance) from the rim to the edge. The SMS's have a 'wetter' look.
The rim is not as "squared off" as the MS on the SMS.
Another indicator (although not conclusive on its own) is the strike. Check the lower shield area up against the tail feathers. Very few MS 1965 have strong definition here although almost all (99%) of the SMS's do.
Also the type of surface marks is one indication. Ticks and bag marks are more in line with MS coins while the SMS usually don't suffer those but will have slide or scuff marks (shallow vs deep).

Admittingy, the 1965 is the toughest of the three to spot. That's why I don't go too hard on the Grading Services for getting it wrong. Usually though I see PCGS erring on the side of calling it an SMS when it fact it might be a business strike (I own one of those too).