Endroll or Bag Tone on this Morgan?

Dog97

The black inverted "V" asross the side of Liberty's head? I know endroll is usually a square pattern. What caused this unusual pattern?

agentjim007

I say "Bag". I'm using the 1881-CC below as a template for bag toning since I know this one for a fact came out of a bag. Your coin follows similiar color patterns.

RotatedRainbows

With the way the color follows no distinct pattern (just a few patches here and there) I would say it is definitely end of roll. With a number of spots of purple it follows the pattern of standard end of roll toning.

gmarguli

I don't think it is bag toned. I would guess it was laying on something that caused the toning.

agentjim007

I see a pattern of reds to yellows to greens to orange. If paper sulfur reacts the same as bag sulfur the it could be either.

TheNumish

My vote is an end of the roll coin.

Bear

Well dog you have your concensus. Four replys and at least 3.5 opinions. Take your pick Bear

rkfish

look like "end of the roll" toning to me.

Dog97

Here's a pict rather than a scan, maybe this will help.

agentjim007

Hellava nice coin, I still say bag. If it were roll end, the toning would be more uniform around the edge from paper roll contact. It looks alot like the one you just bought from Alphacoin ( I was a bidder also), minus the textile and that one is obviously bag.

TheNumish

After looking at photo I change my vote from bag to I can't tell.

Again I agree with Agentjim--helluva coin!!!!

Dog97

Hey thanks Jim & Numish ! I look at it 1 way and see the black lines as roll paper that was folded triangular rather than folded square. I look at it another way and see the black lines as being where the bag was folded and touching or nearly touching it. I look at it again and say it's neither bag nor roll but something else. It baffles my mind.

agentjim007

Numish your vote was roll end

agentjim007

Dog, is this the maddness you keep talking about? You guys are focusing too much on what appears to be fold lines. look at the circumference how could it tone dark purple the light blue the dark then light if was being touched by a paper roll. Most roll coins are uniform around the circumference. Am I seeing a trace of textile between the "N" and "U" of UNUM"?

RotatedRainbows

After looking at the second photo I still say end of roll, with the patches of strong color by the date and across from the eye and the light blue in front of the chin (just below the dark line) it looks like classic end of roll toning to me.

jhar

I say End-Roll Toning, but what the heck do I know!!!!

tjkillian

My vote would be end roll because of the straight lines that could have been caused by paper creases.

Tom

Beatlemen

All beautiful coins....

Dog97

Jim what you see by U-N is a tick. The only thing that could be textile pattern is the 3 black spots that look boogers coming out of Liberty's nose. Maybe that's where a crease in the bag was touching it. Maybe a string from the bag?
On the other hand maybe the black inverted "V" is where a paper fold was touching the check; as you can see the check was on it's way to turning black. It's darkest at the edge of the paper then turns blue & purple as it moves outward in the V shape from the check. Due to the right moisture and proximity of the paper to the coin that's why the circumference goes light-dark-light.
I do agree that it looks like an early state of my Alphacoin which is bagger for sure.

Dog97

Anybody else?

MartyF

Dog, some end rolls have the "V" as a fold on the bank wrapper, re-wraps...I'm no expert....but that seems to be the most logical reasoning....either that, or that is the mark of Zorro

Tonekiller

I would have to say end roll.....Nice coin dog.

TBT

dragon

That coin is toned.

Dragon

jamesfsm

I'd say bag toning. I like your alphacoin alot better. Did you think that each was a good value?

wallstreetman

I say under a match book with one match left!

Morganluver

It looks like end roll to me just not real well defined gometrically as if it was either loosely folded or possibly got rotated in the roll at some point.

gemtone65

The color patterns, the off-white look of the untoned areas, and the pastel nature of the toned portions are not consistent with bag toning. It is much more likely this coin was in contact with paper than with a canvas bag.

toners

:I would have to go with bag with bag fold lines over endroll, but it is a tough call for me. just not uniform enough for end roll toning.
Allen

ArtR

I also think that the tone is from contact with a paper source. As gemtone65 posted the toned portions are not consistent with bag toning. I have seen some rolls that were put together with a cutout disc of paper placed over the top and bottom coins then the roll paper was folded over. This will at times result in the type tone that appears on this coin.

jhar

Dog what vam number would the "booger" variety be???

Dog97

<< <i>some rolls that were put together with a cutout disc of paper placed over the top and bottom coins then the roll paper was folded over. This will at times result in the type tone that appears on this coin. >>



Interesting! Wonder what the purpose was behind that?

ArtR

Dog
I have no idea!

Dog97

I don't collect normal stuff. I collect weird & unusual stuff. That one's weird all right.

jamesfsm asks if they were a good value. Well jamesfsm if you ask me "value" is something real. Value is substance. As oddities & unusual coins the prices were ok but no great value.