YOU MAKE THE CALL! Just for fun this time! - Grade Posted!

jtryka

I thought I'd share my latest addition, and see what you all thought the grade might be. It is graded by PCGS, and let's see if they are as consistent or inconsistent as some of the recent threads suggest. The gouges in the knee should be reminiscent of a recently auctioned Saint! I'll post the PCGS grade later, but no prize this time.

Obverse
Reverse

Have Fun!!!

Placid

I can't decide
MS-61 or au-55.
If only one guess au-55.
Something about the uneven color makes me think au. Might just be the picture thou.

jtryka

Since there is no prize, you can just post them in the forum. If anyone cheats with this one, they are only cheating themselves!

Russ

If it's PCGS, it has to be an MS65.

Russ, NCNE

Wisconsin

I guess MS-64

TRADERBOBZ

your 1910 looks close i would say but hey gold and copper i am just having a time with

boiler78

MS 63

robertpr

MS63.

Actually, it doesn't look better than MS62 in my opinion, but for some odd reason they rarely give out 61's and 62's, so I'd say 63. Come to think of it, I don't believe I've ever seen a PCGS MS61 coin!

Rotts

How about a ms63

jtryka

robertpr, I have a 1912 Saint in a PCGS MS-61, but I have seen others, not often though. I don't recall ever seeing an NGC MS-61 Saint though. I have a 1906 Eagle in NCG MS-61, so they know the grade exists!

cacheman

60

jtryka

I am going to cook dinner, will post the grade when I am done eating, about 9:00 PST.

JJacks

I will guess the same grade as my 14-S; MS63

JJacks

darktone

MS60.

Catch22

Given PCGS's tendency to be a little lenient on gold, I'll guess 64.

66Tbird

58,,,,,just a split guess between a 55 and a 62

TWQG

62

doereme

MS63...

Bear

MS-63 on a good day

MartyF

MS-62....it is gold after all

goyankeez

I have no clue about gold coins, but just for fun.

Definitely MS, I'd say around 61-63, because of the obverse scratches and dings. MS-62 is my final answer.

P.S. As soon as I looked at the picture I had an opinion in my head. Even though I read everybody's responses this is what I honestly believe.

jtryka

Well, drumroll please, PCGS has graded this one as AU-58! So it looks like 66Tbird get the title of most accurate pseudo-PCGS grader of the day! Personally, I agree with most of you and believe this coin is undergraded and probably should be an MS-60 or MS-61. I do think it has a few too many marks for a 62 though, but hey, maybe if I resubmit with a nice bottle of wine, I might get a 63!

Trime

Well,
This is not a beautiful coin. On the other hand, it is not obvious that it has been circulated. Saints have to be pretty terrible to be an MS60-61. While it looks like it was banged more than the lady deserved, I would have guessed PCGS might have found the heart for a 62. They thought less and took pity and gave it an AU58. At least that is a dignified grade!. Enjoy!!!

Patosh

I have reservaations about PCGS as do others. I have been in your position and have sent it to either NGC or ANACS. I would have if I had been timely given it MS60

andy007

It's definitely not a MS coin IMO, the significant wear on the upper head and hair keep it from going MS-anything to me. I would have guessed AU55, but I can see AU58 with no problem.

gmarguli

I agree with andy007. The coin is clearly not MS. The wear between her breasts is obvious. I'd probably go AU55, but AU58 isn't out of the question.

jom

If the coin doesn't have wear (I can't tell by the photo) it is a 61 with all the bag marks. If it has wear then maybe the bag marks are actually circulation marks (again, I can't tell) were I'd put it at AU55. This is the kind of coin that gives nice AU58s a bad name....

jom

jtryka

Trime, I have yet to see a Saint that wasn't beautiful! Andy007, the photo may not be accurate, or you may be looking at something I am not seeing, but there is no wear on the hair, and the upper head is more a strike issue in my opinion. The only rub I see is on the chest if any. Not that I am saying this should grade MS-63, but it is by far the nicest AU graded Saint I've ever seen. The face is the key, and this coin has a nice strike as the features on the face are plainly visible, unlike many coins with weak strikes, as well as the detail on the flame of the torch, unlike this one: 1927 MS-63 (No offense to this seller, this is a nice coin, just a weak strike). Patosh, I bought this one slabbed as is, so I am not complaining in the least, a better date, nice looking coin for AU money. You won't ever see me complaining about that!

PS-Next time I might just fib on the actual grade just to see if the folks that comment after the grade are being honest, or just being victims of their own biases. i.e. if I had said it was MS-62, would these people be saying clearly this is not MS-63 material, etc, etc.

Placid

For me the change in color on the high points seemed to suggest au but pictures can fool you.
The hand on the torch I also thought looked a little flat but could be strike.
If I could judge a ms from a au 100% of the time from a picture I could pick up some great deals on eBay but I can't and doubt anyone can.

I agree that getting a coin at or near melt price for the metal can't be beat even if they are not considered "rare" in those grades they still are neat coins to me

Trime

jtryka,
Sorry, I should have known better to comment on the appearance of someone else' woman's. If she is beautiful to you, that is what counts. Whatever the pleasure she did get a bit of action in the bag.
I should make it clear that bright light scans and photos are not the correct way to confidently determine minimal wear. Some of the members of the forum may be better than I at seeing through scans but a coin in hand easily shows the wear on high points by the change in color. One of the interesting things I learned in the ANA advanced grading course was the varience in judgement on AU 58 and MS 61-2. NGC and PCGS may grade coins MS that have had "cabinet friction" while the early american copper dudes are hard pressed to find a coin without some wear.

Russ

<< <i>Whatever the pleasure she did get a bit of action in the bag. >>



Bwuahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!! Trime, I'm dying!

I don't get this. PCGS called the $7 million Saint an MS65, and this an AU coin?

Russ, NCNE

Hunt

jtryka,

I've seen a lot of PCGS MS Saints and own quite a few that look just like this AU. When I first looked at the scans I thought 62 shot 63. I couldn't tell by the scan it was AU (I don't know how anyone else did either)--if the coin is really AU, I think AU58 is right on target. That's a hell of buy and I would have grabbed that sucker too!!!

----PS-Next time I might just fib on the actual grade just to see if the folks that comment after the grade are being honest, or just being victims of their own biases. i.e. if I had said it was MS-62, would these people be saying clearly this is not MS-63 material, etc, etc.----

I agree with ya on this one, it would be a fun experiment!!!!

66Tbird

Just goes to show that I choke under presure

jtryka

66tbird, I guess it depends on what your definition of choke is, if you were trying not to be like PCGS' graders, then you definitely choked!

Trime, no offense taken, I know she's had a storied past, but that's all behind her now! Sure, I have some virgins from the late 20s, but sometimes you just need that older experienced woman. As for the rub, there is a definite rub on the chest that can be seen when holding the coin to the light at about a 140-degree angle, something you can't get from a scan.

Hunt, it was a nice bargain for the coin, and as long as it's in an AU-58 holder, it will continue to be a bargain, but to someone like me that actually collects the coins inside, it's just great. As long as PCGS wants to put borderline unc Saints from the teens in AU holders, I'll be there to buy them!