Grade this DMPL Morgan (warning large picture)

IrishMike

I wanted to post this picture of a blown up DMPL, which is in a slab to let everyone see how difficult it is to grade these puppies. We have two threads going on about a transaction involved between two board members on how a sale was transacted. Laura made an insightful comment on how the hits are magnified on a DMPL. So any one care to take the challeng on what this coin was graded. All the scratches you see are a result of a cracked slab, the coin has no scratches.Link

LanLord

Is that thing really DMPL? The field to me looks matte. Dollars are out of my radar scope but I don't see any mirror at all.

dorkkarl

does not look dmpl as pic'd, but looks 67 otherwise. this assumes appropriate luster, etc.

K S

byergo

MS67

prooflike

It has some light scuffs on the cheek and the right field, I'd go 64

prooflike

And yes, hits are magnified on DMPL's, that is why they get premium $$$ in high grades. They are not supposed to be lenient because they are a DMPL.

cacheman

Mike, I know its the scan but it makes it very difficult to ascertain whether this is a DMPL. I can take a leap of faith that it is DMPL because you said so and as evidenced by the darker field area between 3-6 o'clock but I wouldn't be able to give it more than a "64".

Eye appeal in a DMPL is paramount for me, and thus, probably explains why I don't own any. The cheek marks are too distracting for me to purchase it, while a clean-cheeked example is too spendy for me to purchase it. A sorry state to be anal and broke, I can tell you that! Scott

Placid

I would guess a 65 but thats only half of the coin.
Where is the reverse?

Gilbert

Based on THAT scan I wouldn't believe the coin is DMPL and the image is so large, that I would have to imagine what it looks like closer to its real size - in other words, the scan doesn't help me much.

Rotts

Imho a ms65.......rotts

CalGold

I think Laura's comments regarding how bag marks get magnified in DMPLs applied to contact marks in the field. The distracting marks on the coin in this thread are hits to the face. But that is an addiitonal problem on DMPLs since they usually have frosty devices, and the frost breaks can make them unattractive even if the breaks are due to light contact and are not digs. Although the same can be said for non-PL coins that have frosty devices, the contrast on PL and DMPLs makes the frost breaks stand out.

This thread illustrates how difficult it is to tell PL and DMPL qualities from scans, escpecially blow-ups. It is easier to see cameo contracst in photos taken from a distance. Also, many scans cause the fields to look gray and do not show the cameo contrast.

Dog97

As long as you say it a DMPL I say it's MS-64 tops.
That's if it's in a PCGS holder. What is it a P mint? Not many DMPLs from the 1890's but that is one of the more common models.

IrishMike

1898-O Link DMPL's are difficult to get hi resolution pictures. The red is from the camera flash making it look matte. Anyway it's a 63 in a green PCI, going to get resubmitted this weekend. I paid $23.00 for it.

dorkkarl

i'll give ya 40 bucks as is!!!

K S

IrishMike

Not for sale, it is a nice looking coin, if I can get someone to submit it to PCGS for me I will, just curious what they think, if not it's off to NGC.

Dog97

Well I was within 1 point so that puts me on par with PCGS. The blowup looks like a better coin but the slab picture makes the facial marks look really severe and I would grade it 63 tops iaw provided pict.

stman

EVP, I started a thread a short time ago regarding my grading scans.

To the effect of my looking and grading coins over maybe a 20 year period in my hand. And now these days looking at scans and all ,I've had to train my eye to scans.

The point I tried to make was after looking at so many scans to buy coins, when I get them in hand it's hard to go back to skills learned through the years. So these days you have to grade two separate ways. When the old way is tough enough.

But I see no problem with having fun with them on this board.

stman

keets

legend

not seeking sympathy. just hoping others can understand that some sellers here are self serving and hypocritical. that's what my slope reference was about. i've had no experience with you so my only judgement comes from what you post and the company you keep.

do you really think it impresses anyone when you puff and preen about all the big shows you go to and all the wonderful coins you sell? you talk about wanting to enlighten us, about wanting to share your vast knowledge on a broad range of topics. that's admirable. it's too bad it doesn't come about in your posting. what i've seen in the last few days is nothing but damage control, a little more of the self-serving. you talk as if you're a beautiful bird of paradise but you come across more like an oil soaked Exxon Valdez shorebird!! crank it up and teach us if your so hot on so many things. and you really should delete all the scans at your site cause they just aren't accurate representations of the coins!! i mean, we can't judge what we're getting from them.

al h.

Dog97

WOW!!
Humbled my his first experience with high priced DMPL Morgans keets gets his second wind and comes out swinging.........
Laura Legend, a dealer in high priced DMPL Morgans, just happens to amble into range...................
Careful keets, I hear she has a killer Figure 4 Leg Hold but the PileDriver is her favorite move and her tag team ensemble is waiting backstage........

Seriously Legend, I know where you are coming from regarding grading from scans. I would never offer any advice like hey that raw 97-S on eBay looks PL or maybe even DMPL and it's a shot 66 so bid $8,000 for it. But I can point out a great strike or offer that with all those digs on the face it won't make any higher than 63 so it's certainly not the 65 the seller says it is and it has no frost or cameo whatsoever so it's only a $100 coin to me. When it comes to luster, well, most scans look like the coin was struck on a Hershey planchet so I cant judge eye appeal to a great extent so my opinion is mostly technical.

We learn a lot from looking at eBay coins but most of them are low end junk. Feel free to post a picture of one of your nice ones here. I like discussing a nice Morgan. I don't get to see on very often unless I take a trip to the bank and look in my safe deposit box.