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Who Should Be In The Baseball Hall Of Fame, But Isn't
dalew
Posts: 491
My entry.
Melvin Harder
No man played more seasons in a Cleveland Indians’ uniform than Mel Harder. He boasted a wicked curveball which stymied Joe DiMaggio to the tune of a .180 average over the course of his career. A 223-game winner, Harder never pitched in the World Series, just missing the Tribe’s 1948 pennant. He began his career facing Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig and Babe Ruth and ended 20 years later pitching to Ted Williams, Yogi Berra and Nellie Fox.
The bespectacled right-hander from Beemer, Nebraska compiled a 223-186 won-lost record, and only Feller (266-223) was a bigger winner for the Indians.
What’s more, Harder’s 223 victories are more than the games won by 16 of the 55 starting pitchers enshrined in the Baseball Hall of Fame, including several who were more highly-publicized; Dizzy Dean (150), Sandy Koufax (165), Don Drysdale (209), Bob Lemon (207), Hal Newhouser (207) and Lefty Gomez (189).
In fact, Harder is tied for 60th place in all-time victories, and 71st in innings pitched (3,426 1/3), and only Walter Johnson and Ted Lyons pitched more years for one club.
Though Harder hurled for 20 seasons for Tribe teams that seldom were contenders, he is one of only 23 pitchers in baseball history to win 15 or more games eight times.
Played For
Cleveland Indians (1928-1947)
Managed:
Cleveland Indians (1961-1962)
Harder managed two games at the end of the 1962 season after Mel McGaha was fired. He won both games of a season-ending doubleheader, putting his career managerial record at 3-0.
Coached:
Cleveland Indians (1949-1964)
New York Mets (1965)
Chicago Cubs (1966-1967)
Cincinnati Reds (1968)
Kansas City Royals (1969)
Harder reportedly is the only man to have both a 20-year playing and coaching career in the major leagues. He spent 36 seasons in an Indian’s uniform.
Post-Season:
Never appeared in the post season as a player.
Honors:
All-Star (4): 1934-1937
Pitching Coach:
Harder was one of the first coaches to be exclusively used as a pitching coach. He is credited with transforming Bob Lemon from a mediocre outfielder into a Hall of Fame pitcher. He coached the 1954 Cleveland staff which had four twenty-game winners. Seven different hurlers won twenty games for Harder in Cleveland. He later gained credit for working wit the Mets’ and Cubs’ young pitching staffs in the 1960s. Herb Score, who won the 1955 Rookie of the Year under Harder’s guidance, said “if Mel Harder couldn’t teach you a curveball, then no one could.”
Only Bob Feller won more games for the Indians than Mel Harder, who spent 36 years with the club as a pitcher and coach. His 582 appearances and 186 losses set Cleveland records. Only Walter Johnson and Ted Lyons pitched more seasons with one club than Harder’s 20 with Cleveland. Harder pitched the first game ever in Municipal Stadium, losing 1-0 to Philadelphia’s Lefty Grove on July 31, 1932.
Nearsighted, harder wore thick glasses. Joe DiMaggio said that he gave him more trouble than just about any pitcher, wasting this fine curveball outside, then coming in tight with the fastball. Harder held DiMaggio to a .180 average against him lifetime, and struck him out three times in a 1940 game.
By today’s rules, Harder would have been the ERA leader in 1933, when he posted a 2.95 mark. But he was a .500 pitcher until 1934, when he went 20-12. He followed with a 22-11 season, but came down with bursitis in his shoulder and a sore elbow. He nevertheless won an average of 15 games a season from 1936 through 1940. He was released late in 1941, but was given another chance after having elbow surgery. Though he won 47 more games over the next six seasons, he did not regain his old form.
Harder is the only pitcher to work 10 or more All-Star innings without allowing an earned run. Through overshadowed by Carl Hubbell, he won the 1934 All-Star Game, finishing it with five shutout innings. Using today’s standards, he would have been awarded saves in the 1935 and 1937 contests.
He threw the first pitch at Municipal Stadium when it opened in 1932, and he threw the ceremonial first pitch at the last game there in 1994. In between he won 223 games and, as Cleveland’s pitching coach, helped a bevy of Cleveland hurlers learn the fine points. Four of his charges (Feller, Lemon, Wynn, Newhouser) entered the Hall of Fame. Harder missed the two prime eras of Cleveland baseball, the late teens-early twenties when a gentlemen named Tris Speaker roamed the outfield, and the late ‘40s to mid’50s bunch, that included four HOFers, as well as Garcia, Score, Doby, Rosen, Avila and Hegan.
Instead, he played in the cloudy years of the Depression and the Second World War, along with guys like Earl Averill, the Ferrell brothers, and the early Bob Feller. Melvin Leroy won 168 games in the 1930’s, reaching the apex of his personal chart in 1934 and ’35, when he won 20 and 22 games and was selected to the second through fifth All Star teams, winning the 1934 edition. Facing the NL’s best fence busters and singles men he ran up a 13-inning scoreless streak in All Star competition. Feller began his ascent in ’38 and was the dominant AL moundsman from ’39 until he went in the service from ‘42-45, but Harder already in his early 30s, still won 17, 15 and 12 from ’38-40, and had two more double digit win years during the War.
Had he played on a winning team, or in a large city he would be better known. His 223 wins are the second most by any Cleveland pitcher (Feller’s 266 is tops) and Harder’s 223 is one of the highest numbers of any non-HOFer, and higher than many who are in). A low ball pitcher he averaged about 3 strikeouts or walks per nine innings and yielded only 161 homers in 20 years; he kept the ball in play and usually on the ground. He pitched in the hard-hitting ‘30s (the American League’s composite average was .288 in 1930 and the collective ERA was 4.65) and Harder’s 1933 ERA of 2.95 was the AL’s lowest, so his lifetime 3.80 ERA doesn’t mean the same as a pitcher from the Mathewson/Johnson era, or the Gibson/Koufax epoch. He was the kind of guy we look back and say, “Now there was a pitcher. Every year you knew he was going to be on the Indians, would have a decent to good year would probably be injury-free, just give him the ball and let him go.” Both as pitching coach and pitcher he was said to have “a camera in his head,” so adapt was he at picking up mechanical flaws and pitching flubs.
July 31, 1932: Cleveland plays its first game in new Municipal Stadium before a crowd in excess of 80,000 (paid attendance of 76,979), but Harder loses to the A’s Lefty Grove 1-0 on Cochrane’s RBI single.
It happened seven decades ago, on July 31, 1932, but Mel Harder still vividly remembers the two pitches that cost him the game he considers to have been “the biggest thrill of my baseball career.”
Bot were fast balls, the first to Max Bishop, the second to Mickey Cochrane, and both were made in the eighth inning of a game against the Philadelphia Athletics.
It was the first game ever played in the newly-completed Cleveland Municipal Stadium, and 80, 284 fans were on hand to see Harder, a 21-year old pitcher then in his third full season with the Indians, duel Lefty Grove, the Athletics’ ace.
Harder walked Bishop, leading off the eighth inning, on a 3-and-2 count.
“I thought it was a strike,” said Harder, “but Bishop had a reputation for having a good eye and the umpire- funny, I don’t remember who he was – gave Bishop the benefit of the doubt and called it ball four.”
The next batter, Mule Haas, sacrificed Bishop to second, and Cochrane singled for the only run of the game.
“It also was a fast ball that Cochrane hit,” said Harder. “It was inside, a pretty good pitch, but he got a hit so it couldn’t have been real good.”
“Cochrane hit the ball just to the left of the mound. I just missed it by about six inches. It went between our second baseman, Bill Cissell, and the bag. Cissell came close, but he missed it and the run scored.”
It was the only run of the game as Grove, who was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1947, shut out the Indians, 1-0.
“I wasn’t supposed to pitch that day, Wes Ferrell was,” said Harder. “But when Ferrell came to the park he said his arm was stiff so Peck (Manager Roger Peckinpaugh) tole me I would start.”
“It was a thrill, the biggest thrill of my baseball career to pitch in front of all those people in the first game in the Stadium. I would’ve liked to win, but I wan’t any more disappointed than any game I lost.”
“There weren’t any fences at the Stadium then and you had to hit a ball pretty good to get one over an outfielder’s head. Batter would hit a ball real hard and it would go deep, but usually it was just an out.”
“If an outfielder tried to cut off a ball hit in the gap and it got by him, it was a triple, maybe even an inside-the-park homer.”
The rest of the Indians’ lineup that day: Luke Sewell was Harder’s catcher, Eddie Morgan, first base; Cissell, second; Johnny Burnett, shortstop; Willie Karnm, third base; Joe Vosmik, left field, Earl Averill, center; and dick Porter, right.
Only two of the 50 players on those two teams are still alive. Harder and pitcher teammate Willis Hudlin. It’s also interesting to note that, in addition to Grove, three other Philadelphia players Harder faced in that inaugural game – Cochrane, Jimmie Foxx and Al Simmons, as well as Athletics owner/manager Connie Mack – are in the Hall of Fame.
Mack, a.k.a. “The Tall Tactician,” managed the A’s for 50 years from the time they entered the American League as a charter member in 1901 through 1950, led them to nine pennants, and was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1937. Cochrane entered with Grove in 1947, and Foxx in 1951.
May 16, 1933: Washington and Cleveland break a major-league record by using 11 pitchers in a 12-inning game won by the Senators 11-10. General Crowder is the eventual winner over Mel Harder. Washington’s Cecil Travis plays his first ML game and gets five hits.
June 18, 1933: Indians pitchers Oral Hildebrand and Mel Harder both toss shutouts against Boston to win 7-0 and 4-0.
July 10, 1934: The second annual All-Star Game produces Carl Hubbell’s amazing feat of striking out five future Hall of Famers in a row. Off to a shaky start with two on base in the first inning, Hubbell uses his screwball to fan Ruth, Gehrig, and Foxx. He adds Al Simmons and Joe Cronin to start the second. After three scoreless innings he leaves with the NL ahead 4-0. The AL rallies, scoring nine runs off Warneke, Mungo, and Dean, while Mel Harder pitches five shutout inning in relief of Red Ruffing to hold the lead. Frisch and Medwick hit HRs. Earl Averill’s three RBI are decisive for the AL 9-7 victory.
June 23, 1935: The league leading yanks (37-22) lose their 3rd in a row, dropping a 6-5 decision to the 2nd-place Indians. Rolfe’s error in the 8th allows the Tribe to tie and Lefty Gomez looses two wild pitches in a row in the 9th to allow Joe Vosmik to get to 3B. Ab Wright’s single brings home the winner. Mel harder, in relief in the 9th, wins his 11th.
July 31, 1935: Two AL pitchers each hit two HRs in a game. Wes Ferrell clouts a couple against Buck Newsom of the Browns and knocks in four runs in a 6-4 win for Boston. Mel Harder hits two for Cleveland but loses 6-4 to the White Sox. No other hurlers will hit 2 HRs this season.
July 31, 1936: Led by Lou Gehrig, who clouts his 33rd homer, the Yankees down the Indians, 11-7, at League Park. The loss snaps the Tribe’s five-game win streak, and leaves the Yankees eight ½ games ahead of Cleveland. Gehrig and Red Rolfe clout homes in the 5th to chase Mel Harder, but the Indians answer with three doubles by Earl Averill and a homer by Hal Trosky. Hadley, with relief from Johnny Murphy, hangs on for his 9th win
June 12, 1940: The fist place Red Sox club veteran Indian’s Pitcher Mel Harder for a 9-5 win, handing the Tribe their eighth loss in 13 games. Cleveland’s Ossie Vitt, in lifting Harder, snarls, “It’s about time you won one, the money you’re making.” The criticism, plus the same type of remarks made earlier about Feller, will prompt Harder to request a meeting with Cleveland owner Alva Bradley tomorrow morning in Cleveland.
One of the more bizarre episodes in Cleveland baseball history occurred in 1940. That season the Indians battled the Detroit Tigers and New York Yankees for the pennant. On July 31, the Tigers and Tribe were tied atop the standings. On August 21, Cleveland was 5 ½ games ahead of Detroit and the Yankees were in fourth place, nine games back. On September 1, Detroit had narrowed the lead to 2 ½ games and the Yanks were 4 ½ back. On the 7th, Detroit caught Cleveland and on the 9th they passed them as the Indians lost for the seventh time in eight games. At one point the Yankees crept within a half-game of the lead. As their lead dwindled, the Indians’ clubhouse was in disarray. Manager Ossie Vitt openly challenged the courage of his team, including Mel Harder. In one contest, Harder was removed after giving up several runs early. As Vitt took the ball from his pitcher, he complained that Harder wasn’t earning his money. Harder and Vitt exchanged verbal insults and the next day the veteran right-hander was in the front office complaining to team management that Vitt had lost control of the team. The Indians regrouped to win 13 of their last 20 games, even retaking first place for a few days. But a loss to Detroit on the last Friday of the season clinched the flag for the Bengals and ended the hopes for what became known as the “Cry Baby Indians.” Vitt was fired and never managed again.
Paris feel to the Germans in World Warr II on June 13, 1940, but the next morning the Cleveland Plain Dealer featured another story on Page One: The Indians rebellion against Manager Oscar Vitt.
It cost them the 1940 pennant, and earned a nickname they came to despise: “Cleveland Cry Babies.”
Vitt had lost the respect of the players, who felt the rebellion was necessary to keep their pennant hopes alive, Mel Harder said in a story published 24 years later.
According to Harder, “It was the way Vitt operated. He would pat you on the back one minute and criticize you behind your back the next. He was two-faced (and) and it finally got to some of the players.
“We had a good ball club – Bob Feller, Hal Trosky, Jeff Heath, Lou Boudreau, Ken Keltner and a lot more – and they thought we had a good chance to win the pennant. But they didn’t feel we could do it with Vitt managing.”
Though Trosky was called the “ring-leader” by Franklin Lewis in his 1949 history of the Indians, he didn’t attend the meeting in owner Alva Bradley’s office asking that Vitt be fired. Trosky’s mother had died and he’d gone home to Norway, Ia.
Others who also missed the meeting were Boudreau and Ray mack, who’d recently been called up from the minors; Roy (Beau) Bell, because he’d just been acquired in trade; and “one or two others, notably Roy Weatherly, (who) backed away from participation,” according to Lewis. “You’re either with us or against us,” Weatherly was told by his teammates, to which he reportedly told them, “Just count me out.”
Bradley listened to the complaints of the players, but took no action, other than to admonish the players. After the story of the rebellion got out, Bradley convinced the players to sign a statement in which they backed off from their request to get Vitt fired.
When the season ended, Bradley admitted he was wrong in not taking immediate action against Vitt. “We should have won the pennant… our real trouble started when a group of ten players came to my office (and) made four distinct charges against (Vitt) and asked for his dismissal,” Bradley wrote in a memo to the team’s directors.
Bradley’s memo, published in the Cleveland News in 1951, also said: “The four charges made against Vitt, on investigation I have made, were 100 per cent correct.”
Significant, too, was what Bradley told the players in their meeting with him: “If this story ever gets out, you’ll be ridiculed the rest of your life.” They certainly were the rest of that season.
On September 19, upon arriving by train in Detroit for a series with first place at stake, the Indians were greeted by 5,000 Tiger fans, many of them pushing baby carriages and shouting “Cry Babies!”
Exactly one week later the Tigers came to Cleveland for the final three games of the season. They trailed by two and needed to seep the series to win the pennant.
But they didn’t’ a rookie named Floyd Giebell beat Bob Feller, 2-0, on a home run by Rudy York in the openeder of the three-game series and it was all over.
Nine days after the season ended, Bradley fired Vitt, who never managed again.
August 26, 1940: Bob Feller rescues Mel Harder in the 7th and the Indians top the Senators, 4-3. Hal Trosky’s two-run homer off Dutch Leonard is the big blow for the Tribe. Cleveland leads the idle Tigers by three games.
May 10, 1944: Mel harder wins his 200th career game as Cleveland defeats the Red Sox 5-4. He is the 50th to reach this mark.
May 20, 1944: Mel Harder of the Indians and Paul Derringer of the Cubs both win their 201st career games. Derringer’s win comes at home, 3-2 over Boston’s Nate Andrews. At Philadelphia, Harder wins his, 5-0, allowing three hits and finishing in one hour and thirty seven minutes. Cy Young is on hand to watch the game.
May 25, 1944: On Mel Harder appreciation night in Cleveland, the Indians and Harder drop a 4-2 decision to the Senators. Mel tries harder scoring both of the Indian runs.
May 15, 1946: Mel Harder and Steve Gromek fire back to back shutouts over the A’s as Cleveland wins two, 3-0 and 5-0.
In 1961, Harder was elected by Cleveland’s baseball writers as the Indians’ “Man of the Year,” an honor that usually is won by a player.
September 30, 1962: With manager Mel McGaha fired for next season, Indians pitching coach Mel Harder guides the Tribe to a sweep of a twinbill of the Angels, winning 4-3 and 6-1. Harder, 1-0 last year, completes his managerial career at 3-0. Mel McGaha, a guard with the 1948-49 NY Knickerbockers of the BAA, didn’t play major league baseball, but will come back to manage the A’s in 1964-65.
July 22, 2001: At Cleveland, Bartolo Colon pitches the Tribe to a 6-3 win over the Tigers and pulls Cleveland within a game of Minnesota in the AL Central. Thome adds his AL-high 31st homer. Before the game, the Indians honor their Century 100, with 38 of their all-time greats on hand. Receiving the biggest applause is Rocky Colavito, Bob Feller, as well as 91-year-old great Mel Harder also receives a huge hand.
Obituary: October 20, 2002
Mel Harder, who won 223 games during a 20-year career with the Cleveland Indians and pitched against such greats as Babe Ruth and Joe DiMaggio, died Sunday. He was 93.
Harder died at his home in Chardon, about 25 miles east of Cleveland, at 3:30 a.m., according to his grandson, Dan Itschner.
Harder, who held DiMaggio hitless the day before the New York Yankees’ star started his 56-game hitting streak in 1941, was in failing health the past few years, and was hospitalized a year ago with pneumonia.
Harder appeared in four All-Star Games from 1934-37 and didn’t allow an earned run in 13 innings – a record that still stands. The right-hander won one game and saved two others.
“Mel Harder was a great pitcher,” the late Ted Williams told The Associated Press in a 2000 interview. “He had a great curveball, great control. And the thing about Mel was that everyone of his pitches did a little something. He was so tough.”
In his final years, Williams, a member of the Hall of Fame’s Veterans Committee, pushed for Harder’s induction. But Harder never made the Hall of Fame.
From 1928-47, he was one of the American League’s most consistent pitchers. Harder won 15 or more games eight times and had 20-win seasons in 1934 and 1935.
Harder was the only major leaguer to complete two separate 20-year careers – 20 as a pitcher and 22 as a coach. He coached for the Indians, Mets, Cubs, Reds and Royals before retiring in 1969.
“If Mel Harder couldn’t teach you a curveball, then no one could,” said Herb Score, the 1955 A.L. Rookie of the Year.
Harder’s No. 18 was retired by the Indians in 1990.
“Mel Harder and the Cleveland Indians are synonymous,” Indians spokesman Bob DiBiasio said. “Such a gracious gentleman who was always there for us when we came knocking on his door. It’s a sad day. We will miss Mel.”
DiMaggio, a .325 career hitter, batted just .180 against Harder. “I outguessed him all the time, I guess,” Harder recalled in a 2000 interview. “Even if I do say it, I had a pretty good curveball. But I had a natural sinker. I don’t know why, but when I threw it, boy, did it sink.”
In 2001, Harder made his last appearance at Jacobs Field when the Indians honored their 100 greatest players. Hall of Famer and former teammate Bob Feller pushed Harder to the mound in a wheelchair, where Harder received an ovation.
Afterward, other honorees such as Score, Luis Tiant, Sam McDowell, and Orel Hershiser listened to Harder’s every word.
“Babe tried to pull everything, so I kept the ball away from him,” Harder told them. “Lou Gehrig was much tougher. He would go the other way with a pitch. He’d hit my sinker to left and pull me if I pitched him tight.”
The Beemer, Nebraska native made it to the majors at age 19 in 1928 and had the longest playing career in Indians history. He pitched 3,426 innings, striking out 1,160 and had a career ERA of 3.80.
Only Feller had more wins with the Indians and only Hall of Famers Walter Johnson (Washington) and Ted Lyons (White Sox) pitched longer with one team.
Visitation will be at the Burr Funeral Home in Chardon on Thursday, Itschner said there will be a private ceremony this week.
Melvin Harder
No man played more seasons in a Cleveland Indians’ uniform than Mel Harder. He boasted a wicked curveball which stymied Joe DiMaggio to the tune of a .180 average over the course of his career. A 223-game winner, Harder never pitched in the World Series, just missing the Tribe’s 1948 pennant. He began his career facing Ty Cobb, Lou Gehrig and Babe Ruth and ended 20 years later pitching to Ted Williams, Yogi Berra and Nellie Fox.
The bespectacled right-hander from Beemer, Nebraska compiled a 223-186 won-lost record, and only Feller (266-223) was a bigger winner for the Indians.
What’s more, Harder’s 223 victories are more than the games won by 16 of the 55 starting pitchers enshrined in the Baseball Hall of Fame, including several who were more highly-publicized; Dizzy Dean (150), Sandy Koufax (165), Don Drysdale (209), Bob Lemon (207), Hal Newhouser (207) and Lefty Gomez (189).
In fact, Harder is tied for 60th place in all-time victories, and 71st in innings pitched (3,426 1/3), and only Walter Johnson and Ted Lyons pitched more years for one club.
Though Harder hurled for 20 seasons for Tribe teams that seldom were contenders, he is one of only 23 pitchers in baseball history to win 15 or more games eight times.
Played For
Cleveland Indians (1928-1947)
Managed:
Cleveland Indians (1961-1962)
Harder managed two games at the end of the 1962 season after Mel McGaha was fired. He won both games of a season-ending doubleheader, putting his career managerial record at 3-0.
Coached:
Cleveland Indians (1949-1964)
New York Mets (1965)
Chicago Cubs (1966-1967)
Cincinnati Reds (1968)
Kansas City Royals (1969)
Harder reportedly is the only man to have both a 20-year playing and coaching career in the major leagues. He spent 36 seasons in an Indian’s uniform.
Post-Season:
Never appeared in the post season as a player.
Honors:
All-Star (4): 1934-1937
Pitching Coach:
Harder was one of the first coaches to be exclusively used as a pitching coach. He is credited with transforming Bob Lemon from a mediocre outfielder into a Hall of Fame pitcher. He coached the 1954 Cleveland staff which had four twenty-game winners. Seven different hurlers won twenty games for Harder in Cleveland. He later gained credit for working wit the Mets’ and Cubs’ young pitching staffs in the 1960s. Herb Score, who won the 1955 Rookie of the Year under Harder’s guidance, said “if Mel Harder couldn’t teach you a curveball, then no one could.”
Only Bob Feller won more games for the Indians than Mel Harder, who spent 36 years with the club as a pitcher and coach. His 582 appearances and 186 losses set Cleveland records. Only Walter Johnson and Ted Lyons pitched more seasons with one club than Harder’s 20 with Cleveland. Harder pitched the first game ever in Municipal Stadium, losing 1-0 to Philadelphia’s Lefty Grove on July 31, 1932.
Nearsighted, harder wore thick glasses. Joe DiMaggio said that he gave him more trouble than just about any pitcher, wasting this fine curveball outside, then coming in tight with the fastball. Harder held DiMaggio to a .180 average against him lifetime, and struck him out three times in a 1940 game.
By today’s rules, Harder would have been the ERA leader in 1933, when he posted a 2.95 mark. But he was a .500 pitcher until 1934, when he went 20-12. He followed with a 22-11 season, but came down with bursitis in his shoulder and a sore elbow. He nevertheless won an average of 15 games a season from 1936 through 1940. He was released late in 1941, but was given another chance after having elbow surgery. Though he won 47 more games over the next six seasons, he did not regain his old form.
Harder is the only pitcher to work 10 or more All-Star innings without allowing an earned run. Through overshadowed by Carl Hubbell, he won the 1934 All-Star Game, finishing it with five shutout innings. Using today’s standards, he would have been awarded saves in the 1935 and 1937 contests.
He threw the first pitch at Municipal Stadium when it opened in 1932, and he threw the ceremonial first pitch at the last game there in 1994. In between he won 223 games and, as Cleveland’s pitching coach, helped a bevy of Cleveland hurlers learn the fine points. Four of his charges (Feller, Lemon, Wynn, Newhouser) entered the Hall of Fame. Harder missed the two prime eras of Cleveland baseball, the late teens-early twenties when a gentlemen named Tris Speaker roamed the outfield, and the late ‘40s to mid’50s bunch, that included four HOFers, as well as Garcia, Score, Doby, Rosen, Avila and Hegan.
Instead, he played in the cloudy years of the Depression and the Second World War, along with guys like Earl Averill, the Ferrell brothers, and the early Bob Feller. Melvin Leroy won 168 games in the 1930’s, reaching the apex of his personal chart in 1934 and ’35, when he won 20 and 22 games and was selected to the second through fifth All Star teams, winning the 1934 edition. Facing the NL’s best fence busters and singles men he ran up a 13-inning scoreless streak in All Star competition. Feller began his ascent in ’38 and was the dominant AL moundsman from ’39 until he went in the service from ‘42-45, but Harder already in his early 30s, still won 17, 15 and 12 from ’38-40, and had two more double digit win years during the War.
Had he played on a winning team, or in a large city he would be better known. His 223 wins are the second most by any Cleveland pitcher (Feller’s 266 is tops) and Harder’s 223 is one of the highest numbers of any non-HOFer, and higher than many who are in). A low ball pitcher he averaged about 3 strikeouts or walks per nine innings and yielded only 161 homers in 20 years; he kept the ball in play and usually on the ground. He pitched in the hard-hitting ‘30s (the American League’s composite average was .288 in 1930 and the collective ERA was 4.65) and Harder’s 1933 ERA of 2.95 was the AL’s lowest, so his lifetime 3.80 ERA doesn’t mean the same as a pitcher from the Mathewson/Johnson era, or the Gibson/Koufax epoch. He was the kind of guy we look back and say, “Now there was a pitcher. Every year you knew he was going to be on the Indians, would have a decent to good year would probably be injury-free, just give him the ball and let him go.” Both as pitching coach and pitcher he was said to have “a camera in his head,” so adapt was he at picking up mechanical flaws and pitching flubs.
July 31, 1932: Cleveland plays its first game in new Municipal Stadium before a crowd in excess of 80,000 (paid attendance of 76,979), but Harder loses to the A’s Lefty Grove 1-0 on Cochrane’s RBI single.
It happened seven decades ago, on July 31, 1932, but Mel Harder still vividly remembers the two pitches that cost him the game he considers to have been “the biggest thrill of my baseball career.”
Bot were fast balls, the first to Max Bishop, the second to Mickey Cochrane, and both were made in the eighth inning of a game against the Philadelphia Athletics.
It was the first game ever played in the newly-completed Cleveland Municipal Stadium, and 80, 284 fans were on hand to see Harder, a 21-year old pitcher then in his third full season with the Indians, duel Lefty Grove, the Athletics’ ace.
Harder walked Bishop, leading off the eighth inning, on a 3-and-2 count.
“I thought it was a strike,” said Harder, “but Bishop had a reputation for having a good eye and the umpire- funny, I don’t remember who he was – gave Bishop the benefit of the doubt and called it ball four.”
The next batter, Mule Haas, sacrificed Bishop to second, and Cochrane singled for the only run of the game.
“It also was a fast ball that Cochrane hit,” said Harder. “It was inside, a pretty good pitch, but he got a hit so it couldn’t have been real good.”
“Cochrane hit the ball just to the left of the mound. I just missed it by about six inches. It went between our second baseman, Bill Cissell, and the bag. Cissell came close, but he missed it and the run scored.”
It was the only run of the game as Grove, who was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1947, shut out the Indians, 1-0.
“I wasn’t supposed to pitch that day, Wes Ferrell was,” said Harder. “But when Ferrell came to the park he said his arm was stiff so Peck (Manager Roger Peckinpaugh) tole me I would start.”
“It was a thrill, the biggest thrill of my baseball career to pitch in front of all those people in the first game in the Stadium. I would’ve liked to win, but I wan’t any more disappointed than any game I lost.”
“There weren’t any fences at the Stadium then and you had to hit a ball pretty good to get one over an outfielder’s head. Batter would hit a ball real hard and it would go deep, but usually it was just an out.”
“If an outfielder tried to cut off a ball hit in the gap and it got by him, it was a triple, maybe even an inside-the-park homer.”
The rest of the Indians’ lineup that day: Luke Sewell was Harder’s catcher, Eddie Morgan, first base; Cissell, second; Johnny Burnett, shortstop; Willie Karnm, third base; Joe Vosmik, left field, Earl Averill, center; and dick Porter, right.
Only two of the 50 players on those two teams are still alive. Harder and pitcher teammate Willis Hudlin. It’s also interesting to note that, in addition to Grove, three other Philadelphia players Harder faced in that inaugural game – Cochrane, Jimmie Foxx and Al Simmons, as well as Athletics owner/manager Connie Mack – are in the Hall of Fame.
Mack, a.k.a. “The Tall Tactician,” managed the A’s for 50 years from the time they entered the American League as a charter member in 1901 through 1950, led them to nine pennants, and was elected to the Hall of Fame in 1937. Cochrane entered with Grove in 1947, and Foxx in 1951.
May 16, 1933: Washington and Cleveland break a major-league record by using 11 pitchers in a 12-inning game won by the Senators 11-10. General Crowder is the eventual winner over Mel Harder. Washington’s Cecil Travis plays his first ML game and gets five hits.
June 18, 1933: Indians pitchers Oral Hildebrand and Mel Harder both toss shutouts against Boston to win 7-0 and 4-0.
July 10, 1934: The second annual All-Star Game produces Carl Hubbell’s amazing feat of striking out five future Hall of Famers in a row. Off to a shaky start with two on base in the first inning, Hubbell uses his screwball to fan Ruth, Gehrig, and Foxx. He adds Al Simmons and Joe Cronin to start the second. After three scoreless innings he leaves with the NL ahead 4-0. The AL rallies, scoring nine runs off Warneke, Mungo, and Dean, while Mel Harder pitches five shutout inning in relief of Red Ruffing to hold the lead. Frisch and Medwick hit HRs. Earl Averill’s three RBI are decisive for the AL 9-7 victory.
June 23, 1935: The league leading yanks (37-22) lose their 3rd in a row, dropping a 6-5 decision to the 2nd-place Indians. Rolfe’s error in the 8th allows the Tribe to tie and Lefty Gomez looses two wild pitches in a row in the 9th to allow Joe Vosmik to get to 3B. Ab Wright’s single brings home the winner. Mel harder, in relief in the 9th, wins his 11th.
July 31, 1935: Two AL pitchers each hit two HRs in a game. Wes Ferrell clouts a couple against Buck Newsom of the Browns and knocks in four runs in a 6-4 win for Boston. Mel Harder hits two for Cleveland but loses 6-4 to the White Sox. No other hurlers will hit 2 HRs this season.
July 31, 1936: Led by Lou Gehrig, who clouts his 33rd homer, the Yankees down the Indians, 11-7, at League Park. The loss snaps the Tribe’s five-game win streak, and leaves the Yankees eight ½ games ahead of Cleveland. Gehrig and Red Rolfe clout homes in the 5th to chase Mel Harder, but the Indians answer with three doubles by Earl Averill and a homer by Hal Trosky. Hadley, with relief from Johnny Murphy, hangs on for his 9th win
June 12, 1940: The fist place Red Sox club veteran Indian’s Pitcher Mel Harder for a 9-5 win, handing the Tribe their eighth loss in 13 games. Cleveland’s Ossie Vitt, in lifting Harder, snarls, “It’s about time you won one, the money you’re making.” The criticism, plus the same type of remarks made earlier about Feller, will prompt Harder to request a meeting with Cleveland owner Alva Bradley tomorrow morning in Cleveland.
One of the more bizarre episodes in Cleveland baseball history occurred in 1940. That season the Indians battled the Detroit Tigers and New York Yankees for the pennant. On July 31, the Tigers and Tribe were tied atop the standings. On August 21, Cleveland was 5 ½ games ahead of Detroit and the Yankees were in fourth place, nine games back. On September 1, Detroit had narrowed the lead to 2 ½ games and the Yanks were 4 ½ back. On the 7th, Detroit caught Cleveland and on the 9th they passed them as the Indians lost for the seventh time in eight games. At one point the Yankees crept within a half-game of the lead. As their lead dwindled, the Indians’ clubhouse was in disarray. Manager Ossie Vitt openly challenged the courage of his team, including Mel Harder. In one contest, Harder was removed after giving up several runs early. As Vitt took the ball from his pitcher, he complained that Harder wasn’t earning his money. Harder and Vitt exchanged verbal insults and the next day the veteran right-hander was in the front office complaining to team management that Vitt had lost control of the team. The Indians regrouped to win 13 of their last 20 games, even retaking first place for a few days. But a loss to Detroit on the last Friday of the season clinched the flag for the Bengals and ended the hopes for what became known as the “Cry Baby Indians.” Vitt was fired and never managed again.
Paris feel to the Germans in World Warr II on June 13, 1940, but the next morning the Cleveland Plain Dealer featured another story on Page One: The Indians rebellion against Manager Oscar Vitt.
It cost them the 1940 pennant, and earned a nickname they came to despise: “Cleveland Cry Babies.”
Vitt had lost the respect of the players, who felt the rebellion was necessary to keep their pennant hopes alive, Mel Harder said in a story published 24 years later.
According to Harder, “It was the way Vitt operated. He would pat you on the back one minute and criticize you behind your back the next. He was two-faced (and) and it finally got to some of the players.
“We had a good ball club – Bob Feller, Hal Trosky, Jeff Heath, Lou Boudreau, Ken Keltner and a lot more – and they thought we had a good chance to win the pennant. But they didn’t feel we could do it with Vitt managing.”
Though Trosky was called the “ring-leader” by Franklin Lewis in his 1949 history of the Indians, he didn’t attend the meeting in owner Alva Bradley’s office asking that Vitt be fired. Trosky’s mother had died and he’d gone home to Norway, Ia.
Others who also missed the meeting were Boudreau and Ray mack, who’d recently been called up from the minors; Roy (Beau) Bell, because he’d just been acquired in trade; and “one or two others, notably Roy Weatherly, (who) backed away from participation,” according to Lewis. “You’re either with us or against us,” Weatherly was told by his teammates, to which he reportedly told them, “Just count me out.”
Bradley listened to the complaints of the players, but took no action, other than to admonish the players. After the story of the rebellion got out, Bradley convinced the players to sign a statement in which they backed off from their request to get Vitt fired.
When the season ended, Bradley admitted he was wrong in not taking immediate action against Vitt. “We should have won the pennant… our real trouble started when a group of ten players came to my office (and) made four distinct charges against (Vitt) and asked for his dismissal,” Bradley wrote in a memo to the team’s directors.
Bradley’s memo, published in the Cleveland News in 1951, also said: “The four charges made against Vitt, on investigation I have made, were 100 per cent correct.”
Significant, too, was what Bradley told the players in their meeting with him: “If this story ever gets out, you’ll be ridiculed the rest of your life.” They certainly were the rest of that season.
On September 19, upon arriving by train in Detroit for a series with first place at stake, the Indians were greeted by 5,000 Tiger fans, many of them pushing baby carriages and shouting “Cry Babies!”
Exactly one week later the Tigers came to Cleveland for the final three games of the season. They trailed by two and needed to seep the series to win the pennant.
But they didn’t’ a rookie named Floyd Giebell beat Bob Feller, 2-0, on a home run by Rudy York in the openeder of the three-game series and it was all over.
Nine days after the season ended, Bradley fired Vitt, who never managed again.
August 26, 1940: Bob Feller rescues Mel Harder in the 7th and the Indians top the Senators, 4-3. Hal Trosky’s two-run homer off Dutch Leonard is the big blow for the Tribe. Cleveland leads the idle Tigers by three games.
May 10, 1944: Mel harder wins his 200th career game as Cleveland defeats the Red Sox 5-4. He is the 50th to reach this mark.
May 20, 1944: Mel Harder of the Indians and Paul Derringer of the Cubs both win their 201st career games. Derringer’s win comes at home, 3-2 over Boston’s Nate Andrews. At Philadelphia, Harder wins his, 5-0, allowing three hits and finishing in one hour and thirty seven minutes. Cy Young is on hand to watch the game.
May 25, 1944: On Mel Harder appreciation night in Cleveland, the Indians and Harder drop a 4-2 decision to the Senators. Mel tries harder scoring both of the Indian runs.
May 15, 1946: Mel Harder and Steve Gromek fire back to back shutouts over the A’s as Cleveland wins two, 3-0 and 5-0.
In 1961, Harder was elected by Cleveland’s baseball writers as the Indians’ “Man of the Year,” an honor that usually is won by a player.
September 30, 1962: With manager Mel McGaha fired for next season, Indians pitching coach Mel Harder guides the Tribe to a sweep of a twinbill of the Angels, winning 4-3 and 6-1. Harder, 1-0 last year, completes his managerial career at 3-0. Mel McGaha, a guard with the 1948-49 NY Knickerbockers of the BAA, didn’t play major league baseball, but will come back to manage the A’s in 1964-65.
July 22, 2001: At Cleveland, Bartolo Colon pitches the Tribe to a 6-3 win over the Tigers and pulls Cleveland within a game of Minnesota in the AL Central. Thome adds his AL-high 31st homer. Before the game, the Indians honor their Century 100, with 38 of their all-time greats on hand. Receiving the biggest applause is Rocky Colavito, Bob Feller, as well as 91-year-old great Mel Harder also receives a huge hand.
Obituary: October 20, 2002
Mel Harder, who won 223 games during a 20-year career with the Cleveland Indians and pitched against such greats as Babe Ruth and Joe DiMaggio, died Sunday. He was 93.
Harder died at his home in Chardon, about 25 miles east of Cleveland, at 3:30 a.m., according to his grandson, Dan Itschner.
Harder, who held DiMaggio hitless the day before the New York Yankees’ star started his 56-game hitting streak in 1941, was in failing health the past few years, and was hospitalized a year ago with pneumonia.
Harder appeared in four All-Star Games from 1934-37 and didn’t allow an earned run in 13 innings – a record that still stands. The right-hander won one game and saved two others.
“Mel Harder was a great pitcher,” the late Ted Williams told The Associated Press in a 2000 interview. “He had a great curveball, great control. And the thing about Mel was that everyone of his pitches did a little something. He was so tough.”
In his final years, Williams, a member of the Hall of Fame’s Veterans Committee, pushed for Harder’s induction. But Harder never made the Hall of Fame.
From 1928-47, he was one of the American League’s most consistent pitchers. Harder won 15 or more games eight times and had 20-win seasons in 1934 and 1935.
Harder was the only major leaguer to complete two separate 20-year careers – 20 as a pitcher and 22 as a coach. He coached for the Indians, Mets, Cubs, Reds and Royals before retiring in 1969.
“If Mel Harder couldn’t teach you a curveball, then no one could,” said Herb Score, the 1955 A.L. Rookie of the Year.
Harder’s No. 18 was retired by the Indians in 1990.
“Mel Harder and the Cleveland Indians are synonymous,” Indians spokesman Bob DiBiasio said. “Such a gracious gentleman who was always there for us when we came knocking on his door. It’s a sad day. We will miss Mel.”
DiMaggio, a .325 career hitter, batted just .180 against Harder. “I outguessed him all the time, I guess,” Harder recalled in a 2000 interview. “Even if I do say it, I had a pretty good curveball. But I had a natural sinker. I don’t know why, but when I threw it, boy, did it sink.”
In 2001, Harder made his last appearance at Jacobs Field when the Indians honored their 100 greatest players. Hall of Famer and former teammate Bob Feller pushed Harder to the mound in a wheelchair, where Harder received an ovation.
Afterward, other honorees such as Score, Luis Tiant, Sam McDowell, and Orel Hershiser listened to Harder’s every word.
“Babe tried to pull everything, so I kept the ball away from him,” Harder told them. “Lou Gehrig was much tougher. He would go the other way with a pitch. He’d hit my sinker to left and pull me if I pitched him tight.”
The Beemer, Nebraska native made it to the majors at age 19 in 1928 and had the longest playing career in Indians history. He pitched 3,426 innings, striking out 1,160 and had a career ERA of 3.80.
Only Feller had more wins with the Indians and only Hall of Famers Walter Johnson (Washington) and Ted Lyons (White Sox) pitched longer with one team.
Visitation will be at the Burr Funeral Home in Chardon on Thursday, Itschner said there will be a private ceremony this week.
1st Finest Set - 1981 Baseball Fleer Basic - Retired
1st Finest Set - 1981 Baseball Fleer Master - Retired
1st Finest Set - 1955 Baseball Golden Stamps - Cleveland Indians - Retired
1st Finest Set - Mel Harder Baseball Master - Active
Mel Harder Showcase Set - Active
#15 on Current Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
#23 on All Time Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
1st Finest Set - 1981 Baseball Fleer Master - Retired
1st Finest Set - 1955 Baseball Golden Stamps - Cleveland Indians - Retired
1st Finest Set - Mel Harder Baseball Master - Active
Mel Harder Showcase Set - Active
#15 on Current Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
#23 on All Time Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
0
Comments
CU turns its lonely eyes to you
What's the you say, Mrs Robinson
Vargha bucks have left and gone away?
hey hey hey
hey hey hey
my vote: Gil Hodges
Gil Hodges
Joe Jackson - did he make it?
<< <i> Joe Jackson - did he make it? >>
No, I don't believe anyone from the Black Sox is in there. That's much more controversial than Rose IMO, but based purely on stats Jackson and Cicotte have HOF #'s despite their early exits. They will never be in the HOF but Rose will.
Brian
bert blyeven
jack morris
pete rose
thurman munson
Never appeared in the post season as a player. (Mel Harder)
Did he not pitch for the 54 Indians?
He also was the Pitching Coach for the Indians during the 54 season when the Indians set the standard for most wins in a season until, I believe the New York Yankees surpassed the Tribe Record.
Dale
1st Finest Set - 1981 Baseball Fleer Master - Retired
1st Finest Set - 1955 Baseball Golden Stamps - Cleveland Indians - Retired
1st Finest Set - Mel Harder Baseball Master - Active
Mel Harder Showcase Set - Active
#15 on Current Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
#23 on All Time Set Registry - 1972 Topps Baseball - Retired
1) Riggs stephenson played 1921-34 had career BA of .336, and hit .378 in 2 World Series. Had no power, but neither did Ashburn (who is in the Hall & deserves to be enshrined)
2) Babe Herman played 1926-37 (+ in 1945) had career BA of .324 w/ 181 HR's
3) Charley "Jolly Chally" Grimm played from 1916-36 had a career ave of .290 and was a stellar manager for 19 years
All 3 seemed to be real close about 20 years ago, and are rarely mentioned today...jay
Website: http://www.qualitycards.com
Of course, I am going to say Pete Rose.
2- jim kaat
3- tommy john
4- jim rice
bill madlock??
And I too vote for Jim Rice. The fact that he was not a good interview should have no bearing on the vote. If I were King, the writers would no longer have the vote.
I do not think anybody that is not yet in and eligible would be a better than the average or even slightly below average Hall of Famer.
Goose Gossage
Bruce Sutter
Jim Rice
Dale Murphy
Jack Morris
Ryne Sandberg
Steve Garvey
Steve
Check his record, AND his minor role in the Black Sox scandal.
Jim Rice
and
Pepe Frias
JEB.
I can't stand Pete Rose and hope he has to sell his autographs on the street in Cooperstown forever waiting for the day that will never come.
Andre Dawson
Ryan Sandberg
Bert Blyleven
-Ian
Robert
Any high grade OPC Jim Palmer
High grade Redskins (pre 1980)
Pete Rose
Don Mattingly
Ron Santo
Jim Rice
Bert Blyleven
bobsbbcards SGC Registry Sets
When I was a kid, the Phils could be down by 6 runs going into the ninth, but everyone would hang around to see Richie hit one more time.
Mel was a great.
I've sat in his kitchen.
He's one of my heroes.
That said, I think there are a number of people not in with more compelling cases, several of whom have already been mentioned. My top pick amongst those is probably Blyleven.
Peter G.
Bert Blyleven
Jim Kaat
Shoeless Joe
I must respectfully disagree with:
Jack Morris (too mediocre during regular season, ERA way out of wack for his time)
Dale Murphy (not enough longevity)
Steve Garvey (Above average, not HOF material)
From the spring training home of the Twins and his current place of residence my vote is for Bert Blyleven.
The subject of his non-entry into the Hall is a sore subject in this area.
Keith
Joe Jackson
Lee Smith
Gil Hodges
Bert Blyleven
Now if only we could boot Reese, Rizzuto, O. Smith, Puckett and a few others out to make room. Reese made it because he welcomed Jackie Robinson. Rizzuto made it because Reese made it. Ozzie made it because he could do backflips. And Puckett made it because the writers felt sorry he had to retire early because of his eye.
The Hall of Fame loves good jumpers.
Lou Whitaker - Numbers almost identical to Joe Morgan, but was never kind to the media
Jack Morris - The winningest pitcher of the 80's, won a World Series ring with 3 different teams - a dominant pitcher
And yes, I am a biased Detroit Tigers fan!
Jim
Pete Browning
While you're at it, why don't you kick Koufax out? He only had 4 good years and retired early because of an injury.
Sandy
Now, just because I'm feeling a bit ornery I'm going to throw Ron Guidry out there for consideration. I know a lot of people don't like the numbers comparisons but as you can tell by my moniker it is in my nature. Ron had a career record of 170-91 with an ERA of 3.29 with a total of 323 starts (14 seasons total). Sandy Koufax had a career record of 165-87 with an ERA of 2.76 in 314 starts (12 seasons total). Ron had 1778 KO's, 633 BB, 2198 hits allowed in 2392 innings while Sandy had 2396 KO's, 817 walks, 1754 hits allowed in 2324 innings. Each player had a total of three 20-win seasons with Rons winningest coming in 1978 (25-3, 1.74 ERA) and Sandy's being his last year (27-9, 1.73 ERA). I'm not saying Ron deserves to be there or not but he did have a pretty notable career.
Adam
best arm in history
(last position player to win a game too
and i was there)
10 year stretch hit 350 home runs
had a sick number of outfield assists
from baseball ref.com
Gray Ink: Batting - 152 (81) (Average HOFer ~ 144)
6503 971 1730 283 21 374 1159 19 27 951 880 .266 .359 .489
Here are my thoughts re: Kirby Puckett. Great player - but not HOF great.
In terms of similar batters - a good list, but again, generally not HOF Great:
Similar Batters View in Pop-up
Don Mattingly (895)
Cecil Cooper (892)
Carl Furillo (874)
Bernie Williams (873)
Kiki Cuyler (872) *
Cesar Cedeno (870)
Minnie Minoso (868)
Tony Oliva (867)
Luis Gonzalez (863)
Joe Medwick (862) *
When I look at a HOFer - I try to look at dominance. If he was never the best at his position during those years - perhaps he was great - but not truly dominant.
Puckett played from 1984 to 1995:
1984: Dave Winfield was a better outfielder
1986: Tough - but Jesse Barfield was about equal, overall
1988: Jose Canseco and Dave Winfielder were a better outfielder
1990: Ellis Burks was an equal outfielder
1991: Ken Griffey Jr. was a better outfielder
1992: Ken Griffey Jr. was about equal
1993: Juan Gonzalez was a better outfielder
1994: Ken Griffey Jr. was a better outfielder
1995: Albert Belle was a better outfielder
My point being this: If you're not the best at your position for a couple of years - even if it is a short run of 2-3 years - then you're not a dominant player. A true All-Star, and an exceptionally good player, yes. But Hall of Fame worthy? Not in my eyes. He didn't play long enough to win the consistency/longevity vote. Sure- it was a medical condition that prevented him - but numerous players have dropped out of baseball for various health or other related issues. Two World Series Rings? Very good - but not great, again. Sure, he helped Game 6 in 1991 and all - but Morris in Game 7 overshadowed Puckett's accomplishment by a lot.
One of the best players of my generation growing up. But never THE best - and not dominant enough, and did not play long enough. A sympathy vote is the only thing that got him in, IMHO.
i know alot of people will disagree, but i also think Maris should be in there.. i dont care how many "quality" seasons he had..
What probably makes Puckett's selection is he did things that the voters tend to emphasize. He was an all-star in 10 seasons, he won 6 gold gloves, he hit .300 seven times with a lifetime average of .318. He had 200 hits 5 times. All of those stats are popular with the voters. Add in the fact that his Hall of Fame monitor score is 155 and you offset his lack of career stats.
While I agree with MS that he was never the best outfielder in a given season he would have been in the top three many times and the he very could have been the top Centerfielder in many seasons.
<< <i>While I agree with MS that he was never the best outfielder in a given season he would have been in the top three many times and the he very could have been the top Centerfielder in many seasons. >>
aro:
Overall, I probably agree with you. I think he probably deserves the HOF - I just thought he shouldn't have gotten there as quickly as he did. Sometimes when I read posts like these - I feel compelled to play Devil's advocate. There are many more marginal HOFers than him in Cooperstown - but that is a specious argument at best. In my mind, simply being a "good guy" counts for a lot - and for the time he was in baseball, Puckett always seemed like a good guy to me.
~ms
Santo = yes
Blyleven = yes
Gossage = no
POTD = 09/03/2003
Puckett is a tough one. I think he should be in there but I also agree he probably should have waited. I guess the writers gave him the benefit of the doubt for a couple of reasons. 1. Well liked by fans and media, 2. On pace for pretty good numbers. 3. Career cut short.
I don't think he would have cracked 3000 hits as he was 34 when he retired. He would have had to played another 4+ years at that pace to crack 3000. I don't think he would have been able to keep that up.
Being from Minnesota I think I'm pretty good about staying impartial. I think Blyleven should be in but don't think Oliva should make it.
I'm also glad to see nobody has mentioned Maris. I definitely don't think he should make it.
Bert Blyleven
Thurman Munson
Ron Santo
Pete Rose
In that order IMO.
Unfocused, impulsive collector of everything ...
Of the players he listed:
Don Mattingly (895)
Cecil Cooper (892)
Carl Furillo (874)
Bernie Williams (873)
Kiki Cuyler (872) *
Cesar Cedeno (870)
Minnie Minoso (868)
Tony Oliva (867)
Luis Gonzalez (863)
Joe Medwick (862) *
Puckett has the clear statistical advantage (averaging about 20 points higher in career BA) over all but Cuyler and Medwick, both of whom are already enshrined.
Puckett led the league in hits for 3 straight years from 1987 (207), 1988 (234) and 1989 (215). He came in 2nd in 1986 with 223 and led the league again in 1992 with 210. To me, that's pretty dominant. Sure, he never grabbed headlines like the big power hitters, but without a doubt, he was one of the very best players in the league when he played. He was the consummate team player and the engine that drove Minnesota to 2 world championships.
In the years he played, Al Kaline was never the most dominant outfielder in the AL, but is there any doubt he belongs in the Hall?
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