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Counterfeit Alert - Let's Discuss this with Regards to Trimmed Cards Also
Stone193
Posts: 24,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
<< <i>I apologize in advance for the length - but I think it's important. Also, so there is no misunderstanding, everyone here knows better than to buy Gem and Capitol graded - this discussion is about the amount of this crap around (and growing!) and an Update on Counterfeits for Raw purchasers >>
I know that a lot of people don’t get SCD and there was a great article on counterfeit cards in Gem and Capitol Grading holders – so I have taken the time to scan the items for you to have.
This is kind of like a “Counterfeit Detector” Krause update of sorts.
The article is by Rocky Landsverk and he has been starting to see a lot of Star Co graded cards by Gem. Also being seen are Kenner SLU cards in numbers that would not reflect reality – e.g. 1988 Stockton and Malone cards.
He spoke with the owner of Gem – Tim Lorber – I don’t have to tell you how he “spun” that one!
He lied, lied, lied! They never mentioned trimmed cards of course – it would be OT.
I am going to link – due to the size – the samples that were in SCD – which are self-explanatory about what to look for.
He further went on to say that there were sellers of counterfeit 63 Bazookas, W551 strips cards, W517 strip cards, 1947 Homogenized Bond Bread and 1952 Wheaties.
Now he didn’t mention Gem, as such, with respect to these – I don’t think it was theirs – I have seen over the past year+ Capitol graded in these areas. And in “perfect” condition!
I promise that you will be disappointed if you ever bought these! Now, like others, I have done a google search of CGS aka Capitol Grading and zero!
Sample of CGS:
And here’s a homogenized that I will “bet” is fake:
Sample links:
Sample #1
Sample #2
Sample #3
Sample #4
Sample #5
Sample #6
Sample #7
And last, here is a list of sellers they reported:
And finally on the the spin job by Lorber, he said his subsidiaries will refund any bad card but if not bought from him, return it to the seller. He also says he will not be responsible for Star Co cards graded!?!?
My thoughts:
I, for one, know that one of the bigger power sellers on ebay will tell the buyer “to take it up with Gem” – "we just sell them." So the buyer, in this case is caught in a “vicious circle.”
Also, if Gem put out a disclaimer about the authentication of Star cards which in essence renders them not liable – my question to them would be:
“why grade them in the first place?” PSA took the moral high road and will not grade them for this express reason, to my knowledge.
And on a trust level, I would be extremely incredulous with a company that only has a PO Box and no contact phone number for its customers. And lastly, why trust any grading company that also DIRECTLY sells its graded products.
thanx for viewing
mike
Mike 0
Comments
I wish SCD was as popular as it used to be!
Dal
<< <i>The farther you get away from the big 3, or 4 as some see it (PSA, SGC, GAI, and Beckett) the greater your chances of knowing what you are stepping in.... >>
Baseball
I don't want anyone to miss the point - if I were talking about these companies, as such, I would be singing to the choir.
This is more about the pervasiveness of this crap along with trimmed cards on ebay and what it is doing to the image of the hobby and attracting/maintaining collectors.
And also, for those interested in these cards RAW, it's nice to know what to look for, as an update.
mike
I still don't understand why these shady-ass grading companies aren't brought down on RICO charges; it's fairly obvious they have been in bed with counterfeiters and card doctors for a long time...
Brian
Suppose I have a $5 bill and try to alter it to look like a $20 bill; that's just as bad as if I took a blank piece of paper and forged a $20 bill. The first was originally worth something, while the latter nothing; but regardless, it's still the same crime.
Brian
Oh definitely - just in my view a company capable of consistently grading altered cards, I believe also has the "mentality" to possibly grade counterfeit cards. But in any event, I will never buy a Pro Graded card.
I agree, Brian - it's just a matter of time before you will see that whole thing on the nightly news just the same way our autograph "dirty laundry" was aired.
The guy from Gem - if properly investigated - could actually do time along with the people at Pro for fraud and conspiracy to committ fraud in some instances. But it's not like a big client is going to come forth and say: "hey, I made a deal to give them 1000 Griffey RC's trimmed for a specific grade...."
mike
I am all for competition amongst all businesses including grading companies. Competition in a free marketplace helps to ensure lower prices, faster service, and better quality. But a company such as Pro is a scourge on card collecting. It would be fantastic to see them out of business ASAP.
Steve