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coinkid855
Posts: 5,012 ✭✭✭
Ok guys, so I won a nice looking Morgan Dollar on eBay for $71. The shipping on the auction stated Priority Mail for $12, plus $10 for insurance. I wasn't going to bid because of this high rate, but then saw that the seller had answered a question about the shipping fees, reproduced here:
Q: Shipping really $12 USPS is $4.95 with .70 conformation. Insurance should be included right
A: I will ship to the winning bidder in any manner (and at any cost) they desire. Only actual shipping cost will be charged. Thanks, Pete
So this reassured me that I wouldn't have to pay $12 for shipping. So I send the seller a request for the invoice, mentioning that I would like it sent first class, which would be less than $5, insured. He then sends me an invoice for the full $12! This guy has a 100% feedback rating, so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback.
What do you guys think about the situation. Am I in the right?
-Paul
Q: Shipping really $12 USPS is $4.95 with .70 conformation. Insurance should be included right
A: I will ship to the winning bidder in any manner (and at any cost) they desire. Only actual shipping cost will be charged. Thanks, Pete
So this reassured me that I wouldn't have to pay $12 for shipping. So I send the seller a request for the invoice, mentioning that I would like it sent first class, which would be less than $5, insured. He then sends me an invoice for the full $12! This guy has a 100% feedback rating, so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback.
What do you guys think about the situation. Am I in the right?
-Paul
0
Comments
ask him what s/h should be so you can adjust payment
<< <i>Ok guys, so I won a nice looking Morgan Dollar on eBay for $71. The shipping on the auction stated Priority Mail for $12, plus $10 for insurance. I wasn't going to bid because of this high rate, but then saw that the seller had answered a question about the shipping fees, reproduced here:
Q: Shipping really $12 USPS is $4.95 with .70 conformation. Insurance should be included right
A: I will ship to the winning bidder in any manner (and at any cost) they desire. Only actual shipping cost will be charged. Thanks, Pete
So this reassured me that I wouldn't have to pay $12 for shipping. So I send the seller a request for the invoice, mentioning that I would like it sent first class, which would be less than $5, insured. He then sends me an invoice for the full $12! This guy has a 100% feedback rating, so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback.
What do you guys think about the situation. Am I in the right?
-Paul >>
You know what's silly, when people know they're right and they still ask!
<< <i>Give him the opportunity to correct the problem before making accusations. >>
I already did, as I mentioned the problem in the invoice request. Also, notice I didn't out the seller or even mention what date the Morgan was.
-Paul
via voice? Might just try that and be kind as I doubt it was intentional as he already said he'd
charge whatever the actual was. Then if he does not back off it's Katie bar the door!
bob
<< <i>
<< <i>Give him the opportunity to correct the problem before making accusations. >>
I already did, as I mentioned the problem in the invoice request. Also, notice I didn't out the seller or even mention what date the Morgan was.
-Paul >>
No, you made the request for lower shipping, as previously discussed with him through the Q&A, and only then did he make the error by sending the invoice with $12 shipping. You then made him aware of the error in a threatening manner and he has yet to respond.
"Seller trying to swindle me with an exorbitant shipping fee!" is not an accurate statement at this point.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
I don't like ultimatums or threats, especially from buyers emboldened by ebay's stupid feedback rules. There are more sensible ways to handle this. Think.
Lance.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
-Paul
He said that I could just pay for first class insured; however, he didn't send an updated invoice.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>Give him the opportunity to correct the problem before mak
ing accusations. >>
Damn Robb, I like your style.. We must have a beer sometime..
<< <i>eBay sucks. The seller has to offset his costs and he looks like the bad guy in this. For Pete's sake send him a hundred and tell him to get something to eat. He must be famished. >>
Send me a hundred and I will upgrade my collectors club level..
<< <i>eBay sucks. The seller has to offset his costs and he looks like the bad guy in this. For Pete's sake send him a hundred and tell him to get something to eat. He must be famished. >>
If I were the seller, I would try to back out of the deal and block you for a threat like that. Usually when someone jumps all over you like that, they are a problem and I'd rather not deal with them. I know that you are just trying to get him to honor his reply, but you can do damage to your own reputation if you are not careful (we don't want to see a post here about some guy going ballistic over shipping fees and he should be blocked
I'm not saying that the seller is right about their shipping fees, though. eBay allows you to calculate the shipping based on the weight, class and final value (for insurance) so there really isn't any excuse for inflated shipping (you can also add in a "handling charge" to cover your supplies if you desire). I assume that the seller was just lazy (or missed it) and didn't change the shipping from a different auction where they sold a higher valued coin.
I suggest that you try the nice approach first (assume that they made an honest mistake and give them a chance to correct it) and if that doesn't work then get a little firmer each time after that. This seems to work well for me and if the end result is that you get the right deal at the right price, I don't see it as being weak or being taken advantage of.
I'll be the first to admit that I have made mistakes (I've shipped the wrong item a few times). It was not intentional, and I corrected the problem by shipping the correct item at my expense and covering the cost of shipping the wrong item back to me.
Edit to add: If the above Supreme Court Nominee reference is too tacky for this forum, please advise
<< <i>" so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. "
Since when is the above statement considered a threat? If you don't honor your contract then I will be forced to sue you. What the heck is wrong with that? To me it says, I don't want to fight but if you don't do what you promised then you are forcing me to fight back. I don't take that as a threat in the least, it is direct, short and to the point, no bs. The buyer is bing honest, in that the seller is the one who is forcing the buyer to take a stance, albeit a negative one for the seller. >>
Again... we are talking $7 here. Honestly. I've learned in my life that, more often than not, if you treat people reasonably and with respect, and give them a break, they will more often than not return the favor.
<< <i> " so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. "
Since when is the above statement considered a threat? >>
eBay doesn't require anyone to leave feedback- it's entirely voluntary. If saying you're "forced" to do so isn't a threat, it's at least less than honest.
<< <i>
This was wrong making you wrong and opening yourself up to appearing as "negative" to the seller instead of someone he/she would like to deal with. A successful eBay transaction takes two people.
You should have asked a question regarding the shipping charge and quoting the response the seller put in the auction stating that you would like 1st Class shipping.
The name is LEE!
<< <i>" so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. "
Since when is the above statement considered a threat? If you don't honor your contract then I will be forced to sue you. What the heck is wrong with that? To me it says, I don't want to fight but if you don't do what you promised then you are forcing me to fight back. I don't take that as a threat in the least, it is direct, short and to the point, no bs. The buyer is bing honest, in that the seller is the one who is forcing the buyer to take a stance, albeit a negative one for the seller. >>
Threat: An expression of an intention to inflict pain, injury, evil, or punishment.
It is a threat by definition because of the expressed intention to punish the seller by leaving negative feedback. You may not take that as a threat, but others might. I'm suggesting that you negotiate first, then make a fight out of it if you must.
Just my opinion, I could be wrong!
The problem is you started with a very clear cut issue, he stated he would ship it at a lower rate in the listing and he should abide by that. When you threatened the neg now your case is less clear cut because he can argue it's feedback extortion and most people get defensive after they're threatened so saying that probably made it worse.
Maybe it would help if you sent another email, say something like "I shouldn't have said that before giving you a chance to fix it" and see if he fixes it.
I've bid on items before where the seller said they would combine shipping but ebays system wouldn't let them change the shipping to the reduced rate and the seller said "I can't change it but I'll put a $10 bill in with the coin" so it did work out.
Good luck
<< <i>" so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. " >>
...Well, some of you might not consider that a threat, but ebay does. It's called FEEDBACK EXTORTION and punishable by anything from a warning to having your account pulled depending on the nature of the infraction and whether it's a repeat offense. The OP should have contacted the seller himself, BEFORE bidding, to make everything crystal clear as to the exact cost. If I were the seller here, I'd forward your email with headers to ebay, along with a link to this thread calling me a swindler.
Edit to add: I'm not saying the charge wasn't high for the item; I just disagree with how you've handled the situation. If I am the seller this coin ships for $4.80 priority mail plus $2.25 for insurance (those are exact costs; we don't pad anything with "handling" charges).
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
So based on the inputs of the auction (e.g. shipping charges and winning bid), eBay sends out an invoice automatically after sombody wins an auction.
As a seller, if I agree to give somebody a better deal on shipping, I tell them to ignore the first invoice that they receive and I will send them one based on whatever the new shipping cost will be. Same goes when I ship internationally.
$12 for this item is high
However, in general, many people don't take into account the other charges that sellers must cover. In my listings, I remind people that the shipping fee I charges covers 1) The postage 2) Shipping materials (labels, envelopes, bubble wrap, packing peanuts, etc..) and 3) Time (time to print, pack, and drop-off)... if you only made $20 an hour and it takes you 10 mins to prep and drop-off a package, that's $3.33
<< <i>However, in general, many people don't take into account the other charges that sellers must cover. In my listings, I remind people that the shipping fee I charges covers 1) The postage 2) Shipping materials (labels, envelopes, bubble wrap, packing peanuts, etc..) and 3) Time (time to print, pack, and drop-off)... if you only made $20 an hour and it takes you 10 mins to prep and drop-off a package, that's $3.33. >>
You might want to think about changing your listings- eBay doesn't allow you to charge for your time:
Excessive Shipping Charges Policy
Charges not allowed in Shipping & Handling:
Fees related to Shipping & Handling: Gasoline, mileage, time spent at a carrier, time spent packaging the item, eBay and PayPal fees may not be added.
<< <i>
<< <i>" so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. " >>
...Well, some of you might not consider that a threat, but ebay does. It's called FEEDBACK EXTORTION and punishable by anything from a warning to having your account pulled depending on the nature of the infraction and whether it's a repeat offense. The OP should have contacted the seller himself, BEFORE bidding, to make everything crystal clear as to the exact cost. If I were the seller here, I'd forward your email with headers to ebay, along with a link to this thread calling me a swindler.
Edit to add: I'm not saying the charge wasn't high for the item; I just disagree with how you've handled the situation. If I am the seller this coin ships for $4.80 priority mail plus $2.25 for insurance (those are exact costs; we don't pad anything with "handling" charges). >>
I didn't need to contact the seller before, somebody had already asked the question, and it was posted to the auction.
Also, I think you guys have all missed an important fact in this case. I DID ask the seller for the lower shpping cost when I requested the invoice. Yet, the seller responded with an invoice with the full $12. In response to this, I sent him the following email:
<< <i>In a question in your auction, you said that only the actual shipping cost will be assessed. I asked you to send the coin first class. This would cost less than $5, insured. Even if you sent it Priority, insured, it would only be $8. If you don't want to lower your exorbitant shipping costs, I will pay your high rate, but you better be paying the $12 you say you will be for shipping, or I will not be leaving positive feedback. Thanks! >>
I would also like to point out that I didn't threaten him with negative feedback, but said I wouldn't be leaving a positive.
-Paul
<< <i>The threat in your response is well over the top, in my opinion, and should not have been issued. Have some patience, communicate a little more, be nicer and you may ultimately get the coin at a more user friendly shipping price with less angst. >>
Worst than that, the threat of negative feedback is a violation of ebay rules. You shot yourself in the foot. --Jerry
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>" so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. " >>
...Well, some of you might not consider that a threat, but ebay does. It's called FEEDBACK EXTORTION and punishable by anything from a warning to having your account pulled depending on the nature of the infraction and whether it's a repeat offense. The OP should have contacted the seller himself, BEFORE bidding, to make everything crystal clear as to the exact cost. If I were the seller here, I'd forward your email with headers to ebay, along with a link to this thread calling me a swindler.
Edit to add: I'm not saying the charge wasn't high for the item; I just disagree with how you've handled the situation. If I am the seller this coin ships for $4.80 priority mail plus $2.25 for insurance (those are exact costs; we don't pad anything with "handling" charges). >>
I didn't need to contact the seller before, somebody had already asked the question, and it was posted to the auction.
Also, I think you guys have all missed an important fact in this case. I DID ask the seller for the lower shpping cost when I requested the invoice. Yet, the seller responded with an invoice with the full $12. In response to this, I sent him the following email:
<< <i>In a question in your auction, you said that only the actual shipping cost will be assessed. I asked you to send the coin first class. This would cost less than $5, insured. Even if you sent it Priority, insured, it would only be $8. If you don't want to lower your exorbitant shipping costs, I will pay your high rate, but you better be paying the $12 you say you will be for shipping, or I will not be leaving positive feedback. Thanks! >>
I would also like to point out that I didn't threaten him with negative feedback, but said I wouldn't be leaving a positive.
-Paul >>
As I said earlier, you did not give the seller the opportunity to correct the error before you were rude and threatened him.
<< <i>eBay sucks. The seller has to offset his costs and he looks like the bad guy in this. For Pete's sake send him a hundred and tell him to get something to eat. He must be famished. >>
I am with you. $12 or $5 not gonna kill me.
Threatening a neg is a little strong for first communication.
It would be interesting to see how he responds to that.
Joe
<< <i>...I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. >>
Oops.
<< <i>
<< <i>However, in general, many people don't take into account the other charges that sellers must cover. In my listings, I remind people that the shipping fee I charges covers 1) The postage 2) Shipping materials (labels, envelopes, bubble wrap, packing peanuts, etc..) and 3) Time (time to print, pack, and drop-off)... if you only made $20 an hour and it takes you 10 mins to prep and drop-off a package, that's $3.33. >>
You might want to think about changing your listings- eBay doesn't allow you to charge for your time:
Excessive Shipping Charges Policy
Charges not allowed in Shipping & Handling:
Fees related to Shipping & Handling: Gasoline, mileage, time spent at a carrier, time spent packaging the item, eBay and PayPal fees may not be added. >>
I think every seller on Ebay should just send the item they sold to the buyer and GIVE them the shipping fee as a sign of gratitude, thanking you as the customer for being so vigilant to buy an item for less than its actual cost or value. This makes me as a person feel obligated to sell everything I have for pennies on the dollar and then spend MY TIME, MONEY, ENERGY,GAS, WEAR N TEAR ON MY VEHICLE, getting it to the PO as fast as I possibly can. Oh- if you happen to live in a country that requires customs documents to be filled out- well hell I'll just hop on a plane and drop it off at your door- why bother with all that paper.
Here is food for thought- DON'T BUY ANYTHING FROM EBAY.
<< <i>However, in general, many people don't take into account the other charges that sellers must cover. In my listings, I remind people that the shipping fee I charges covers 1) The postage 2) Shipping materials (labels, envelopes, bubble wrap, packing peanuts, etc..) and 3) Time (time to print, pack, and drop-off)... if you only made $20 an hour and it takes you 10 mins to prep and drop-off a package, that's $3.33 >>
I wonder how many customers you've lost with this policy?
<< <i>I suppose I could have been a tad bit nicer with my request, but I don't believe I was out of line. Hopefully he resolves the issue, and I would be happy to leave positive feedback.
-Paul >>
If he received it as you worded it in the original post, about the "forced to leave negative feedback" if he didn't lower the shipping costs, then I think you WERE out of line for an initial email.
You could have gone about it in much less threatening/antagonistic ways.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>I think every seller on Ebay should just send the item they sold to the buyer and GIVE them the shipping fee as a sign of gratitude, thanking you as the customer for being so vigilant to buy an item for less than its actual cost or value. >>
Actually, I disagree with eBay's opinion as to where the costs of shipping an item ought to be included. IMO, the price of the item is the price of the item only, and the cost to have it delivered (and everything that includes) belongs in the shipping charge.
But then again, eBay doesn't care what I think.
<< <i>
<< <i>I suppose I could have been a tad bit nicer with my request, but I don't believe I was out of line. Hopefully he resolves the issue, and I would be happy to leave positive feedback.
-Paul >>
If he received it as you worded it in the original post, about the "forced to leave negative feedback" if he didn't lower the shipping costs, then I think you WERE out of line for an initial email.
You could have gone about it in much less threatening/antagonistic ways. >>
Look up a few posts. This is exactly how I worded it:
<< <i>If you don't want to lower your exorbitant shipping costs, I will pay your high rate, but you better be paying the $12 you say you will be for shipping, or I will not be leaving positive feedback. >>
-Paul
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>" so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback. "
Since when is the above statement considered a threat? If you don't honor your contract then I will be forced to sue you. What the heck is wrong with that? To me it says, I don't want to fight but if you don't do what you promised then you are forcing me to fight back. I don't take that as a threat in the least, it is direct, short and to the point, no bs. The buyer is bing honest, in that the seller is the one who is forcing the buyer to take a stance, albeit a negative one for the seller. >>
Again... we are talking $7 here. Honestly. I've learned in my life that, more often than not, if you treat people reasonably and with respect, and give them a break, they will more often than not return the favor. >>
I love people who stand on principle to avoid using diplomacy. Makes crystal-clear sense to me.
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
And if he would have been sitting around watching Oprah?
<< <i>Ok guys, so I won a nice looking Morgan Dollar on eBay for $71. The shipping on the auction stated Priority Mail for $12, plus $10 for insurance. I wasn't going to bid because of this high rate, but then saw that the seller had answered a question about the shipping fees, reproduced here:
Q: Shipping really $12 USPS is $4.95 with .70 conformation. Insurance should be included right
A: I will ship to the winning bidder in any manner (and at any cost) they desire. Only actual shipping cost will be charged. Thanks, Pete
So this reassured me that I wouldn't have to pay $12 for shipping. So I send the seller a request for the invoice, mentioning that I would like it sent first class, which would be less than $5, insured. He then sends me an invoice for the full $12! This guy has a 100% feedback rating, so I sent him an email in which I told him if he wouldn't lower his shipping costs, I would be forced to leave negative feedback.
What do you guys think about the situation. Am I in the right?
-Paul >>
I bid and win , guy sends me the wrong coin .....then refuses to reimburse me my costs to ship the thing back to him !
takes all kinds ..........
<< <i>
<< <i>However, in general, many people don't take into account the other charges that sellers must cover. In my listings, I remind people that the shipping fee I charges covers 1) The postage 2) Shipping materials (labels, envelopes, bubble wrap, packing peanuts, etc..) and 3) Time (time to print, pack, and drop-off)... if you only made $20 an hour and it takes you 10 mins to prep and drop-off a package, that's $3.33. >>
You might want to think about changing your listings- eBay doesn't allow you to charge for your time:
Excessive Shipping Charges Policy
Charges not allowed in Shipping & Handling:
Fees related to Shipping & Handling: Gasoline, mileage, time spent at a carrier, time spent packaging the item, eBay and PayPal fees may not be added. >>
Well I guess I'll still have to remove that part (the time section). Thanks for pointing that out!
[q = "doh']I wonder how many customers you've lost with this policy? >>
Probably none. My shipping prices are well within reason, I would charge about $3.5 to ship the same item that this guy is charging $12 for.
I just got tired of people leaving me 4 stars on my shipping charges, so I put that blurb in my newer listings.
I just don't think that the majority of people think about all of the costs that are associated with shipping. They just think "well the post office only charges you $1.52 to ship it to me, you charged $3!"
If you don't want to lower your exorbitant shipping costs, I will pay your high rate, but you better be paying the $12 you say you will be for shipping, or I will not be leaving positive feedback. >>
OK, so you didn't threaten him with a "negative" per se... it doesn't matter. You still threatened him with a non positive FB (which means a neutral or a negative), unless things went your way. It's still feedback extortion and a clear violation of ebay's policy. You shouldn't have relied on a response made to someone else; you should have contacted him yourself before bidding to make sure everyone was on the same page as to the costs. That's Ebay 101. Sorry you can't accept it but you were wrong to threaten the seller. Period. End of story.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
Steve