Anyone have any information on the dealer who was robbed leaving the Dalton Show?

amwldcoin · August 30, 2016 8:06AM

Heard from a friend a little while ago a dealer stopped at a Gas Station. Filled up his car and then went to the bathroom. Came out and all his inventory was gone.

When are dealers going to learn?

CoinZip · August 30, 2016 10:49PM

Thomas Gintz ,owner, of A&E Coins in Dover,Ohio more info...

ricko · August 30, 2016 11:35PM

Unbelievable....time after time it happens, and still, we will likely read about it a couple more times this year.....yet the lesson is never learned. Cheers, RickO

BAJJERFAN · August 30, 2016 11:44PM

Is it fair to assume that all or most dealers will be followed after leaving a show?

JazzmanJAB · August 30, 2016 11:58PM

Originally posted by: BAJJERFAN
Is it fair to assume that all or most dealers will be followed after leaving a show?

It think it would be a good idea for traveling dealers to make this assumption.

Watch for someone following you, ie, make a "wrong turn" and see if anyone also made a wrong turn.

Otherwise,

Prepare for your trip home. Make a sandwich, put in a cooler with drink. If you have to go to the restroom, wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it. Don't stop anywhere. Pull in your garage and close the door.

ShadyDave · August 31, 2016 12:04AM

Originally posted by: JazzmanJAB

Originally posted by: BAJJERFAN

Is it fair to assume that all or most dealers will be followed after leaving a show?

If you have to go to the restroom, wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it. Don't stop anywhere. Pull in your garage and close the door.

That is kind of extreme....why not just pull into a police station, park and use their restroom? That should be safe enough...

bigjpst · August 31, 2016 12:48AM

Well there is no way I'm wearing depends. I do hit the bathroom before I leave any show and do my best to make sure I'm not followed, but on a 4 or 5 hour trip sometimes you gotta stop.

giorgio11 · August 31, 2016 1:13AM

Another learning is, don't try to do a major show by yourself. It's just not a good idea. I have done BRNA-Dalton for many years (until this year), and there is too much traffic even at the show to keep track of all your coins. Mrs. VDB was wonderful about always knowing how many coins we had out of the case at one time. Five was the maximum number between the two of us. And no, you can't reach into my case.

Also, it's not that hard to keep an eye on your rear-view mirror to see if there is one car that consistently stays with you, mile after mile. I'm not blaming the dealer at all, we all have unique situations. But these are just good ideas. Another one: Check your tire pressure before you leave. Malefactors have been known to let most of the air out of a tire or tires so that you have to pull off.

Stay safe out there.

Kind regards,

George

logger7 · August 31, 2016 1:25AM

Too bad qualified detectives or former law enforcement haven't set up stings to nail the crooks. It might take a while, but it would be satisfying if they nailed some crooks.

BAJJERFAN · August 31, 2016 1:51AM

Originally posted by: JazzmanJAB

Originally posted by: BAJJERFAN

Is it fair to assume that all or most dealers will be followed after leaving a show?

It think it would be a good idea for traveling dealers to make this assumption.

Watch for someone following you, ie, make a "wrong turn" and see if anyone also made a wrong turn.

Otherwise,

Prepare for your trip home. Make a sandwich, put in a cooler with drink. If you have to go to the restroom, wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it. Don't stop anywhere. Pull in your garage and close the door.

Prolly also fair to assume that whoever is doing the robbing is trying to avoid confrontation.

giorgio11 · August 31, 2016 1:57AM

Originally posted by: BAJJERFAN

Originally posted by: JazzmanJAB

Originally posted by: BAJJERFAN

Is it fair to assume that all or most dealers will be followed after leaving a show?

It think it would be a good idea for traveling dealers to make this assumption.

Watch for someone following you, ie, make a "wrong turn" and see if anyone also made a wrong turn.

Otherwise,

Prepare for your trip home. Make a sandwich, put in a cooler with drink. If you have to go to the restroom, wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it. Don't stop anywhere. Pull in your garage and close the door.

Prolly also fair to assume that whoever is doing the robbing is trying to avoid confrontation.

Yeah, er, rather than Depends, you can in a jam always use a couple of those empty plastic water bottles, that's as delicately as I can put it. Just plan ahead and take careful aim. And avoid

panexpoguy · August 31, 2016 2:15AM

I imagine that there must be video if this happened at a gas station.

WTCG · August 31, 2016 12:47PM

Unless you suffer from adult incontinence or are a crazed astronaut on a 900 mile drive to attack the other party in a love triangle, wearing an adult diaper at a coin show or on the drive home from a coin show is simply unfeasible. Use the restroom before leaving a show.

Jinx86 · August 31, 2016 1:31PM

Anyone use the option of a locking steel top pickup bed or half bed.

We used them on the farm and the ones they make now are quite nice.

So the inventory would be locked in the storage box in the truck bed.
Tailgate closed and locked.
They also make tonneau covers that are made to function like steel overhead doors.
Quite the nice barrier/deterrent and nothing about the pickup looks different.

thebeav · August 31, 2016 10:42PM

Originally posted by: WTCG
or are a crazed astronaut on a 900 mile drive to attack the other party in a love triangle, .

I wonder what ever happened to her ? Sure was a strange episode......

logger7 · August 31, 2016 10:47PM

An ANA or other hobby organization could step up to the plate and offer free devices or services for dealers who set up at shows and are considered at risk. I was once in that boat, with a huge spread of rare coins and pms in my cases, I realized it was a sucker proposition, got robbed of a few gold coins and was blamed by the infrequent and small show manager when I brought up the theft. I would have been glad to receive advice and help at that point but no one offered.

Numismatic crime should have competition in much better pros like private detectives offering their services. I know one detective who was totally unimpressed with the numismatic crime site. I got their broadcast on over 50 $500 bills that were stolen, with no serial numbers. Unbelievable.

Wabbit2313 · August 31, 2016 11:08PM

wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it.

If you can lose a dude following you long enough to take a pee, then you might as well just hand him your coins.

LanLord · August 31, 2016 11:17PM

Those of us old enough to remember the movie Semi Tough with Burt Reynolds, recall his solution for dealing with the EST meeting.

oih82w8 · August 31, 2016 11:21PM

Really sad that people still resort to the "get rich quick" tactics of theft.

Stay safe and vigilant out there everybody!

silverpop · August 31, 2016 11:44PM

gee

nothing like having a big neon arrow with a rob me on it pointing at one

and yet dealers still take chances and lose big time

sorry if I had high value coins they would be with a armored car service going to and from the show

yeah I know the price is high for such services but at least I have made myself a less likely target

DeepCoin · September 1, 2016 12:32AM

It seems to me that if I were a dealer, I would have a camera setup to watch my area in addition to logical safeguards such as a maximum number of coins out of the case, etc. The price of technology has come down so much, it would be a simple task to have surveillance over your selling area at a show. Hmmm, this might be a niche for someone to make some money helping dealers get started.

WillieBoyd2 · September 1, 2016 12:52AM

Re: the "Semi Tough" Burt Reynolds reference, look up "The Motorman's Friend".

fivecents · September 1, 2016 1:00AM

Scum bags followed the dealer 91 miles.

TomB · September 1, 2016 6:23AM

I don't generally divulge the measures that I take when attending shows, but the advice I will give here to all is plan, plan, plan and then plan some more when doing shows.

bolivarshagnasty · September 1, 2016 11:19AM

Originally posted by: silverpop

gee

nothing like having a big neon arrow with a rob me on it pointing at one

and yet dealers still take chances and lose big time

sorry if I had high value coins they would be with a armored car service going to and from the show

yeah I know the price is high for such services but at least I have made myself a less likely target

Gee, indeed.

keets · October 17, 2016 7:38AM

missed the thread but just saw it in GreySheet, my boss talked with Andy this weekend at a show. he's a guy we have been doing business with for awhile and a personal friend of my boss.

coindeuce · October 17, 2016 8:23AM

@keets said:
missed the thread but just saw it in GreySheet, my boss talked with Andy this weekend at a show. he's a guy we have been doing business with for awhile and a personal friend of my boss.

Andy who ? An earlier response stated that the victim's name is Thomas.

coindeuce · October 17, 2016 8:35AM

@Wabbit2313 said:
If you can lose a dude following you long enough to take a pee, then you might as well just hand him your coins.

BackroadJunkie · October 17, 2016 9:57AM

@JazzmanJAB said:

If you have to go to the restroom, wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it.

I actually have some of these in a small shtf bag in my car. (Well, before you laugh, you can get stuck on an expressway around here for a couple of days during the winter during a horrific snowstorm, which qualifies as a shtf event...)

Travel John (link to Amazon)

I admit I actually haven't tried one yet. I probably should before I actually have to use one...

LanLord · October 17, 2016 10:10AM

@BackroadJunkie said:

@JazzmanJAB said:

If you have to go to the restroom, wear a depends or similar, if you can't hold it.

I actually have some of these in a small shtf bag in my car. (Well, before you laugh, you can get stuck on an expressway around here for a couple of days during the winter during a horrific snowstorm, which qualifies as a shtf event...)

Travel John (link to Amazon)

I admit I actually haven't tried one yet. I probably should before I actually have to use one...

You just gotta do what Burt Reynolds did in Semi-Tough when he went to that EST meeting.
A big bottle strapped to your leg near the ankle, some surgical tubing to direct the flow, you got the trucker's buddy right there.

No need for depends, not that there's anything wrong with that!

Type2 · October 17, 2016 10:34AM

That sucks! EZ fix go with a partner man preferred if you need to stop your car or truck it will never be alone add a lock box you look in any dealers car and they toss it on there seats buy a van install some safes have on star on it so if they take the van or car you can track it or a camera system one up front and one in back that will record any one following you make it hard and they will pass it up. This can happen to any one even a buyer. I am having the cam's installed but for a deferent reason. I hope they get the perp.

PTVETTER · October 17, 2016 1:26PM

For those that are not dealers, it is easy to criticize. I for one sometimes travel alone, I have no other choice.
What I do is plan for stops at places where I feel safer at.
If you haven't walked in the shoes of a dealer you just don't know. And that is a fact.
I do agree that some dealers make errors in their travel because they have NO plans for there travel.

DRUNNER · October 17, 2016 1:55PM

Ladies and Gentlemen . . .

Also consider the highly likely probability of this scenario, currently playing out even in a few of our western small to mid-size shows. Perps case the show on a Friday, scoping out the dealers with a lot of gold or higher value coins, particularly if they are seemingly alone. They hang out, watch the parking lot on the first day and identify the vehicle. During arrival on Saturday, they place an easily obtained tracker under the bumper and wait until closing. As you drive away, they DON'T NEED to be close to you so you can 'watch them in your rearview' or do the 4 right turns, or any other supposed preventative measure. They are TRACKING you!

They wait until 80-100 miles pass so you feel 'safe' and then they latch on, waiting for the opportune moment. You have no idea at all they are there. Those bourse signs that say "Joe Blow -- Santa Clara, CA" are actually information to the perps . . . .they know where you are headed on your return and how far you have to go. If you are in SLC and are returning to Santa Clara . . .well . . . .

Yes . . . it is happening more than you know. Dealer buddy of mine -- just talked with him yesterday -- got hit for $70k that did not appear here on the Boards. He opted to keep it quiet. Long distance. Stopped to pee. 35 seconds and he parked in front of an establishment and had someone keeping an eye on the vehicle. Bam. Done. No way it was done without extensive tracking ability.

Be safe out there . . . . . much advice above is good, but many are missing the point.

Drunner

MonsterCoinz · October 17, 2016 2:11PM

Seems to me there is a simple solution: If you are a dealer driving home from a show, don't stop until you're home.

jesbroken · October 17, 2016 2:26PM

A bumper sticker might help. Just sayin'.
Jim

TomB · October 17, 2016 2:45PM

@BAJJERFAN said:
Is it fair to assume that all or most dealers will be followed after leaving a show?

I always assume I am followed when leaving a show, regardless of if traveling by car, by train or air.

TomB · October 17, 2016 2:47PM

@jesbroken said:
A bumper sticker might help. Just sayin'.
Jim

If you place a bumper sticker like that on your car then you are essentially placing a poster on your car that says "this is the car" in the event that you lose your followers in traffic. Bad idea.

opportunity · October 17, 2016 4:27PM

Have there ever been reports of simple bourse walkers being followed or straight up robbed in the parking lot of a show? It's always crossed my mind that someone could want my bag and what's in my pockets.

leothelyon · October 17, 2016 4:56PM

Cougar1978 · October 17, 2016 5:01PM

I think Drunner hit the nail on the head.

If your targeted these guys are very determined. I even had some guy possibly try to distract me on a plane to probably steal my briefcase in the overhead where carry on is stored. It did not work but the incident was too screwball just to be some coincidence. There are con people and all kind of shoplifting types at shows. The idea of a tracker is scary. I always try vary my routine, never leave the car when traveling alone, etc. One has to master going thru drive thrus, eating in the car while driving, etc. .

Coinosaurus · October 17, 2016 5:22PM

Using Brinks (or other service) to ship the coins to and from the show venue seems to be the gold standard. I suspect the dealers doing that get followed a lot less.

amwldcoin · October 17, 2016 7:29PM

@Coinosaurus said:
Using Brinks (or other service) to ship the coins to and from the show venue seems to be the gold standard. I suspect the dealers doing that get followed a lot less.

Hence you should accept the fact that they have to ask more for the coins they are selling!!!!!

ricko · October 18, 2016 6:23AM

Drunner has posted excellent information. There is much to be considered.... in fact, just because you arrive 'at home' after a show, does not mean you are safe....Cheers, RickO

panexpoguy · October 18, 2016 6:41AM

If you must eat due to the length of the trip, use a drive through. If you must get gas, stop only for gas at a station that has visible security cameras and fill up so that you are in the video. If you must take a biological break, find a gas station where you can park right in front of the doors and back in. Take a $10 bill from your wallet that you have cut in half so that one side is 60% of the bill and the other 40%. Go to the cashier and say 'I think someone has been following me on the highway, can you watch my car for two minutes while I hit the restroom and call the police?' Give them the smaller half of the bill and say 'If I get back and nothing has happened, you get the other half of this for your trouble.' You can even ask a random person walking out to stand by your car for two minutes. If they take off, they have nothing because their half of the bill is no longer negotiable, but since your half is larger than 50%, you can exchange it at the bank as damaged. If they comply with your request and you come back unrobbed give them the other part of the bill and your piece of mind was cheap for $10.

PTVETTER · October 18, 2016 4:04PM

There are ways to travel that are safer than others.
Those with training understand others should read what Col Ellsworth written !

Anyone have any information on the dealer who was robbed leaving the Dalton Show?

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