Can you guys help me understand what I’m missing here? (PCGS definition of “Spanish Colonial”)
MEJ7070
Posts: 373 ✭✭✭✭✭
Guys, I’m feeling very dumb this afternoon. I may be missing something completely obvious (wouldn’t be the first time), but I can’t figure out why some coins I’ve purchased over the passed few months seemingly arent eligible for inclusion into my PCGS “World coins circulating in Early America” set. I think I’ve shared all of these TVs before, and not trying to spam up the boards with the same coins…..just trying to provide some context.
Here’s the first, a coin I expected to add as the Spanish colonial pillar 2 reales. PCGS date parameters are 1732-1772. Bolivia and the Potosi mint were under Spanish colonial oversight. What am I missing?
1768 Bolivia 2 Reales (Potosi)
Another one that I thought would be my Spanish colonial portrait 4 reales. No dice. I don’t get it.
1813 Chile (Santiago) 4 reales
Finally, I thought this would serve as my Spanish colonial portrait 8 reales. PCGS says no gracias.
1810 Guatemala (NG) 8 reales 
By “Spanish colonial”, does PCGS mean “minted in Mexico”? I ask because the Spanish colonial coins that are currently in my set so far are all from Mo. My Mexican pillar 8 reales, pillar real, and pillar and portrait reals all went straight into the set with zero hiccups.
What am I missing? If I’m missing something completely ridiculous feel free to give me a good smack across the head! I have thick skin.
Appreciate you guys.
Comments
This was my first thought before I got to this part of your post. I'd expect some of the other mints aside from Mexico to have circulated in the colonies, but far fewer.
I think if you send a note to PCGS registry folks and ask them to add it, they'll do it. Albeit not quickly.
Most of the coins I collect are Spanish colonial. Very frequently I have to ask PCGS to add things to my sets. In fact, most sets I’ve had to request and I’m the only one collecting them on the registry. It’s important to understand that, especially regarding the set you have, there are probably thousands of items that could fit in those slots. I think they have to add ALL the PCGS numbers for every slot, so they don’t just have them all initially added, especially because most of the time it’s a waste of effort, they just put the most popular ones.
Just ask them, they’ll add your items.
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
Appreciate it guys.
Obviously the trail between Santiago or Potosi and say Richmond wasn’t exactly well worn. But I couldn’t find any fine print anywhere that stated the “Spanish colonial” coins for this set needed to be minted in Mexico.
As @WCC stated, I’m sure there were a multitude more Mexican minted portrait 8 reales floating around the US during the early 19th century than there were those from Nueva Guatemala, but I also have to believe that at least a few coins from all of the Central and South American mints must’ve eventually made their way into US circulation.
I’ll definitely reach out to @PCGS_SR about it. Thanks for the suggestions!
In terms of strictly milled Spanish Colonial Pillar coinage, 1732-72, most that you find evidence for having circulated here are indeed Mexico. However, some other mints would certainly have also.
But if the set is "Early America"...:
A] PLENTY of cob minors circulated here - are they included? Additionally, are peninsular Spain milled shield coins included?? The 2R "pistareen" was a workhorse coin in the Colonies, particularly Maryland and Virginia but elsewhere also.
B] "Early America" doesn't strictly mean pre-1776 13 Colonies... so it really SHOULD extend to portrait coinage, since we used that HEAVILY here from the 1770s WELL into the 1800s. If we talk about that, majority would still be Mexico, but there were actually PLENTY of Lima Portraits... also some Potosi, Guatemala, Santiago... truthfully haven't seen much evidence of Bogota circulating here but I'm sure a few... AND also Mexican branch mints.
Do you have a link to a rundown of what's included?
The Spanish Pistareen is definitely included. Cobs are not.
Portrait reales are definitely part of the set (1/2, 1, 2, 4, and 8), with date parameters extending to 1826, so the “early America” moniker is indeed a bit confusing. But based on those parameters my coins would certainly seem to qualify.
I think we can all agree that Spanish colonial coins from Mexico were much more likely to cross into “early America” thank those from deeper into Central/South America, but PCGS doesn’t delineate that in the set parameters anywhere that I can find.
I am very happy to own the coins I posted whether they’re included in this particular set or not. I’m not looking for any loopholes to climb the registry rankings or anything like that……..but I would love to complete the set one day with coins I love and all of these coins reach that standard for me.
Here is a link to the PCGS “World Coins circulating in Early America” set guidelines:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/multi-country-type-sets/multi-country-type-sets/world-coins-circulating-early-america-type-set-circulation-strikes-1575-1826/composition/6333
They will include Spanish cob coinage as long as it falls within the “correct” date range (1732-1772.)
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
I created that set on the PCGS set registry with the help of BJ Searls who managed the set registry at that time. Due to the complexity of the set and the breadth of what could be added, she tried her best to get the big groups automatically included but advised that we leave it to users to email the registry for inclusion for a host of others which were hard to manage on her end.
Latin American Collection
Great to know. Thanks for setting me straight about that!
A tip of the cap to you for doing that. It’s a cool set I’m excited to work on.
Great to know…..and I’ll definitely reach out to them.
Thanks a lot!
Here you can see I have several that aren't Mexico.
**This is just the Spain / Spanish Colonial portion