Discussion of strike (coins not unions)

Greeniejr · May 22, 2013 5:01AM

When I was at the Vegas show last week I had an interesting discussion with another younger dealer about the importance of strike when it comes to grading coins. The coin in question was a blast white 1891-O Morgan Dollar in MS65. Coin was original blast white and priced very fairly. My issue was that the coin was just really poorly struck. The breast feathers were essentially smooth to the chest. I have seen XF coins with more feather definition. Anyway, I ended up passing on the coin (which was subsequently bought by a popular dealer around here). It led to an interesting discussion about the importance of strike in determining the grade. Having learned grading from Tom (capthenway) I was always of the belief that a really poor strike restricts the top end of where a coin could grade. That seemed a little difficult to accept at first because by definition a coin has to be completely unblemished as made. A coin could be perfect as made but be weakly struck. However it does make sense that the coin should should be as it was intended to be made. The other dealer argued that the TPG don't really even look at strike anymore. Have things really changed that much that strike just doesn't matter?
I always go back to a story that Tom tells of a roll of 40-S Walkers that we had in the store. All the coins were pristine but were struck terribly. He spoke to one of the top graders ATS and he said that the absolute upper limit is MS64-5 for a coin so poorly struck.

crypto79 · May 22, 2013 5:10AM

In my opinion it shouldn't matter in the MS60-66 range on coins that are clearly UNC. In the lower grades the line between strike and wear becomes blurry much like the detail represented

In the superb GEM range there is so little the differentiates a 67-70 you almost have to count it to tell them apart. I almost find crudely made coins to be charming and like that it helps tell business strike coins from proofs (a line that can be blurry on seated lib coins). I think it help establish an identity for the branch mints that makes their coins look distinctive and who would want a C mint coin that looks like a P and it invokes a romantic vision of early days of our country and the not quite sorted out industrial revolution and mechanical processes.

All of that fluff said, the market grade of a coin is highly influenced by strike and with few exceptions, a poorly stuck coin is not worth as much as a well struck one even at the same listed grade.

hchcoin · May 22, 2013 5:17AM

I don't buy a lot of Morgan Dollars, but when I do, I always look at the breast feathers first. If they are weak, I generally pass. I am amazed at some of the graded morgans when I look at them from the breast feather perspective. Makes me scratch my head sometimes. The reason I look there first is because a coin dealer back in the 1970's told me that is where I should always start and if I really want a nice coin, don't buy ones with weak or rubbed breast feathers. I have used that advice my whole collecting career. It's amazing what sticks in your head as a young kid listening to a coin dealer talk. He was like a sports hero to me

Baley · May 22, 2013 5:34AM

I think strike is part of "the package" and agree that generally, for a coin to grade MS66 or higher, it must be fully struck, and for MS65 if it has a weak strike it should have compensating factors such as MS66 or better level of marks or luster or overall eye appeal.

messydesk · May 22, 2013 5:37AM

1891-O Morgans are generally pancakes, as are 1940-S Walkers, 1925-S Buffalos, 1945 Mercury dimes, 1953-S Franklins, etc. If one is looking for a well struck coin, it's best to avoid these issues. Mercs and Franklins have a market accepted strike designation that is added to the grade, but for those coins that don't, the numeric grade, which is directly correlated to the bottom line market grade (i.e., price), must allow for exceptionally well-struck coins for the date. If the best that a flat 40-S Walker can grade is 65, then the 100x premium for a 67 makes a lot of sense in comparison to the 6.5x premium over the same MS65 money that a 1939-S Walker gets, as the latter is typically well struck. The question then becomes one of which came first, the grade or the price.

Discussion of strike (coins not unions)

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