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Who bought what at the latest Heritage Auction?.I picked up a Territorial....Updated TV in post
coinsarefun
Posts: 21,664 ✭✭✭✭✭
Over the last few days I have seen some very nice coinage and exonumia.
Who bought what.....post your winnings.
I just can't wait until I get this in the mail.
1850-Dated California Gold Mines Token MS62 NGC. K-1, Low R.7
Don Kagin (page 373 of his classic reference) lists it as a $20 piece. He adds, "probably engraved by William Lemme of San Francisco. All known pieces are gold plated."
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.Crossed today at same grade. I even have my own CoinFacts page.........for now 
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
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Comments
Nice engraving. Was it struck in 1850? Territorials are definitely fun to collect, especially for those of us with a fascination of our country's Western Heritage.
So that is what bears do in the woods!
I did not even tune in this time around...I am trying to finish my capstone paper.
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore...
I bid on a couple coins, but will have none coming to me... On to the next auction!
Great piece! Congrats! I'm a huge fan of the dancing bears!
I placed a strong bid on the John J. Ford Jr. specimen during the Baltimore 2014 sale but it wasn't enough to win it. Hopefully I'll have another chance in the future.
The following from the description isn't necessarily correct: "All known pieces are gold plated." Ford also had a silvered specimen that sold for $2,760.00 in the Ford sale on 10/16/2007, Lot 3257.
The following is from "Private gold coinage of California, 1849-55, its history and its issues" by Edgar Holmes Adams which mentions a proof gilt specimen was sold in the Levick 1884 sale:
cool dancing bears, I like it!
While looking at Stef's and Ford's specimens, I just noticed that they use a different obverse die:
Very interesting and cool!
Hi Zoins,
I saw that one while researching it. Thanks for posting it as I never noticed the obverse is different on this
one and the others that I found and never noticed. I noticed the late die state but not the L, ground and denticles.
Very interesting, makes me wonder if my coin used an earlier or later die.
I do like this one compared to all the others I have been able to see so far as the strike is much better and less wear.
Didn't remember reading about a silvered copy, thanks for that too.
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
I'm curious about the dies as well. Many of the others I've run across have the "L" under the right bear.
Yours is a very nice specimen compared to many I've run across. Congrats again!
I thought prices were rather strong in this auction, having been blown out of the water in three out of the five lots that I bid.
I was able to add this one piece to my collection of Merriam medals, B-204. Nicest one I've seen for sale.
I also had to go after this "United Snakes of America" token:
It is a very rare piece, and I was happy for the opportunity to add it to my small collection of Bryan money.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
Unfortunately I was an underbidder on the one lot I had interest in this time around: a series of nine raw chopmarked Trade Dollars, all of them ex-Newman, including a nice 1873-P.
Very nice piece Stef.... I like the bears... reminds of a bear to bear conflict I witnessed at the Seattle zoo.... Your piece is in excellent condition... Cheers, RickO
I had my eye on a nice 1914D $2.50 Indian that was perfect for me. Got busy and forgot to bid, go figure.
Actually got one, a nice '45-D Walker PCGS graded MS-67. Got beat on the busts.
10-4,
My Instagram picturesErik
My registry sets
Did you pick up the one with or without the bean?
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
I had my eye on those 1882-S Morgans all in Rattlers. (11 of them). All were CAC, with two of them gold CAC.
They sold for $245 bucks per coin! Who was it that said CAC does not matter?
https://coins.ha.com/itm/morgan-dollars/11-piece-lot-of-1882-s-1-morgan-dollars-ms65-pcgs-2-gold-cac-9-cac-total-11-coins-/a/1252-4601.s?type=bidnotice-tracked-dailystatus
"Dancing Bears" is what we used to call the "get fit" class when I was active duty.
Still a dandy of a coin!
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore...
yup, i like it! cool pioneer piece.
I bought a new washer and dryer. At the next auction, it looks like I'm buying a new water heater.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
That is what I first thought! A spoof on the ferocity of the grizzly.
bob:)
The market seems very strong right now.
I was interested in HK-449 and HK-450, both of which sold at healthy levels. HK-449 went over double of the high estimate.
Under-bidder on the 1794 dollar.
I think she means creation of the original design of the piece not engraving, per se, as you are thinking.
Designers were also known as sculptor and engravers.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
I didn't get anything. I was interested in the 1839-C quarter eagle in PCGS AU-50, it sold for 40% over the "Coin Facts" retail number. The coin was in a old green label holder, but it didn't appear to be outstanding for the grade and had no CAC sticker. The color looked a little pale (dipped?), and there was a tiny lamination in the obverse field.
Once more, I'm still looking for the "down market" everybody talks about. Everything I bid upon goes for huge premiums whether I buy it or not. This time I didn't get past my $5 "placeholder bid."
I'm thinking about hiring myself out to those who consign coins to major auctions. All you need to do is to have me bid, with a just a small amount of interest in the item, and the prices realized goes way about the listed retail numbers.
Without. I found the strike lacking on the green bean coin for a 45-D, especially on the the reverse.
10-4,
My Instagram picturesErik
My registry sets
I like the strike on yours better, too. Yours also has nice luster.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Not a very exciting group of coins imo for solid next grade money across the board.... especially the 2 two golds with unexciting mottled toning. All it takes is 2 collectors/investors who "have to have them."
Bid on a three different Liberty Head quarter and half eagles but not strong enough...
I bought this... Have always wanted one. Will go in my collection of off-metals and double denominations.
PCGS AG3 No Date Buffalo Nickel struck on Cent.
https://coins.ha.com/itm/errors/no-date-buffalo-nickel-struck-on-a-cent-planchet-ag3-pcgs/a/1252-4863.s?ic2=mybidspage-lotlinks-12202013&tab=MyBids-101116
I hear you @BillJones - one lot in particular that was on my watch list has a PCGS guide value of $1350 - sold for $2702.50 including the BP.
I am the joker who paid $15,500.00 hammer for the 1898 PCGS PR67 CA CAC 50C.....Gorgeous coin. Who ran me up???
I bet that one is the 1781 North American token. It is on my watch list too. Though it only graded AU55, I felt that its surface is better than all three photos in Coinfacts.
Got a Colonial for my own box
Now that I've finally decided to put a date on it, I'm buying some coins for my own acct. There's a whole lot of selling and trading about to happen
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
Some good deals going on and there will be more coming, I just hope the funds hold up. I picked up 4 coins here is one I was working so could not spend to much time on line that day wish it was a sat..
Hoard the keys.
I sure am happy with the coin
Color is much brighter than Heritage pic's.......happy, happy/
Now to send it into PCGS for true views and into my collection
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
Congrats! Your pics look very nice. Love the detail on all the devices!
love it; rr have you even bought a coin in the last 10 years? you must comment eh? of course you never even look at the sale-there were a few really nice coins there. I bought that gorgeous 1899 pcgs pr66 toned half. in hand it just kncked me out (and my wallet too)
Not a very exciting group of coins imo for solid next grade money across the board.... especially the 2 two golds with unexciting mottled toning. All it takes is 2 collectors/investors who "have to have them."
In the other post you said you bought a PCGS 1898 PF67 CAM CAC half for $15K+ hammer. So did you buy a 1899 PR66 as well? As long as you're poking around again looking to stir up trouble....why is the PF67 CAM below that you just bought have hairlines, slide marks, and cuts all over the cheek? How do those look in person under 5X or 10X? 68 eye appeal and 64 cheek....not the norm for a 67 in my book...even if stickered...regardless of exceptional eye appeal. In the early days of the TPG's that coin would have graded at best PF65 and likely only PF64. I know, I had a flawless 1904 PF Barber half grade PF66 in 1988....today it's PF68....with similar eye appeal to your 1898. No facial hairlines were allowed on gem Barbers back then. Your 1898 is a good example of how that has changed. And at least the PF66 1899 CAC has a clean cheek in enlarged coin photos....though on the slab photo it does seem to show horiz slide marks too. Thanks for the education...after all, you're the expert with 3-8 years of experience in the post-CAC world.
https://coins.ha.com/itm/barber-half-dollars/half-dollars/1898-50c-pr67-cameo-pcgs-cac/a/1252-3797.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515
https://coins.ha.com/itm/barber-half-dollars/half-dollars/1899-50c-pr66-cameo-pcgs-cac/a/1252-3798.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515
lol!!! yes, I bought them both. before you open your trap-your an idiot-you never saw the coins in person. both coins upgraded. there are no lines on the 1898. i'll have someone bring it to show-do you even go to any?
images can distort things-the 1794 $1 in blue moon. kick butt coin. the marks on the face in person to not exist.
hey rr at least i bought coins this century and don't dwell on the past
We're dwelling on the present here. The Heritage enlarged photos clearly show slide marks and wipes in every direction. Yeah, bring it to my regional show in Willimantic, CT on March 26th and we can pass it around. There will be lots of top graders from the Northeast attending that show. Those photos are good enough that I'm 99.99% sure the coin has significant hairlines. We all know you're a firm believer in a photo tells us nothing....and no one can grade coins from photos, etc. (though numerous threads around here show just the opposite). Next time, don't poke around if you can't stand the criticism. If anyone else can look at those enlarged photos on that Heritage link above and not see what I'm talking about....I'll take it all back.
Have I bought coins in the past 10 years? That's back to March 2007. Probably several times the amount you spent. If you want the proof, show up my upcoming regional coin show and I'll plop a few hundred receipts in front of you..and a tax return. See you there.
hey rr genuis-the coins are now uprgaded.
dude i forgot more about coins then you will ever know.
wait so u mean ratner, carter, ryan, park attend your big show? if those birds-the real sharpies of the sharpest graders are there then i am in! so you are telling me the advice i get from these guys who make millions today from grading is wrong? one of them swore on both coins.
i can take it because you are a joke to me stuck in a time warp while spewing no so good advice all the time
like i said, look at the image of the 1794 blue moon dollar-then do see it in person. images lie and sometimes exaggerate things-like lines
Forget about those guys "swearing" on the coins. It's up to you to "know" what they are. That's what counts. A couple of those guys must be well into their 50's now. The eyes aren't as sharp as when they were "kids." I first met Jason Carter at a Balty show in the mid-1980s when he was starting out with Heritage. David Carr, PNG did our regional show every year before he passed away a couple years ago. One of the best eyes and trader/deal makers in the business...bar none. Bruce Kutcher PNG, Eric Streiner, Richard Moraturi are some of the better eyes that attend this show. No one had a better eye for getting upgrades in 1989 than Streiner. But, you knew that. And he could probably still do it today if he wanted to. They all made $Millions from grading too. Some were PCGS/NGC graders.
Eric isn't quite 50 yet so he still has young eyes. He's been at this show the last several years. Stop by, you might learn a thing or two. It's only a 75 dealer regional show. I didn't say it was big. You did....lol. It's a little show where some of the best graders in the Northeast come through. You know, from little towns like Boston and NYCity. I remember when Gorden Wrubel sometimes attended these shows when he was working for Bowers out of New Hampshire. I never considered dealers like Andy Seminario, Tom Caldwell, Tom Culhane, Dave Chermesino, Vin Blume, and others who have set up at or roamed that show to be "lightweights." You don't have to go to ANA or FUN shows to find guys that can compete at the highest levels. Too funny that you keep thinking that.
If you're relying on other people to get you "all-in," you're more a newb than I thought. I worked with the best graders over the years....including the past 10 yrs....lol. If the coin didn't pass my expectations, I passed or sent it back no matter how many "big boy" pats on the back it received. If you haven't bought and sold major coins consistently on "your own," you're just a pretender. Don't tell me how pretty and blasty your coins are, tell me why your PF67 proofs have slide marks on them. I assume you looked at the coins under 5X????
here we go again, 1989?? I am talking today-different market. striener does not deal in gem coins anymore. save for eric, no one you mentioned is a super star grader. carr (rip) was a nice guy with a good eye-not great eye. you keep thinking that they are.
i'm not going to waste my breath with you. you have no skin or ability in the game today. flame me all you want, i do know more then you and have had far more success then you ever will at grading.
also, it was gordy wrubel. get it right
Sorry Caddy if my 62 year old brain mixed up a couple names. It happens at this age. I've sold coins to Gordon while set up at shows, so I know his name. I had Dave Carr on the brain at the time. Disagree with your assessment on Carr and others performing at that level. If "superstar" grading is knowing what coin will probably upgrade after 5-20 attempts (and also what's helping to kill our market), then count me out.
Amazing that you think grading in 1989 offers nothing comparable to today's 2017 grading. You can bring back the retired stars from that era and they'd be forces to reckon with today, assuming their eyes are at least decent. Good luck with hairlined Barber halves....you'll need it. Start learning to stand on your own 2 feet rather than rely on your "team" of experts. Just the fact that you stated that proves you are not near as you good as you think. So please don't waste any more breath on all of us....unless you want more accurate critiques coming your way which I am more than happy to oblige.
Keep getting all the help you can from "superstar" graders as you seem to need it. Unfortunately, when it comes time to sell your coins, those guys won't be there to help you out....or even necessarily bid on them You're on your own then. That's when you need a superstar retail dealer. Superstar graders put high end coins into low end holders. Just be sure you aren't the recipient of their "wins."
Think of the logic of this. Superstar graders, of which their might only be a few dozen (to a 100?) in the world, push coins into their highest achievable holders if they are up-graders/crack out artists. Yet, the grade of that coin is only 60-75% repeatable at the TPGs if submitted raw each time. Yet, the market value of your coins is largely determined by the thoughts of the 99.99% of market players (including almost every collector and 95-99% or more of the dealers ) who aren't "superstar" graders. Hmmm.
Caddy was not fibbing. The 1898 PF67 CAM 50c did "upgrade" to a 67+ CAM. It's on CoinFacts. Though to an old dog like me, an upgrade is getting a 68, not a + which is handed out for coins with high eye appeal. It's clear this coin had eye appeal galore before. And + signs are showing up quite often these days. If a + turned a coin into pop 1 or 2 highest graded, I'd concede that as an "upgrade." CAC stickered the coin as a 67, not a 67+. The pops of this coin in 67/67+ before it upgraded were 6/3. Now it's 5/4 almost an even split. What's the + worth at that point? If another one pluses it would be 4/5. Now for the price guide numbers which will surprise.
PCGS PF 67/67+ price guide value is $8,000/$9,750. But it realized over $18,213 last month. Looks like a double premium for color....or....some "superstar" advisors were pushing this coin as a 68 upgrade. Who is gonna bid $18K unless the coin has a good shot for the $22K price guide number in 68? The only price CoinFacts lists at above $19,000 for ANY 1998 CAM is a PF68 CAM from over 10 yrs ago at $24,735. And the other PF68 CAM auction results range from $13,800-$18,800. So this coin getting a 67+ to be one of 4 with a couple PF68's higher doesn't seem like much of an "upgrade," especially when solid PF68 money was doled out. The highest price on CoinFacts for a PF68 no-CAM is under $11K. That's a big premium for the CAM when so many Barbers come that way. In fact the 68 DCAM auction histories are up in the $21K-$25K range. Only a single coin is higher at $32K, over 10 yrs ago. I think the superstar advisors might have messed up on the "upgrade" to 67+. Even price guide for a 67+ DCAM is only $17K. But, Caddyshack knew all that. If this coin had no marks on the face, it would be in a 68 holder, no doubt about it. Something is holding it back. Regardless, it was 68CAM money paid for a 67+ coin. Did any of your advisors split the risk with you? Did they take a fee? A simple 5% commish would push it over $19K.
Maybe the CAC pops bail this one out. Nope. For type the 66Cam/67Cam/68Cam numbers are 113/70/23. Not that big a spread from 66 to 67. You really need the 68 CAC to jump ahead of the crowd. The 1898 pops are even less impressive in 66C/67C/68C.....3/7/2. The PF67 is the most populous with stickers. Hey, it's not 1989, but what do I know?
I'm surely "out of touch" with today's market being an old dog with memories back to 1989. But the above is my simple analysis of Caddy's newp in March 2017. Indeed, it may be the prettiest 1898 proof CAM/DCAM Barber half out there....with some unfortunate slide marks. Yeah, "someone" ran him up. It only takes 2 believers in a PF68 grade to drive up the price. Maybe a superstar grader working for the other side..... or even the potted plant? Caddy was asking earlier if anyone knew who ran them up? If you don't know who your under-bidder is on a run up....you're no superstar...Mr. Caddyshack genius. You know what they say when playing poker and you don't know who the "mark" is.
Fun game. Let's do this show and tell again sometime soon.
rr: sorry to disappoint, you don't know me-I fly under the radar. i am a player to a degree.
it didn't take much to ruffle your feathers. i just wanted people to know your not a player today and a lot of what say holds no water. you mean well tho.
2009 was 8 years ago.. that is not today.
never slam a coin until you see it in person-ever
going on a family cruise now-won't miss ya!
Anyone else see the thick irony in Caddy's lastest postings concerning this PF67+ Barber half? They argued until blue in the face over the past couple of weeks that CAC in only 8 years has saved the coin market, in particular that CAC has saved collectors more money than the TPG's ever have over 30 yrs. It's clear they themselves lean heavily on CAC along with their own hand-selected team of "superstar" graders. They demand consumer protection in this market however it comes about. That's all well and good. So does Caddy walk their own talk? Nope.
When you go out and pay 2X the PCGS price guide for a + sign on a coin that is available in 67, 67+ and 68, where's the CAC protection? In short, there isn't any. And it's not like superb gem proof Barber halves are "rare" type coins. Loads of them were saved....pops keep rising. The prices for proof 67 Barbers are at best unchanged since Jan 1990 when they were listed at $19,250.....and that assumes you got at least a 1 pt upgrade along the way to a 68. CAC's bid is probably only 15-25% above the current wholesale market for PF67CAM Barber halves....not 50-100%. CAC's posted bid for this coin is probably in the $10K to $14K range.....not the $19K paid with commish. No CAC safety net on this one.
Maybe a few more submissions via your superstar graders/crack out artists can get that 68 done. If your under-bidder was also counting on that 68 grade....and now see it's only gone 67+, good luck with that. Glad to know you're a "player to some degree." Which means to me you have never participated at the highest levels on your skills....negating most of what you preach. No wonder you go under the radar. Hey, isn't that the exact same "principle" you've been trying to hammer me on for the past month? LOL. Consistency in the written word has never been one of your strong points. Have fun with your cruise. It will be a welcomed vacation for the forum too.
Did CAC decline to sticker or haven't they seen the coin again yet? I thought CAC ignored the + so it's interesting that it stickered at 67 and they would not do so at 67+ unless something happened to the coin.
Zoins, I didn't notice if it was currently stickered or not. Does CoinFacts even list stickers, because I don't see it on any of them. If I were PCGS I wouldn't want CAC cluttering up my Facts Pages. In any case CAC does claim they only sticker based on the number grade, not the +.
http://www.pcgscoinfacts.com/CoinImages.aspx?s=86545
One thing puzzling me on this coin are the "rail road" track marks that "appear" on the lower jaw curving down towards 5 o'clock. Could be on the holder too. It's just coincidental that they line up well with the reverse ribbon at around the "N" in UNUM. Clash marks aren't typically seen on Barber proofs. And those RR tracks are not very crisp and even like the ribbon should be. So maybe just on the holder. Then again, the CoinFacts photo is (or should be) of the 67+ coin taken out of the old plastic and rephotographed....or if it was already in the data base as a 67, just use the same old photo for the 67+? The Heritage 67 auction photo and the CoinFacts 67+ photo do look exactly alike. Caddyshack will clear it all up when they get back.
https://coins.ha.com/itm/barber-half-dollars/half-dollars/1898-50c-pr67-cameo-pcgs-cac/a/1252-3797.s?ic4=ListView-Thumbnail-071515
Ouch. And for those that say the market is soft. I think it is just particular.
https://coins.ha.com/itm/morgan-dollars/1880-s-1-ms67-pcgs-pcgs-population-2140-217-ngc-census-3220-284-cdn-725-whsle-bid-for-problem-free-ngc-pcgs-ms/a/1252-7775.s?ic2=mybidspage-lotlinks-12202013&tab=MyBids-101116