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How does CAC view PCGS MS + coins?



I'm putting together a shipment to CAC and I have an MS65 + Morgan I'm thinking of including. Is this a slam dunk for a bean or is this grade held to a higher standard.

Thanks for your input.
If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.

Comments

  • BroadstruckBroadstruck Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭
    CAC ignores the + and just sees it as a MS65.
    To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
  • brg5658brg5658 Posts: 2,384 ✭✭✭✭✭
    And, no, it's not a slam dunk. The technical standard that PCGS and NGC use for the "+" is not the same as the (black box) standard that CAC uses to (supposedly) determine A/B vs. C coins.
    -Brandon
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
    My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-



  • << <i>CAC ignores the + and just sees it as a MS65. >>



    This +1
  • stevebensteveben Posts: 4,595 ✭✭✭✭✭
    a very low percentage of coins get a plus. most likely your plus coins will green bean, or perhaps gold.
  • ShamikaShamika Posts: 18,759 ✭✭✭✭
    CAC ignores the +, but I suspect you're odds are good.

    Buyer and seller of vintage coin boards!
  • ShamikaShamika Posts: 18,759 ✭✭✭✭
    Do you have pictures?


    Buyer and seller of vintage coin boards!
  • DollarAfterDollarDollarAfterDollar Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I have yet to post a picture here. My files are always too big.............I dunno .
    If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.
  • CoinJunkieCoinJunkie Posts: 8,772 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>I have yet to post a picture here. My files are always too big.............I dunno . >>


    If you upload them to Photobucket they get scaled to a reasonable posting size automatically. FYI.
  • No its not a slam dunk for a bean. Although there are more CAC coins than + coins, a plus coin is not necessarily superior to a CAC coin. In actual fact there have been many + coins which have failed to receive the CAC sticker. John mentioned that some + coins are not very nice for the grade. Of course grading is subjective.
  • TONEDDOLLARSTONEDDOLLARS Posts: 2,928 ✭✭✭✭
    I have multiple + coins in my GSA collection, three of which have not received the green bean.
    one 66+ and two 65+.
  • brg5658brg5658 Posts: 2,384 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Remember folks, a "magical" CAC bean just means JA/CAC are willing to make a market/offer for the coin to sell on their coin trade exchanges.

    CAC doesn't grade coins, they approve coins. While they claim that they are separating the A/B coins from the C coins, those differentiations are based on CAC standards (which of course are not explained or described anywhere), not those of any actual grading service. A TPG can judge a coin technically "premium quality" for the grade by assigning a "+", but if it doesn't have the special look that CAC likes it can very well not sticker.
    -Brandon
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
    My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
    -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-

  • mercurydimeguymercurydimeguy Posts: 4,625 ✭✭✭✭
    As others have pointed out, the question of the OP is not really relevant because they view a coin at the assigned grade and whether or not they would want to own it.

    brg5658 said it correctly that a Green sticker means that JA would buy the coin at the assigned grade, and gold sticker means he would buy the coin at the next higher grade.

    As collectors, we try to extrapolate some hidden meanings but in practical terms there really aren't any...

    - JA has an "I want to buy A/B coins" mentality
    - Green stickers mean "I'll buy that coin at that grade"
    - Gold stickers mean "I'll buy that coin at the next higher grade"

    And since he only claims to buy A/B coins, from his point of view, 90% of the time there is agreement because he has a good eye. 10% of the time, there is a disagreement and we get into debates on these boards about "how can XYZ possibly happen"...yada yada image

    I don't know the percentages (literally made them up), but as a collector submitter to both PCGS and CAC, having made more than my fair share of coins at both services, I can say from my own experience that A/B coins get stickers 9 out of 10 times, with the rare exception of "I don't understand why that coin doesn't get a sticker"...usually is just as simple as JA not liking the coin as an A/B coin and he reserves that opinion. Green stickers purportedly represent his "buy" list so he can put whatever coin he wants on his buy list (he reserves that right).

    There is no "law" about what will or will not sticker image


  • << <i>As others have pointed out, the question of the OP is not really relevant because they view a coin at the assigned grade and whether or not they would want to own it.

    brg5658 said it correctly that a Green sticker means that JA would buy the coin at the assigned grade, and gold sticker means he would buy the coin at the next higher grade.

    As collectors, we try to extrapolate some hidden meanings but in practical terms there really aren't any...

    - JA has an "I want to buy A/B coins" mentality
    - Green stickers mean "I'll buy that coin at that grade"
    - Gold stickers mean "I'll buy that coin at the next higher grade"

    And since he only claims to buy A/B coins, from his point of view, 90% of the time there is agreement because he has a good eye. 10% of the time, there is a disagreement and we get into debates on these boards about "how can XYZ possibly happen"...yada yada image

    I don't know the percentages (literally made them up), but as a collector submitter to both PCGS and CAC, having made more than my fair share of coins at both services, I can say from my own experience that A/B coins get stickers 9 out of 10 times, with the rare exception of "I don't understand why that coin doesn't get a sticker"...usually is just as simple as JA not liking the coin as an A/B coin and he reserves that opinion. Green stickers purportedly represent his "buy" list so he can put whatever coin he wants on his buy list (he reserves that right).

    There is no "law" about what will or will not sticker image >>




    Well stated, I am always surprised by how many people don't get the above.
  • DollarAfterDollarDollarAfterDollar Posts: 3,214 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Thanks again for the well reasoned responses.
    If you do what you always did, you get what you always got.
  • orevilleoreville Posts: 11,771 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Furthermore, for only $12.50 you will find out if your coin stickers or not.

    If it does not, ask why it failed so you can then make an informed decision as to whether you should keep such coin.

    A Collectors Universe poster since 1997!
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 43,794 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'm thinking with the right eye since I see them with my left eye and I'm always a grade point off. image

    Simply put, I am sure CAC views PCGS MS + coins the same way they view NGC MS * coins. Not that either mean the same thing, just that the EYE will always view with the same objective look at the coin. That's my opinion but I believe the greatest of all graders, and collectors "SEE" coins this way.
  • drfishdrfish Posts: 931 ✭✭✭✭
    A + is definitely not a slam dunk for a CAC sticker. I have a PCGS 65+ Lincoln Commem with some rainbow toning that was declined. Not sure if JA disliked the grade or the toning, wish I had asked why.
  • leothelyonleothelyon Posts: 8,349 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Remember folks, a "magical" CAC bean just means JA/CAC are willing to make a market/offer for the coin to sell on their coin trade exchanges.

    CAC doesn't grade coins, they approve coins. While they claim that they are separating the A/B coins from the C coins, those differentiations are based on CAC standards (which of course are not explained or described anywhere), not those of any actual grading service. A TPG can judge a coin technically "premium quality" for the grade by assigning a "+", but if it doesn't have the special look that CAC likes it can very well not sticker. >>



    <CAC doesn't grade coins, they approve coins.>

    ..........for investments. This is starting to sound like an ingenious way to own coins without ever having to pay for them. Although the illusion is that somebody will..........eventually, that is. At least, they will stand a better chance than most coins. Is there a weekly bulletin or flier available of those coins receiving a CAC sticker?

    The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!

    My Jefferson Nickel Collection

  • lcoopielcoopie Posts: 8,691 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>A + is definitely not a slam dunk for a CAC sticker. I have a PCGS 65+ Lincoln Commem with some rainbow toning that was declined. Not sure if JA disliked the grade or the toning, wish I had asked why. >>



    Surprisingly you can call and he may remember your coin.
    LCoopie = Les

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